Line #5 YMMV/BambiII


1	* AlternativeCharacterInterpretation:
2	** Does Bambi realize the true fate of his mother? The midquel implies via a late night conversation between Bambi and his father that he doesn't even realize what really happened to her, and naively assumes that she's simply missing and resting elsewhere. Then again, going by an earlier scene where he quietly and solemnly asks "She's never coming back, is she?" to his father, it's possible that he ''does'' know and simply doesn't really comprehend what death is due to his young age. It's also possible that even after that fateful night, he's still clinging to ''some'' small hope that he'll see her again one day.
3	** A big source of why [[HateSink Ronno]] tends to get [[DracoInLeatherPants a lot of sympathetic portrayals in fanfiction]]. Is his bullying and fragile, haughty ego an end result of a FriendlessBackground preventing him from having a proper moral compass and social skills, and thus driving him to [[MilesGloriosus act like a braggart and do ambitious things just for attention]] or to get a leg up over [[PrivilegedRival his rival]], or is it the other way around, with his situation being caused entirely by having such a bad attitude in the first place?
4	** The Porcupine. Next to Ronno, he's the only animal who is outwardly disrespectful to Bambi. Initially, it seems like [[GrumpyOldMan he’s a grouchy old guy who yells at young animals for trespassing on his log]]. But when Bambi mentions his title as the young prince, the Porcupine [[{{Troll}} begins to act up even more]]. Is he just a cantankerous {{Jerkass}} or is he taking a stand against animals, who think they can do as they please, because they’re royalty? [[{{Hypocrite}} His rant about a lack of respect and his insulting the Great Prince]] seem to be good evidence.
5	* AntiClimaxBoss: Despite his expanded role in the story, and the build-up to it, Ronno's fight with Bambi is anything but spectacular. The latter actually manages to get the upper hand over him for most of it, and the fight technically ends in a draw after Ronno flees the scene due to the sudden arrival of Man (though Bambi is clearly the moral victor of it). It makes sense from a story standpoint, showing that Ronno is mostly all bark and no bite.
6	* SugarWiki/AwesomeArt: One of the things that is always praised about the midquel is its ambitious art direction and animation. The midquel had a surprisingly large budget for most DTV fare (enough to gain a theatrical release in several regions), resulting in animation and visuals that ''almost'' match the original, and are at least on par with the animation of Disney's '90s features. Having Creator/AndreasDeja supervise certainly helped.
7	* SugarWiki/AwesomeMusic: ''WesternAnimation/TheRescuersDownUnder'' veteran AwesomeMusic/BruceBroughton tries his very best to match the elegance of the first film's soundtrack in the {{Interquel}}, and largely succeeds. The {{Leitmotif}} that [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PSAsYPUuDY represents Bambi and the Great Prince's relationship is particularly moving]].
8	* BadassDecay: The Great Prince has been humanized and developed more as a character, turning into an initially reluctant but later loving (and sometimes even silly) father. While many fans see this as a good thing, it did cause him to lose much of that mysterious, quiet, serious, regal dignity and majesty he practically radiated in every one of his scenes in the first film, which many other fans see as a loss.
9	* BaseBreakingCharacter: Ronno. Depending on whom you ask, he's either a [[RoundedCharacter surprisingly fleshed-out]] and [[LoveToHate entertaining rival]] to Bambi whose presence helps to elevate the film's rather [[ClicheStorm by-the-numbers story]], or an unmemorable cookie-cutter kid bully who adds nothing of real value to the film and would have been better off removed.
10	* BrokenBase:
11	** As stated under FanDislikedExplanation, the more character-driven nature of the plot is particularly contentious. Many fans of the original believe it completely misses the point of it being an intentionally vague caricature of nature driven by ambiance, while others believe the more humanized character study format and WorldBuilding serves better than [[ItsTheSameNowItSucks retreading the same steps of the first film]] like so many of the other direct-to-video Disney sequels. In general, the preference depends on those who appreciate Bambi more as a film or a character respectively.
12	** The vocal pop songs. Some fans of the film love them, while others (including [[CreatorBacklash some of the film's production staff]]) feel that they're [[{{Narm}} cheesy]] and [[SoundtrackDissonance painfully out of place]] with the film's tone and the orchestral score.[[note]]The film initially used the entire score for the first film as temporary tracks, and the pop songs weren't added until much later in production.[[/note]]
13	* CantUnHearIt: Just try to read the original book or adaptations of the original Disney movie now without hearing Creator/PatrickStewart's take on the Great Prince in this movie. Same with Creator/AlexanderGould's take on Bambi.
