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* The original sketches of ''WebOriginal/HamstersParadise'' already had multiple dark parts in the main project, ''especially'' the sapient, sadistic Harmsters. But the original sketches got much darker, as ''every single sapient species'', not just the Harmsters, [[InYourNatureToDestroyYourselves all meet ignoble ends or die by their own hands.]] The final species of sophonts, the Mousey Micks, go the furthest, as in thenot only cause their own extinction via out-of-control industrialisation, but irreversibly damage the atmosphere of the planet itself, leading to unstoppable GlobalWarming that eventually kills even the simplest life forms on the planet, [[DownerEnding leaving just a baked, lifeless rock]]. Even Tribbetherium (creator of both the sketches and the current main project) has regretted the pessimistic tone of the sketches, and has promised to rework it.

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* The original sketches of ''WebOriginal/HamstersParadise'' already had has multiple dark parts in the main project, parts, ''especially'' the sapient, sadistic Harmsters. But the original sketches got much darker, as ''every single sapient species'', not just the Harmsters, [[InYourNatureToDestroyYourselves all meet ignoble ends or die by their own hands.]] The final species of sophonts, the Mousey Micks, go the furthest, as in thenot only cause their own extinction via out-of-control industrialisation, but irreversibly damage the atmosphere of the planet itself, leading to unstoppable GlobalWarming that eventually kills even the simplest life forms on the planet, [[DownerEnding leaving just a baked, lifeless rock]]. Even Tribbetherium (creator of both the sketches and the current main project) has regretted the pessimistic tone of the sketches, and has promised to rework it.
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* The original sketches of ''WebOriginal/HamstersParadise'' already had multiple dark parts in the main project, ''especially'' the sapient, sadistic Harmsters. But the original sketches got much darker, [[InYourNatureToDestroyYourselves as ''every single sapient species'', not just the Harmsters, all meet ignoble ends or die by their own hands.]] The final species of sophonts, the Mousey Micks, go the furthest, as in thenot only cause their own extinction via out-of-control industrialisation, but irreversibly damage the atmosphere of the planet itself, leading to unstoppable GlobalWarming that eventually kills even the simplest life forms on the planet, [[DownerEnding leaving just a baked, lifeless rock]]. Even Tribbetherium (creator of both the sketches and the current main project) has regretted the pessimistic tone of the sketches, and has promised to rework it.

to:

* The original sketches of ''WebOriginal/HamstersParadise'' already had multiple dark parts in the main project, ''especially'' the sapient, sadistic Harmsters. But the original sketches got much darker, [[InYourNatureToDestroyYourselves as ''every single sapient species'', not just the Harmsters, [[InYourNatureToDestroyYourselves all meet ignoble ends or die by their own hands.]] The final species of sophonts, the Mousey Micks, go the furthest, as in thenot only cause their own extinction via out-of-control industrialisation, but irreversibly damage the atmosphere of the planet itself, leading to unstoppable GlobalWarming that eventually kills even the simplest life forms on the planet, [[DownerEnding leaving just a baked, lifeless rock]]. Even Tribbetherium (creator of both the sketches and the current main project) has regretted the pessimistic tone of the sketches, and has promised to rework it.
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None


* The original sketches of ''WebOriginal/HamstersParadise'' already had multiple dark parts in the main project, ''especially'' the sentient, [[Sadist sadistic]] Harmsters? But the original sketches got much darker, [[InYourNatureToDestroyYourselves as ''every single sapient species'', not just the Harmsters, all meet ignoble ends or die by their own hands.]] The final species of sophonts, the Mousey Micks, go the furthest, as in thenot only cause their own extinction via out-of-control industrialisation, but irreversibly damage the atmosphere of the planet itself, leading to unstoppable GlobalWarming that eventually kills even the simplest life forms on the planet, [[DownerEnding leaving just a baked, lifeless rock]]. Even Tribbetherium (creator of both the sketches and the current main project) has regretted the pessimistic tone of the sketches, and has promised to rework it.

to:

* The original sketches of ''WebOriginal/HamstersParadise'' already had multiple dark parts in the main project, ''especially'' the sentient, [[Sadist sadistic]] Harmsters? sapient, sadistic Harmsters. But the original sketches got much darker, [[InYourNatureToDestroyYourselves as ''every single sapient species'', not just the Harmsters, all meet ignoble ends or die by their own hands.]] The final species of sophonts, the Mousey Micks, go the furthest, as in thenot only cause their own extinction via out-of-control industrialisation, but irreversibly damage the atmosphere of the planet itself, leading to unstoppable GlobalWarming that eventually kills even the simplest life forms on the planet, [[DownerEnding leaving just a baked, lifeless rock]]. Even Tribbetherium (creator of both the sketches and the current main project) has regretted the pessimistic tone of the sketches, and has promised to rework it.
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None

