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Felt gratuitous
Changed line(s) 8,9 (click to see context) from:
Because Batman will track them down regardless. He is, after all, the goddamn Batman.
to:
Because Batman will track them down regardless. He is, after all, the goddamn Batman.
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Changed line(s) 34 (click to see context) from:
*** In the original continuity, there was no Center, no in-universe beef against superheroes by the government, ComicBook/MartianManhunter did not look like a grown-up [[Film/ETTheExtraterrestrial E.T.]] in his native form, and WonderWoman did not have an adventure involving rape victims in Indochina in TheFifties -- she was too busy fighting Egg Fu and the like. ''The New Frontier'' is meant to ''evoke'' the style of the early Silver Age, not to be a carbon-copy of it.
to:
*** In the original continuity, there was no Center, no in-universe beef against superheroes by the government, ComicBook/MartianManhunter did not look like a grown-up [[Film/ETTheExtraterrestrial E.T.]] in his native form, and WonderWoman Franchise/WonderWoman did not have an adventure involving rape victims in Indochina in TheFifties -- she was too busy fighting Egg Fu and the like. ''The New Frontier'' is meant to ''evoke'' the style of the early Silver Age, not to be a carbon-copy of it.
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None
Changed line(s) 1 (click to see context) from:
[[WMG: The Centre was either awakened or created by a time-traveling [[CharltonComics Peter Cannon]].]]
to:
[[WMG: The Centre was either awakened or created by a time-traveling [[CharltonComics [[Creator/CharltonComics Peter Cannon]].]]
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None
Changed line(s) 35 (click to see context) from:
** In the ''original'' continuity CM wasn't even part of TheDCU. Fawcett wasn't sold to DC until 1971, and their alternate universe wasn't made part of the mainstream DCU until ComicBook/PostCrisis.
to:
** In the ''original'' continuity CM wasn't even part of TheDCU.Franchise/TheDCU. Fawcett wasn't sold to DC until 1971, and their alternate universe wasn't made part of the mainstream DCU until ComicBook/PostCrisis.
Changed line(s) 45,46 (click to see context) from:
In TheDCU, currently at least, the White and Green martians were a single species that split. In ''New Frontier'', maybe the shapeless and telepathic life of Mars merged into a singular being, who was so powerful and dangerous that it was split by the Guardians or some other PowersThatBe-- there's only one Green, who, influenced by humans, becomes the ComicBook/MartianManhunter, and the other result of the split goes insane without its ""good side" and tries to divide back into an entire world ecology.
to:
In TheDCU, Franchise/TheDCU, currently at least, the White and Green martians were a single species that split. In ''New Frontier'', maybe the shapeless and telepathic life of Mars merged into a singular being, who was so powerful and dangerous that it was split by the Guardians or some other PowersThatBe-- there's only one Green, who, influenced by humans, becomes the ComicBook/MartianManhunter, and the other result of the split goes insane without its ""good side" and tries to divide back into an entire world ecology.
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None
Changed line(s) 15 (click to see context) from:
*** Earth-1 already has its own established [[TheSilverAgeOfComicBooks Silver Age]] history that differs greatly from ''[=JL:TNF=]''.
to:
*** Earth-1 already has its own established [[TheSilverAgeOfComicBooks [[UsefulNotes/TheSilverAgeOfComicBooks Silver Age]] history that differs greatly from ''[=JL:TNF=]''.
Changed line(s) 21 (click to see context) from:
** Actually according to WordOfGod ''The New Frontier'' is supposed to be in Original Pre-Crisis continuity, However it is only an extremely small portion of time before the creation of most main DC SilverAge comics. This was done to explain the dramatic change in differing styles and attitudes between Golden Age and Silver Age (post-[=WWII=]) comics of that era without Deconstructing the Hell out of it like ''Watchmen'' or similar comics which the other theories on this page try to list.
to:
** Actually according to WordOfGod ''The New Frontier'' is supposed to be in Original Pre-Crisis continuity, However it is only an extremely small portion of time before the creation of most main DC SilverAge [[UsefulNotes/TheSilverAgeOfComicBooks Silver Age]] comics. This was done to explain the dramatic change in differing styles and attitudes between Golden Age and Silver Age (post-[=WWII=]) comics of that era without Deconstructing the Hell out of it like ''Watchmen'' or similar comics which the other theories on this page try to list.