14	* CatharsisFactor:
15	** When [[HateSink Ronno]] goads Bambi into a fight by [[KickTheDog insinuating the Great Prince was ashamed of him and "(gave) him away"]] (to a stepmother), and Bambi, who is at his lowest emotional point, [[RageBreakingPoint finally snaps]] and hands him his flank on a silver platter, did you honestly not feel more than gratified that he did?
16	** The climax involving the cute fawn-era Bambi [[TookALevelInBadass taking escalating levels in badass]] is oddly satisfying considering his (sometimes undeserved) legacy with {{Bambification}} and his MemeticLoser reputation.
17	* ClicheStorm: One of the main criticisms of the film is that the story is a rather by-the-numbers and [[SweetnessAversion overly sentimental]] take on the [[WellDoneSonGuy "Wayward son tries to earn the approval of his]] [[ParentsAsPeople stern, emotionally aloof parent]] [[ComingOfAgeStory by maturing]]" plot, a story thats been done before by [[WesternAnimation/AladdinAndTheKingOfThieves several]] [[WesternAnimation/{{Tarzan}} other]] [[WesternAnimation/AnExtremelyGoofyMovie Disney]] [[WesternAnimation/ChickenLittle works]][[note]]in fact, ''[[WesternAnimation/TheEmperorsNewGroove Kronk's New Groove]]'', which was released just a year before ''Bambi II'', had just such a plot as its conflict, albeit [[PlayedForLaughs presented in a more comical way]][[/note]] and way too many live action movies to count. Not helping this is the fact that, being a [[{{Interquel}} midquel]], a viewer would [[ForegoneConclusion already know how it's going to end]], so its events are seen by some as an ultimately [[MissionPackSequel superfluous addition to the original]]. The general idea of conflict being sprung by tension between the parent and their ward was [[WesternAnimation/TheLittleMermaidIIReturnToTheSea absolutely]] [[WesternAnimation/TheJungleBook2 nothing]] [[WesternAnimation/ReturnToNeverLand new]] [[WesternAnimation/AGoofyMovie for]] [[WesternAnimation/LadyAndTheTrampIIScampsAdventure direct-to-video]] Disney films, much less animated films in general, either. Even the film's most popular character, Ronno, is often seen as a rather standard bully character that's common to animated cartoons. While ''Bambi II'' is at least often praised for being one of Disney's more heartfelt examples in execution and balancing it with a few clever expansions on the original film, it still feels relatively more formulaic than [[ToughActToFollow the very unique flow of its predecessor.]]
18	* ContestedSequel: While it's near unanimously agreed that the first ''Bambi'' is a far bigger milestone in the Disney canon, some fans contest they prefer ''Bambi II'' story-wise due to its more uplifting tone and further fleshed-out characters. Others detest it for that very reason, deeming it a more childish ClicheStorm compared to the more nuanced and artistic direction of the first film. It is at least often regarded as one of ''Disney Toon Studios''' most earnest attempts at a follow-up film, though whether that is saying much is also up for debate.
19	* CrackShip:
20	** There are fans who ship young Ronno and Faline together, even though the two don't interact much in-canon and what little interaction there is shows that Faline is at ''most'' grudgingly tolerant of Ronno's presence, and at worst is outright repulsed by him (to say nothing of him trying to ''rape'' her when they're fully grown).
21	** [[FoeYayShipping Shipping young Bambi and Ronno together]] is a surprisingly popular fan pairing, even though it makes no sense whatsoever due to the two hating each other's guts by the end, with Ronno in particular having nothing but [[ArchEnemy absolute contempt for his rival]].
22	* DracoInLeatherPants: Due to his significantly expanded character, [[TheBully Ronno]] tends to get portrayed a lot more sympathetically (sometimes being turned into a JerkassWoobie or AntiHero) in fanfiction than he is in the movie, where he's an [[HateSink unsympathetic bully]] who only got worse as he got older.
23	* EnsembleDarkhorse: Next to the Great Prince, this movie's portrayal of Ronno as a fawn is probably the most popular (if [[BaseBreakingCharacter divisive]]) part of the film, and has spawned a fairly large amount of fanart and fanfiction.
24	* FanficFuel: ''Bambi II'' caused a lot of attraction towards the franchise in this regard, since while it filled in some (but not all) missing pieces in the original storyline, it also made the previously vague work much more character driven, leaving broader archetypes and relationships for fan writers to play around with (particularly regarding [[BrokenBird Bambi]] and his relationships with [[BrokenAce his father]] and [[TheRival Ronno]]).
