John Wick

Or ... turns out John had a twin brother this whole time, and now they're out for revenge!

Not gonna lie I kinda want some movies of John Wick's past, like his days as an assassin. Flesh out just WHY he's so feared.

Any prequel movie probably can't live up to the hype.

Since there are so many random assassins that John conveniently knows, and others who will conveniently spare him because of how cool they think he is.

Also he did something so henious that would probably tank any likability he have.

one thing he fight against a dude who kill his dog or blow up is home, seeing doing whatever he did to get out probably will make wick into a scumbag who deserve a bullet to the head.

The movies are fun because the people trying to kill John chose their path. His one "innocent" kill basically made the decision beforehand by slitting her wrists, so he put a bullet in her head just to confirm his side of the contract. He isn't slaughtering an entire rival mafia family.

I think the next movie is going to be the Osaka head's daughter trying to get revenge on Cain?

Here’s the trailer for the Continental series:

Excited for that as well as Ballerina. Also, the guy on the street plotting against the Continental is probably the young Bowery King. Outstanding.

I was catching up on the movies a few months ago and seeing the fourth in the theater after it'd been out for a few weeks.

Got an idea for another spin-off series of movies. Yack Fest is probably a better place for that though if I so desire.

If the franchise evolves past John Wick himself, what should we call it? The Continental, The High Table, or something less concrete?

I've called the setting the Table-verse before, I'd probably go with High Table.

I... really don't want this to become a franchise that isn't about Wick in some capacity, or that can be categorized without his name on it.

I really hope we're not going down the path of "from the world of John Wick, Mr Nobody, Cassian, etc"

Edited by FOFD on Aug 9th 2023 at 9:23:38 AM

Well the full title of the show is The Continental: From the World of John Wick. That seems pretty unavoidable at this point. There's bound to be other stories in this world regardless of whether or not a Chapter 5 is ever made and using John Wick's name in each one is the easiest and most marketable way to do that.

My idea for the record is about the Marquis (or rather the Marquises): the twelve enforcers who each represent a member of the High Table (and it'd take place after Chapter 4 too).

Edited by futuremoviewriter on Aug 10th 2023 at 1:39:51 AM

I hope John Wick lives.

Because I love all of the stories they've done but the movie ends with all of John's actions being All for Nothing.

Which IS an ending but just made it a Cosmic Temper Tantrum in the end rather than anything that helped the world.

I respect your desire for optimism, but consider that John Wick is a retired assassin in a world full of assassins and that none of his actions were to help the world. They were for self-preservation.

Like whether he killed the Marquis or not the point of Chapter 4 I think is that John is literally fighting the entire world - he had no goal beyond "I'll kill them, I'll kill them all" until Winston and the Marquis/the movie invented a new goal for him to conveniently get out of it.

Which I liked - Hiroyuki Sanada's character pointed out the futility of John's existence early in Ch 4. John Wick the man died when his wife died.

Edited by FOFD on Aug 14th 2023 at 9:59:09 AM

It's more I think John could have collapsed the High Table until someone wanted to make it a Zombie Franchise.

I don’t dislike that John died; it was pretty clear that he would eventually be overwhelmed by everything thrown at him at some point. But thematically, I don’t like how 4 chose to end his story, and felt that his arc left him on a better place at 3.

John Wick 4 is all about people telling him “John you suck now, your life is meaningless, you’re making everyone else’s lives worse, your life has no point since your wife died, there’s no hope of you getting a new meaning, you should’ve just died after she did” etc. Which just feels so cruel? It almost feels pro-suicide, and also disingenuous with what we’ve seen before. John found new meaning with Daisy, and with Dog the Very Good Boi (who noticeably barely appears in 4), so to say none of that matters rings false to me.

Chapter 3 centers on John concluding that it’s better for him to fight for his freedom than to give up and fight as someone’s slave. It’s not merely deciding to die, rather accepting whatever comes to him and choosing to face it head on. On top of instigating a rebellion against the High Table’s cruelty. The writers have talked about how they originally intended to end the story at 3, and thematically it was in my opinion a far better place to leave him. They were stymied by the execs from doing so, but I wish they hadn’t made the next one so mean-spirited as a result.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Aug 14th 2023 at 9:04:56 AM

I'm honestly hoping John's death, fake or otherwise, causes his legend to shift into a revolutionary war cry that causes a civil war to break out within the High Table itself.

Issue I have with John's death is the whole quest of Chapter 4 was to exploit a rule that would force the High Table to abandon their pursuit of John, and allow John to go back to living their life in peace. And while they technically succeeded in that goal, dying a couple minutes afterwards kinda makes it pointless.

I think its symbolic. John is finally free from a life of loneliness and violence. He literally "dies" on the stairs moments after killing the Marquis.

I viewed that as...the point? He couldn't actually live that life. Every single time after his wife dies that he has to choose between 'live a life of peace' and 'kill someone' he kills someone.

Yes, they almost always started it, but he couldn't do what any sane person would do and take his lumps and move on with his life. He built a temporary peace on a mound of bodies and then his solution to every problem thereafter was to look for someone to kill.

John Wick was fundamentally an incredibly dangerous broken man who was totally unwilling to attempt to heal himself after his wife's death. There was no happily ever after for him, because without this life...what would he even do? What would he even be, if he wasn't Baba Yaga?

ETA: I think either I'm losing it, or something weird is happening, as the comment I'm responding to is no longer there?

Edited by ECD on Aug 14th 2023 at 10:57:07 AM

There was always a particular absurdity to the John Wick world that was just barely kept in check in the first few films, and that was the mass of people who chose to fight John Wick despite the trail of bodies being left behind. After 3 there was no real place to take the story, the High Table has rules of succession and is too mythological where killing any of them is just more bodies on the ground. That's why 4 is basically the same story as 3 but bigger. The best option for Wick always laid in what can he accomplish before his battles catch up to him, as the entire franchise made it clear he cannot escape the violence.

Yeah I saw some comments disappear and reappear too. Odd.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Aug 14th 2023 at 11:02:16 AM

Beyond the first film, does he ever actually have that choice and make a choice?

There was a fundamental absurdity to the John Wick films that was barely kept in check, and that is the bodies left on the ground. He can't kill them all, the High Table has rules of succession and too mythological to be defeated through a killing spree. There was no real path to take after 3, so 4 is basically the same story as 3 but bigger and crazier. The point of the series is that there is no path to take where he will be left alone, so it becomes a matter of leaving a legacy before his battles finally end him. The movie does accomplish that, though it isn't especially strong.

Edit: yeah, I posted a comment and it didn't show up immediately, I rewrote my post and now it shows up.

Edited by EmeraldSource on Aug 14th 2023 at 11:49:07 AM

I honestly struggle to remember the plot of those films, but taking a quick look at the wiki summary, in 2 he chooses to kill someone in the Continental, which gets him excommunicated.

In the third film, he sets up a whole deal to get out from under that mountain of shit, then just...doesn't go through with it, refusing to kill Winston and save himself (though that may not have lead to a life of peace as it says he was also agreeing to live under the Table as part of that deal).

In the fourth film, I don't remember seeing any outs.

More broadly though, like three-quarters of the joke of the film is that everyone knows John and he knows everybody. He's already killed the Elder and one of the High Table members and presumably was a very rich man. He should be able to build his own organization, gain allies, do something constructive to oppose his enemies, but he never manages to do anything except kill who's in front of him. Because that's his skillset and that's who he is.

A killer.

The tragedy is he had one chance at peace and he gave it up and without a good voice in his ear, he never even seems to see the other chances.

Edited by ECD on Aug 14th 2023 at 11:51:13 AM