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* The original sketches of ''WebOriginal/HamstersParadise'' already had multiple dark parts in the main project, ''especially'' the sentient, [[Sadist sadistic]] Harmsters? But the original sketches got much darker, [[InYourNatureToDestroyYourselves as ''every single sapient species'', not just the Harmsters, all meet ignoble ends or die by their own hands.]] The final species of sophonts, the Mousey Micks, go the furthest, as in thenot only cause their own extinction via out-of-control industrialisation, but irreversibly damage the atmosphere of the planet itself, leading to unstoppable GlobalWarming that eventually kills even the simplest life forms on the planet, [[DownerEnding leaving just a baked, lifeless rock]]. Even Tribbetherium (creator of both the sketches and the current main project) has regretted the pessimistic tone of the sketches, and has promised to rework it.
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None


This reaction is often the result of writers believing that TrueArtIsAngsty, and going overboard with it. Keep in mind, however, that a work doesn't necessarily ''have'' to be angsty to qualify for this trope. There are plenty of comedies, typically [[BlackComedy black comedies]], that tend to be so dark or mean-spirited that audiences will struggle to find anything funny about it.

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This reaction is often the result of writers believing that TrueArtIsAngsty, and going overboard with it. Keep in mind, however, that a work doesn't necessarily ''have'' to be angsty to qualify for this trope. There are plenty of comedies, typically [[BlackComedy black black]] or [[KafkaKomedy Kafka comedies]], that tend to be so dark or mean-spirited that audiences will struggle to find anything funny about it.
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Misuse all the way.


* ''WesternAnimation/MiraculousLadybug'' is this in it's 5th season as many have found said season far too depressing to continue with numerous characters retconned or dumbed down for the sake of the plot, the [[spoiler:long awaited romance between Adrien and Marinette]] being seen as anti-climactic and the treatment of Chloé being seen as unpleasant in spite of her status as a BaseBreakingCharacter. The show for many barely feels like itself anymore and with the main heroes (and Chloé) consistently ending up even worse off than they were last season really makes it difficult to stay invested. It also doesn't help that the entire season's script was leaked before release, which turned away many viewers to begin with as many were already unhappy with the direction of said scripts, but seeing it in action just about caused the fanbase to wane considerably.
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* ''WesternAnimation/MiraculousLadybug'' is this in it's 5th season as many have found said season far too depressing to continue with numerous characters retconned or dumbed down for the sake of the plot, the [[spoiler:long awaited romance between Adrien and Marinette]] being seen as anti-climactic and the treatment of Chloé being seen as unpleasant in spite of her status as a BaseBreakingCharacter. The show for many barely feels like itself anymore and with the main heroes (and Chloé) consistently ending up even worse off than they were last season really makes it difficult to stay invested. It also doesn't help that the entire season's script was leaked before release, which turned away many viewers to begin with as many were already unhappy with the direction of said scripts, but seeing it in action just about caused the fanbase to wane considerably.
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* ''Webcomic/ItsNotYourFault'': One of the biggest issues people have with the comic is how overtly dark and melodramatic the story is. The conflict is started when Rusty sabotages Stella and Lincoln's relationship out of spite and petty jealousy that resulted in a messy breakup, which was ''preceded'' by Luna and Sam having a spat over a simple music gig that led to Sam becoming mentally unstable when Luna brought up her missing dad. This eventually accumulated in Sam getting drunk off her butt and [[spoiler: force herself onto Lincoln]]. And if ''that'' wasn't enough, [[spoiler:Sam becomes pregnant with Lincoln's child, so the two secretly decide to raise their kid together and ostracize Luna because of her refusal to accept said child]].
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* ''Literature/{{Worm}}'' (and all Creator/{{Wildbow}}'s stories). Things ''always'' [[FromBadToWorse get worse]], as the series is essentially a long chain of really bad things happening that directly result in even worse things happening. As a general note, it can be tough to have any ''fun'' reading a series that's full of characters that do horrible and horrifying things on both sides, and the constant [[AnyoneCanDie deaths]] and disturbing content can get too much for many readers. The protagonist, for example, starts off a bullying victim who experiences AdultsAreUseless, accidentally joins a gang, and, before long, finds herself committing torture, kidnapping, and murder without blinking. And she's one of the nicer characters. In the end, though, [[spoiler:[[SurprisinglyHappyEnding humanity does manage to survive the impending apocalypse and take down the entity responsible for it.]] It says something about the series, though, that several billion people dying is consider a positive note to end on because humanity isn't outright extinct]]. The SequelSeries ''Literature/{{Ward}}'' goes to show that it's still absolutely a CrapsackWorld.

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* ''Literature/{{Worm}}'' (and all Creator/{{Wildbow}}'s stories). Things ''always'' [[FromBadToWorse get worse]], as the series is essentially a long chain of really bad things happening that directly result in even worse things happening. As a general note, it can be tough to have any ''fun'' reading a series that's full of characters that do horrible and horrifying things on both sides, and the constant [[AnyoneCanDie deaths]] and disturbing content can get too much for many readers. The protagonist, for example, starts off a bullying victim who experiences AdultsAreUseless, accidentally joins a gang, and, before long, finds herself committing torture, kidnapping, and murder without blinking. And she's one of the nicer ''nicer'' characters. In the end, though, [[spoiler:[[SurprisinglyHappyEnding [[spoiler: [[SurprisinglyHappyEnding humanity does manage to survive the impending apocalypse and take down the entity responsible for it.]] It it]], but it really says something about the series, though, series that several billion people dying is consider considered a positive note to end on because humanity isn't outright extinct]]. The SequelSeries ''Literature/{{Ward}}'' goes proceeds to show that it's still absolutely a CrapsackWorld.
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Remaining a long-running/successful work means it is not losing audiences due to such. If anything's changed something objective like viewership decline is needed as proof.