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None
Changed line(s) 19 (click to see context) from:
** ''TheGoldenAge'' happened in this universe too.
to:
** ''TheGoldenAge'' ''ComicBook/TheGoldenAge'' happened in this universe too.
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Changed line(s) 35 (click to see context) from:
** In the ''original'' continuity CM wasn't even part of TheDCU. Fawcett wasn't sold to DC until 1971, and their alternate universe wasn't made part of the mainstream DCU until PostCrisis.
to:
** In the ''original'' continuity CM wasn't even part of TheDCU. Fawcett wasn't sold to DC until 1971, and their alternate universe wasn't made part of the mainstream DCU until PostCrisis.ComicBook/PostCrisis.
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None
Changed line(s) 10 (click to see context) from:
[[WMG: The ''New Frontier'' Universe was the original pre-[[CrisisOnInfiniteEarths Crisis]] universe.]]
to:
[[WMG: The ''New Frontier'' Universe was the original pre-[[CrisisOnInfiniteEarths pre-[[ComicBook/CrisisOnInfiniteEarths Crisis]] universe.]]
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None
Changed line(s) 34 (click to see context) from:
*** In the original continuity, there was no Center, no in-universe beef against superheroes by the government, MartianManhunter did not look like a grown-up [[Film/ETTheExtraterrestrial E.T.]] in his native form, and WonderWoman did not have an adventure involving rape victims in Indochina in TheFifties -- she was too busy fighting Egg Fu and the like. ''The New Frontier'' is meant to ''evoke'' the style of the early Silver Age, not to be a carbon-copy of it.
to:
*** In the original continuity, there was no Center, no in-universe beef against superheroes by the government, MartianManhunter ComicBook/MartianManhunter did not look like a grown-up [[Film/ETTheExtraterrestrial E.T.]] in his native form, and WonderWoman did not have an adventure involving rape victims in Indochina in TheFifties -- she was too busy fighting Egg Fu and the like. ''The New Frontier'' is meant to ''evoke'' the style of the early Silver Age, not to be a carbon-copy of it.
Changed line(s) 45,46 (click to see context) from:
In TheDCU, currently at least, the White and Green martians were a single species that split. In ''New Frontier'', maybe the shapeless and telepathic life of Mars merged into a singular being, who was so powerful and dangerous that it was split by the Guardians or some other PowersThatBe-- there's only one Green, who, influenced by humans, becomes the MartianManhunter, and the other result of the split goes insane without its ""good side" and tries to divide back into an entire world ecology.
to:
In TheDCU, currently at least, the White and Green martians were a single species that split. In ''New Frontier'', maybe the shapeless and telepathic life of Mars merged into a singular being, who was so powerful and dangerous that it was split by the Guardians or some other PowersThatBe-- there's only one Green, who, influenced by humans, becomes the MartianManhunter, ComicBook/MartianManhunter, and the other result of the split goes insane without its ""good side" and tries to divide back into an entire world ecology.
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None
Changed line(s) 25 (click to see context) from:
He bears a resemblance to the other DCAU incarnation of the character seen in the ''JusticeLeague'' cartoon, and the cult seems to have been careful to make sure he's unable to speak. One good "SHAZAM!" and they're so out of luck. Who could make a better sacrifice for your deity than the physical embodiment of another god? The Center wants all folks with superpowers killed; you've gotta figure that Captain Marvel's near the top of that particular list.
to:
He bears a resemblance to the other DCAU incarnation of the character seen in the ''JusticeLeague'' ''WesternAnimation/JusticeLeague'' cartoon, and the cult seems to have been careful to make sure he's unable to speak. One good "SHAZAM!" and they're so out of luck. Who could make a better sacrifice for your deity than the physical embodiment of another god? The Center wants all folks with superpowers killed; you've gotta figure that Captain Marvel's near the top of that particular list.