25	* FanDislikedExplanation: Most detractors of ''Bambi II'' criticize the film's more thorough CharacterDevelopment of the cast (especially of [[BrokenAce the Great Prince]] and [[AlwaysSecondBest Ronno]]), arguing that it misses the entire point of the first film, which was primarily a nuanced environmental perspective piece with sparse dialogue and elements and characters [[TheyPlottedAPerfectlyGoodWaste intentionally left ambiguous and vague]]. On the other hand, the broader characterizations have won some fans, with some of them believing it to be an improvement on the original.
26	* FauxSymbolism: It was revealed in the "Making of ''Bambi II''" that the butterflies seen in Bambi's dream sequence and at the end of the movie are meant to symbolize Bambi's love for his mother in the former and his father in the latter. [[SugarWiki/HeartwarmingMoments D'awww.]]
27	* FoeYayShipping: It's fairly popular in fanart and fanfics to ship Bambi and Ronno together, even though the two get along like a forest on fire in the movies.
28	* HeartwarmingInHindsight: Since the late '80s, Creator/PatrickStewart had wanted a role in a Disney animated film, but other projects kept getting in the way. He ended up voicing a character from one of Disney's most iconic franchises.
29	** Remember how [[Series/StarTrekTheNextGeneration Captain]] [[StiffUpperLip Picard]] had trouble dealing with kids? Not so much this time!
30	* HilariousInHindsight: In 2002, Series/SaturdayNightLive TV Funhouse lampooned Disney's infamous direct to video sequels by having a skit about "Bambi 2002". Fast forward to 2006, and Disney would release a direct to video Bambi follow up (albeit a midquel, not a sequel). In a later skit, they acknowledged the midquel along with their Bambi 2002;
31	-->"Bambi II is going into the Disney Vault. After just 70 days on sale, the glorious Bambi II goes into the Disney Vault for 10 years along with Cinderella II, [[CallBack Bambi 2002]], Sleeping Beauty III: Lil' Sleepy Meets Aladdin, Hunchback VI: Air Dog Quasi, Mulan VIII: The Prozoids Strike Back, Jungle Book 3.0: Jungle Blog, and [[BreadEggsMilkSquick 101 Felations]]."
32	* JerkassWoobie: The Great Prince. He genuinely wants what is best for his son, but unfortunately, his aloof, disaffectionate nature and insistence on tradition unintentionally leads him to be emotionally rejecting toward Bambi at first. Being pained by the death of his mate helps matters even less.
33	* JustHereForGodzilla: Even those who didn't like the Interquel will admit enjoyment in hearing Creator/PatrickStewart's portrayal of The Great Prince.
34	* LikeYouWouldReallyDoIt: Bambi's DisneyDeath in an interquel to a wildly successful movie. 'Nuff said (however, the scene may be a TearJerker while it lasts, at least in-context, due to the Great Prince's genuinely heartbreaking reaction to it).
35	* LoveToHate: The films take on Ronno gets this reaction from fans. He's an obnoxious jackass at ''best'' and a throughly despicable sociopath in the making by the end of it. But he's also considered by some viewers to be a surprisingly well-rounded and entertaining take on the bully-type character, and he's just so unlucky and pitiful, that you can't help but love him regardless.
36	* MemeticMutation:
37	** The shot where Bambi attempts to roar (making a bleat instead) is a fairly popular video to use for editing in different sound effects over Bambi's bleating, such as Franchise/{{Godzilla}}'s roar or another character swearing.
38	** "A prince does ''not'' 'woo-hoo'."[[labelnote:explanation]]The Great Prince chiding Bambi early on when he gets excited about tagging along with him to look after the herd. This is the ''Great Prince'', a generally stoic and no-nonsense authority figure, [[TheComicallySerious saying this completely straight-faced]]. Patrick Stewart's voice acting takes what would otherwise be an incredibly ridiculous line regardless of context and [[NarmCharm pulls it off with complete conviction]], making it one of the funniest lines in the movie.[[/labelnote]]
39	* {{Narm}}:
40	** The movie's DownerBeginning, which depicts a retelling of the Great Prince telling Bambi about his mother, falls into this category for one reason. Bambi calling for his mother is heard offscreen, and we get a bird’s eye view of the two deer facing each other. The way it’s shot inadvertently gives the implication that Bambi didn’t realise the Great Prince was right in front of him. He was calling for his mother without noticing his father.