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None
Deleted line(s) 56,57 (click to see context) :
* Shouldn't it be CaptainAtom?
Added DiffLines:
[[WMG: Nathanel Adam is reborn as Comicbook/CaptainAtom.]]
* And is this universe's equivalent of Dr. Manhattan.
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None
Changed line(s) 31 (click to see context) from:
** Not a problem. The cult who kidnapped him dyed his hair to make him less recognizable from his "have you seen me?" milk-carton pictures (or whatever they did in the 50's for missing kids). It's a RealLife kidnap tactic that was used frequently in the ColdWar when dissidents were "disappeared".
to:
** Not a problem. The cult who kidnapped him dyed his hair to make him less recognizable from his "have you seen me?" milk-carton pictures (or whatever they did in the 50's for missing kids). It's a RealLife kidnap tactic that was used frequently in the ColdWar UsefulNotes/ColdWar when dissidents were "disappeared".
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Changed line(s) 42 (click to see context) from:
to:
* Would anyone else just ''love'' to see a DC/Watchmen crossover?
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None
Added DiffLines:
[[WMG: The Centre was either awakened or created by a time-traveling [[CharltonComics Peter Cannon]].]]
The overall plot of ''The New Frontier'' could be seen as a LighterAndSofter version of ''ComicBook/{{Watchmen}}'''s: the public doesn't trust the heroes, the heroes and the government don't trust each other, and tensions build toward catastrophe until an alien attack saves everyone by forcing them to work together. Cannon is the original for whom Ozymandias in ''ComicBook/{{Watchmen}}'' was the {{Captain Ersatz}}; who's to say he's not playing the same role in this story?
[[WMG: The Centre was created by [[ComicBook/{{Watchmen}} Adrian Veidt]].]]
It would stretch his character and the [[{{Reconstruction}} theme]] less, and it would still be technically and legally possible (in copyright terms). What's more, with the Keene Act, there's a precedent for ''Watchmen'' elements showing up in other DC 'verses.
[[WMG: It doesn't matter who created the Centre.]]
Because Batman will track them down regardless. He is, after all, the goddamn Batman.
[[WMG: The ''New Frontier'' Universe was the original pre-[[CrisisOnInfiniteEarths Crisis]] universe.]]
According to writer/artist Darwyn Cooke, the story is set in a "prime continuity" where the most of the heroes debuted when they were first published. This universe in which ''DC: The New Frontier'' takes place was the first and original universe, before Krona's experiment created the multiverse.
* Would that have been Earth-1, Earth-2, or Earth-4?
** Earth-Three-Quarters.
*** No, Earth-1.
*** Earth-1 already has its own established [[TheSilverAgeOfComicBooks Silver Age]] history that differs greatly from ''[=JL:TNF=]''.
**** Earth ½! Earth H-2-O! Earth X! ...we love you, superhero comics, but the seventy bazillion parallel universes whose sole significant differences are the color of tights the supers wear and which year they got into the superhero biz was getting old in the 80s.
* Just consider it an Earth 0 or Earth Prime. It '''was''' the only earth, but then ''"a multiverse was born!"''
* ''Superman & Batman: Generations'' also takes place in this universe.
** ''TheGoldenAge'' happened in this universe too.
* No, it's Earth-21
** Actually according to WordOfGod ''The New Frontier'' is supposed to be in Original Pre-Crisis continuity, However it is only an extremely small portion of time before the creation of most main DC SilverAge comics. This was done to explain the dramatic change in differing styles and attitudes between Golden Age and Silver Age (post-[=WWII=]) comics of that era without Deconstructing the Hell out of it like ''Watchmen'' or similar comics which the other theories on this page try to list.
*** Golden Age and Silver Age DC Comics were set in different universes. There's no such thing as an "Original Pre-Crisis continuity" of the sort Cooke wants to have. Also, all those dead Justice Society members? ''That'' didn't happen Pre-Crisis.
[[WMG: OK, so remember when Batman's kicking the crud out of those cultists who are trying to sacrifice a young boy to the Center? The kid's Billy Batson.]]
He bears a resemblance to the other DCAU incarnation of the character seen in the ''JusticeLeague'' cartoon, and the cult seems to have been careful to make sure he's unable to speak. One good "SHAZAM!" and they're so out of luck. Who could make a better sacrifice for your deity than the physical embodiment of another god? The Center wants all folks with superpowers killed; you've gotta figure that Captain Marvel's near the top of that particular list.
* But the kid seems genuinely afraid of Batman and has more than enough time to Shazam himself after Bats removes the tape over his mouth. Of course, his appearance could be a reference to Captain Marvel, but we all know that the DCAU never does stuff like that.
** Everyone's afraid of Batman. Even the good guys. But if you already know he's Batman, and you're a good guy, you ought to know better than to fight him. Especially if you are reliant on unfairly illegal superpowers and he isn't.
** Or, it could be that he hasn't become Captain Marvel yet, or he hasn't fully realized gotten used to being Captain Marvel but the cultists realize that he will one day, due to his proximity to Shazam (the wizard).
** Or, he simply was new at the whole superhero thing, and was scared by Batman, like most 10 year old children would be.
* The boy is [[http://www.worldsfinestonline.com/WF/dcuam/newfrontier/bios/batman/03.jpg blonde]], not dark-haired.
** Not a problem. The cult who kidnapped him dyed his hair to make him less recognizable from his "have you seen me?" milk-carton pictures (or whatever they did in the 50's for missing kids). It's a RealLife kidnap tactic that was used frequently in the ColdWar when dissidents were "disappeared".
** Besides, in at least two alternate continuities, Billy Batson is black. So why not blonde?
** True. But this universe is supposed to follow the original continuity of the DC characters. Captain Marvel was seen with black hair. Though, Billy's CM form is suppose to resemble his dad, who has black hair.
*** In the original continuity, there was no Center, no in-universe beef against superheroes by the government, MartianManhunter did not look like a grown-up [[Film/ETTheExtraterrestrial E.T.]] in his native form, and WonderWoman did not have an adventure involving rape victims in Indochina in TheFifties -- she was too busy fighting Egg Fu and the like. ''The New Frontier'' is meant to ''evoke'' the style of the early Silver Age, not to be a carbon-copy of it.
** In the ''original'' continuity CM wasn't even part of TheDCU. Fawcett wasn't sold to DC until 1971, and their alternate universe wasn't made part of the mainstream DCU until PostCrisis.
* Billy Batson appears in a scene from the book that was not adapted into the movie, but he still looks completely different from the kid the cultists had. Maybe he's "Hill Billy" of the Lieutenant Marvels?
** [[@/TitoMosquito I]] [[{{fanon}} believe it]].
[[WMG: Nite Owl (whoever's bearing the name right now) will team up with Batman.]]
Sure, why not?
* That would be Hollis Mason, the first Nite Owl.
[[WMG:The Centre is a White Martian.]]
In TheDCU, currently at least, the White and Green martians were a single species that split. In ''New Frontier'', maybe the shapeless and telepathic life of Mars merged into a singular being, who was so powerful and dangerous that it was split by the Guardians or some other PowersThatBe-- there's only one Green, who, influenced by humans, becomes the MartianManhunter, and the other result of the split goes insane without its ""good side" and tries to divide back into an entire world ecology.
[[WMG: Captain Marvel is this universe's equivalent of Doctor Manhattan.]]
Based on the Peter Cannon/Adrian Veidt speculation further up.
First, consider: in works of fiction, time passes for characters either at the same rate as the real world (for, say, television), at a slowed rate (ComicBookTime), or not at all (Mickey Mouse). New Frontier patently takes places in a same-rate-as-the-real-world world.