41	** During the otherwise [[NightmareFuel very tense deer call scene]], when the Great Prince screams "Run Bambi!" after seeing the glint on a hunter's rifle, his mouth movement is briefly but noticably [[OffModel exaggerated to downright cartoonish, ridiculous looking proportions]] that look more at home on a ''WesternAnimation/LooneyTunes'' character than someone as serious and naturalistically animated as him.
42	** The film treats Mena being trapped by Man (via a leg snare) as a serious situation due to the looming threat of Man's hounds coming her and the fawns way. After Bambi distracts the dogs, cue the Great Prince [[BigDamnHeroes showing up and]]...[[MundaneSolution biting the rope hard enough to snap it]], which is something Mena [[IdiotBall should have easily been able to do herself]] and save both her ''and'' Bambi a lot of trouble.
43	** Bambi's DisneyDeath at the end is so painfully forced and clichéd, it's very difficult to take it seriously, especially since you'd know from the ending of the first film that, [[ForegoneConclusion no, he's not really going to die.]] Making matters worse is that the editing and staging unintentionally gives the impression that Bambi didn't fall ''that'' far, making it seem like the Great Prince was seriously overreacting to the whole thing.
44	* NarmCharm:
45	** The one thing that salvages the above scene is the Great Prince's [[TearJerker genuinely heartwrenching]] reaction to it (sure, the ''audience'' knows Bambi is going to live, but the Prince doesn't) and him and his son finally bonding for good after Bambi reveals he survived.
46	** The birds' "MAAAANNN" crow is rather cheesy in concept, but the voice distortion making it sound like a proper bird call gives it a genuinely creepy touch.
47	** Creator/PatrickStewart manages to play the Prince's most ridiculous lines [[TheComicallySerious dead seriously]].
48	--->'''Prince:''' A prince does not, "whoo hoo."
49	* OlderThanTheyThink:
50	** Elements of the midquel that seem like new additions to the series, such as further humanizing the characters, were already present not only in older spin-off materials of the film (e.g. the many Dell comics and storybooks starring the characters and Osamu Tezuka's manga adaptation), but even in Felix Salten's own sequel to the original novel, ''Bambi's Children''.
51	** Also, while the story is mostly original, a lot of scenes serve as {{Mythology Gag}}s to the original novels and Disney tie-in material as well. Both the deer call scene and the younger animals' incidents with an ornery porcupine are loosely based on moments from the novels, while the AnnoyingYoungerSibling characterisation of Thumper's sisters first appeared in Disney storybooks.
52	** Many viewers think that Ronno is a CanonForeigner. They don't recognize him as the buck that Bambi fought in the original film, namely due to a slightly different colour palette and the fact he was voiceless and nameless in the original. Also, this was ''not'' Ronno's first appearance as a fawn; that would be in Osamu Tezuka's manga adaptation of ''Bambi'', which predates the midquel by several decades.
53	** The midquel seemingly {{retcon}}s the events of the original film by having the spring where Bambi is a yearling take place at least another year after his mother's death instead of the spring immediately thereafter. But the newspaper comic adaptation clarifies that this was always intended to be the case with the first film, pointing out that the later part of it did, in fact, take place over a year after that fateful winter.
54	* PopularWithFurries: Ronno and the Great Prince. Bambi himself also has quite a number of fans due to his more fleshed out characterisation.
55	* RetroactiveRecognition:
56	** The singer who performs the cut song “Sing the Day” is Anika Noni Rose, who three years later would voice Tiana in ''WesternAnimation/ThePrincessAndTheFrog''.
57	** Creator/ArielWinter provided the voices for one of Thumper's sisters, she would later become best-known as the voice of Sofia in Creator/DisneyJunior's ''WesternAnimation/SofiaTheFirst''.
58	** Flower is voiced by Nicky Jones, later to be known for voicing WesternAnimation/{{Chowder}}.
59	* SalvagedStory: While few were ''demanding'' a midquel for ''{{WesternAnimation/Bambi}}'', many think that this movie at the very least works well smoothing out the transition between the death of Bambi's mother and [[MoodWhiplash birds singing happy little spring songs]] in the first film.
60	* SignatureScene:
61	** The Deer Call scene tends to be the most remembered part of the film due to its downright eerie atmosphere and surprisingly tense tone.
62	** The scene with Bambi's pathetic attempt at roaring, due to it being a somewhat popular meme.