Now, Billy Batson became Captain Marvel at the age of 10 in 1940. But he was still 10 in 1960. He may go on being 10 for the rest of his life.
Plus, when the massive monster that's supposed to "fix" public opinion strikes, where was Cap? On the Moon, discussing the philosophy of action and why sometimes it's better not to.
* Shouldn't it be CaptainAtom?
[[WMG: There is a massive Nazi conspiracy.]]
[[RuleOfCool Just 'cos]]. Plus they can have their asses kicked by the Freedom Fighters.
* You mean, the Nazis caused the conspiracy against costumed heroes? Vandal Savage himself may have worked with the Nazis during WWII, in addition to being involved in the [=McCarthysm=].
----
The overall plot of ''The New Frontier'' could be seen as a LighterAndSofter version of ''ComicBook/{{Watchmen}}'''s: the public doesn't trust the heroes, the heroes and the government don't trust each other, and tensions build toward catastrophe until an alien attack saves everyone by forcing them to work together. Cannon is the original for whom Ozymandias in ''ComicBook/{{Watchmen}}'' was the {{Captain Ersatz}}; who's to say he's not playing the same role in this story?
[[WMG: The Centre was created by [[ComicBook/{{Watchmen}} Adrian Veidt]].]]
It would stretch his character and the [[{{Reconstruction}} theme]] less, and it would still be technically and legally possible (in copyright terms). What's more, with the Keene Act, there's a precedent for ''Watchmen'' elements showing up in other DC 'verses.
[[WMG: It doesn't matter who created the Centre.]]
Because Batman will track them down regardless. He is, after all, the goddamn Batman.
[[WMG: The ''New Frontier'' Universe was the original pre-[[CrisisOnInfiniteEarths Crisis]] universe.]]
According to writer/artist Darwyn Cooke, the story is set in a "prime continuity" where the most of the heroes debuted when they were first published. This universe in which ''DC: The New Frontier'' takes place was the first and original universe, before Krona's experiment created the multiverse.
* Would that have been Earth-1, Earth-2, or Earth-4?
** Earth-Three-Quarters.
*** No, Earth-1.
*** Earth-1 already has its own established [[TheSilverAgeOfComicBooks Silver Age]] history that differs greatly from ''[=JL:TNF=]''.
**** Earth ½! Earth H-2-O! Earth X! ...we love you, superhero comics, but the seventy bazillion parallel universes whose sole significant differences are the color of tights the supers wear and which year they got into the superhero biz was getting old in the 80s.
* Just consider it an Earth 0 or Earth Prime. It '''was''' the only earth, but then ''"a multiverse was born!"''
* ''Superman & Batman: Generations'' also takes place in this universe.
** ''TheGoldenAge'' happened in this universe too.
* No, it's Earth-21
** Actually according to WordOfGod ''The New Frontier'' is supposed to be in Original Pre-Crisis continuity, However it is only an extremely small portion of time before the creation of most main DC SilverAge comics. This was done to explain the dramatic change in differing styles and attitudes between Golden Age and Silver Age (post-[=WWII=]) comics of that era without Deconstructing the Hell out of it like ''Watchmen'' or similar comics which the other theories on this page try to list.
*** Golden Age and Silver Age DC Comics were set in different universes. There's no such thing as an "Original Pre-Crisis continuity" of the sort Cooke wants to have. Also, all those dead Justice Society members? ''That'' didn't happen Pre-Crisis.
[[WMG: OK, so remember when Batman's kicking the crud out of those cultists who are trying to sacrifice a young boy to the Center? The kid's Billy Batson.]]
He bears a resemblance to the other DCAU incarnation of the character seen in the ''JusticeLeague'' cartoon, and the cult seems to have been careful to make sure he's unable to speak. One good "SHAZAM!" and they're so out of luck. Who could make a better sacrifice for your deity than the physical embodiment of another god? The Center wants all folks with superpowers killed; you've gotta figure that Captain Marvel's near the top of that particular list.
* But the kid seems genuinely afraid of Batman and has more than enough time to Shazam himself after Bats removes the tape over his mouth. Of course, his appearance could be a reference to Captain Marvel, but we all know that the DCAU never does stuff like that.
** Everyone's afraid of Batman. Even the good guys. But if you already know he's Batman, and you're a good guy, you ought to know better than to fight him. Especially if you are reliant on unfairly illegal superpowers and he isn't.
** Or, it could be that he hasn't become Captain Marvel yet, or he hasn't fully realized gotten used to being Captain Marvel but the cultists realize that he will one day, due to his proximity to Shazam (the wizard).
** Or, he simply was new at the whole superhero thing, and was scared by Batman, like most 10 year old children would be.
* The boy is [[http://www.worldsfinestonline.com/WF/dcuam/newfrontier/bios/batman/03.jpg blonde]], not dark-haired.
** Not a problem. The cult who kidnapped him dyed his hair to make him less recognizable from his "have you seen me?" milk-carton pictures (or whatever they did in the 50's for missing kids). It's a RealLife kidnap tactic that was used frequently in the ColdWar when dissidents were "disappeared".
** Besides, in at least two alternate continuities, Billy Batson is black. So why not blonde?
** True. But this universe is supposed to follow the original continuity of the DC characters. Captain Marvel was seen with black hair. Though, Billy's CM form is suppose to resemble his dad, who has black hair.
*** In the original continuity, there was no Center, no in-universe beef against superheroes by the government, MartianManhunter did not look like a grown-up [[Film/ETTheExtraterrestrial E.T.]] in his native form, and WonderWoman did not have an adventure involving rape victims in Indochina in TheFifties -- she was too busy fighting Egg Fu and the like. ''The New Frontier'' is meant to ''evoke'' the style of the early Silver Age, not to be a carbon-copy of it.
** In the ''original'' continuity CM wasn't even part of TheDCU. Fawcett wasn't sold to DC until 1971, and their alternate universe wasn't made part of the mainstream DCU until PostCrisis.
* Billy Batson appears in a scene from the book that was not adapted into the movie, but he still looks completely different from the kid the cultists had. Maybe he's "Hill Billy" of the Lieutenant Marvels?
** [[@/TitoMosquito I]] [[{{fanon}} believe it]].
[[WMG: Nite Owl (whoever's bearing the name right now) will team up with Batman.]]
Sure, why not?
* That would be Hollis Mason, the first Nite Owl.
[[WMG:The Centre is a White Martian.]]
In TheDCU, currently at least, the White and Green martians were a single species that split. In ''New Frontier'', maybe the shapeless and telepathic life of Mars merged into a singular being, who was so powerful and dangerous that it was split by the Guardians or some other PowersThatBe-- there's only one Green, who, influenced by humans, becomes the MartianManhunter, and the other result of the split goes insane without its ""good side" and tries to divide back into an entire world ecology.
[[WMG: Captain Marvel is this universe's equivalent of Doctor Manhattan.]]
Based on the Peter Cannon/Adrian Veidt speculation further up.
First, consider: in works of fiction, time passes for characters either at the same rate as the real world (for, say, television), at a slowed rate (ComicBookTime), or not at all (Mickey Mouse). New Frontier patently takes places in a same-rate-as-the-real-world world.
Now, Billy Batson became Captain Marvel at the age of 10 in 1940. But he was still 10 in 1960. He may go on being 10 for the rest of his life.
Plus, when the massive monster that's supposed to "fix" public opinion strikes, where was Cap? On the Moon, discussing the philosophy of action and why sometimes it's better not to.
* Shouldn't it be CaptainAtom?
[[WMG: There is a massive Nazi conspiracy.]]
[[RuleOfCool Just 'cos]]. Plus they can have their asses kicked by the Freedom Fighters.
* You mean, the Nazis caused the conspiracy against costumed heroes? Vandal Savage himself may have worked with the Nazis during WWII, in addition to being involved in the [=McCarthysm=].
----