63	* SoOkayItsAverage: While ''Bambi II'' is considered among the better Disney sequels, few consider it to be as good as the original, and it is usually seen as average at best. Generally, the animation and premise are often praised, but on the whole, people consider it to lack the artistic ambition of the original, being a more formulaic Disney story, with tweaks like the altered characterisations, larger reliance on dialogue, and contemporary pop songs being very divisive. In short, you'll be hard pressed to find anyone who truly loves ''or'' hates this film.
64	* SpecialEffectFailure: Late in the film, in a scene shortly before Friend Owl introduces Bambi to Mena, [[https://c8.alamy.com/comp/BPPK8P/bambi-father-bambi-ii-bambi-2-bambi-and-the-great-prince-of-the-forest-BPPK8P.jpg there's a shot]] where Bambi freezes alert in front of the Prince when he senses danger (who is just doing it to mess with Bambi) but the large size of Bambi's drawing combined with the even perspective of the background ruins the forced perspective and unintentionally gives the impression that Bambi suddenly grew to a size even larger than his dad!
65	* SweetnessAversion: While the first ''Bambi'' was infamously cloying, it was partially down to the MandelaEffect, with the film relying on more subtle imagery and at times becoming ''much'' darker. ''Bambi II'', however, while similarly rounded, amps up the cutesy cartoon animal behaviour and dialogue in some parts of the story, particularly the "Being brave" montage and the opening scenes with the groundhog.
66	* TheyChangedItNowItSucks: Many fans of the midquel prefer the film's more relevant production name ''Bambi and the Great Prince of the Forest'', finding the finalised title ''Bambi 2'' to be a more generic cash-grab moniker (and also chronologically inaccurate anyway).
67	* ToughActToFollow: Unlike most of Disney's sequels, ''Bambi II'' has garnered something of a CultClassic reputation due to much better animation and story direction. But even those who love the {{Interquel}}, and [[CreatorBacklash even some of the creative team]], will often admit it couldn't really hope to match one of Disney's first and most iconic animated films.
68	* UnintentionallySympathetic: Ronno to a fault. Yes, he's [[HateSink clearly meant to be an unlikable jerk]], being a cocky bully and lying coward who deserved to be taken down a peg or two, and absolutely crossed the line by goading Bambi into a fight by making fun of his dad sending him to live with a stepmom, which almost got both Bambi and Mena killed. But he's also playing second fiddle to a younger fawn who, in his eyes, [[PrivilegedRival was born with a silver wheat stalk in his mouth]] and seemingly upstages him at everything he does without effort, and it's implied that his bullying and fragile, haughty ego is a result of a FriendlessBackground (however, it's entirely possible it was the other way around and his attitude as is isn't helping his case). Furthermore, the aforementioned bit of nearly getting Bambi and Mena killed by hunting dogs was a complete accident on his part, and him running off, while cowardly, was something he was specifically told to do by Mena. If he wasn't so [[ItsAllAboutMe obnoxiously self-centered]] and [[SmallNameBigEgo big-headed]], he'd be an outright sympathetic, if still heavily flawed, character. While it does '''not''' excuse any of his actions, it's at least somewhat understandable why he'd act so terribly, hence why he [[DracoInLeatherPants tends to get more sympathetic treatment in fanfiction.]]
69	* VillainDecay:
70	** Mild case for the hunting dogs, since while they are still a terrifying menace, many are taken out through rather slapstick methods by the child versions of the protagonists in this instance (some even making [[NightmareRetardant some comical expressions]] as they retreat) while the first film's dogs were persistent and utterly ferocious against even the fully grown Bambi with no goofy qualities whatsoever.
71	** Deconstructed for Ronno, with his fawn counterpart portrayed as a loudmouthed, cowardly bully who sours over [[AlwaysSecondBest Bambi constantly upstaging him]]. This takes place before his role in the first film, so it varies whether it's [[FridgeHorror more or less unsettling]] that this Ronno will still [[FromNobodyToNightmare become the sinister, eerily silent menace]] he is as an adult.
72	* SugarWiki/VisualEffectsOfAwesome: The midquel also set itself apart from most Disney sequel fare by having an impressive animation budget. Some of the forest shots are as lush as the original film, and it features some impressively animated panning shots.
73	* TheWoobie: Bambi infamously losing his mother as a fawn already solidified him as one of the {{Trope Codifier}}s. The {{Interquel}} only furthers this due to his [[WellDoneSonGuy somewhat contentious upbringing by his father]] afterward.

Context YMMV / BambiII