* ''WesternAnimation/FamilyGuy'' gradually grows darker and more mean-spirited during its [[LongRunner long tenure]]. The characters slowly become entirely heartless caricatures via {{Flanderization}}; Lois, originally a [[WomenAreWiser wiser foil]] to Peter with the occasional NotSoAboveItAll moment, becomes [[TookALevelInJerkass increasingly mean and selfish]], especially toward Meg--to the point where she once outright tells Meg that she's tired of trying to comfort her and ''urges her to commit suicide.'' Meg herself also goes from an unpopular ButtMonkey to the target of genuine physical and psychological abuse--and the infamous "Seahorse Seashell Party" both lampshades this treatment and then tries to justify it by having Meg realize that her family is so dysfunctional that they need someone to draw all of their negativity and hatred; she "volunteers" to do so and is praised by Brian for it, which comes across as disturbingly close to sanctioning or even glorifying abuse in the name of keeping the peace, a sadly common tactic for actual abuse victims. These changes, plus the addition of more serious episodes like "Brian and Stewie" (which features Brian eating Stewie's feces and frankly admitting suicidal ideation) and "Send In Stewie, Please" (which has almost no jokes and features Stewie delving into his psychoses with a child psychiatrist, then refusing to save that psychiatrist when he has a realistically depicted heart attack, thus committing murder by inaction; the episode ends with Stewie lying in his crib clearly traumatized by the experience) have led to fans and critics alike saying that the show has simply become a series about horrible people doing horrible things to each other with no lasting repercussions. The Status Quo of StatusQuoIsGod is increasingly bleak and unpleasant, and thus no longer enjoyable or funny.
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* 1983's ''VideoGame/{{Infidel}}'' received this response upon its release. The main character was a {{jerkass}} VillainProtagonist who receives a KarmicDeath in the game's ending where he's BuriedAlive with the treasure he struggled throughout the entire game to obtain. Creator/{{Infocom}} received a significant amount of hate mail from disgruntled players upset about being BlamedForBeingRailroaded and led to an unsatisfying conclusion, with the famed critic Scorpia refusing to even promote it with a proper review despite having been a fan of Infocom.
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* ''Webcomic/BetweenFailures'': Well the comic is called Between Failures after all, but nevertheless the comic’s overall cynical tone and the cast being nothing but snarkers has made the comic a bit of a chore to read for some.
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The Characterization Tags had to go, but the clarification is still useful to someone who's unfamiliar with this work.


* It can be legitimately hard to get invested in the ''LetsPlay/DreamSMP''. The setting takes place in a CrapsackWorld where nearly everyone has some form of PTSD and are more than likely to get [[YankTheDogsChain worse]] [[FromBadToWorse and]] ''[[HappyEndingOverride worse]]'' as the series progresses. This is all while people like [[BigBad Dream]] [[KarmaHoudini can get away scot-free]] with various acts that nobody on the server would be able to tolerate like [[NukeEm ending an entire country]] or beating a teenager to death [[DyingAlone in a prison cell]] while said teenager was trying to achieve closure with him. Even when Dream does get his comeuppance, it's ''other people'' who pay the price.

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* It can be legitimately hard to get invested in the ''LetsPlay/DreamSMP''. The setting takes place in a CrapsackWorld where nearly everyone has some form of PTSD and are more than likely to get [[YankTheDogsChain worse]] [[FromBadToWorse and]] ''[[HappyEndingOverride worse]]'' as the series progresses. This is all while people like [[BigBad Dream]] Dream]][[note]]This refers to one of the ''Dream SMP'' characters who share their name with the content creator who plays them, and not the real-life Dream.[[/note]] [[KarmaHoudini can get away scot-free]] with various acts that nobody on the server would be able to tolerate like [[NukeEm ending an entire country]] or beating a teenager to death [[DyingAlone in a prison cell]] while said teenager was trying to achieve closure with him. Even when Dream does get his comeuppance, it's ''other people'' who pay the price.
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* It can be legitimately hard to get invested in the ''LetsPlay/DreamSMP''. The setting takes place in a CrapsackWorld where nearly everyone has some form of PTSD and are more than likely to get [[YankTheDogsChain worse]] [[FromBadToWorse and]] ''[[HappyEndingOverride worse]]'' as the series progresses. This is all while people like [[BigBad c!Dream]] [[KarmaHoudini can get away scot-free]] with various acts that nobody on the server would be able to tolerate like [[NukeEm ending an entire country]] or beating a teenager to death [[DyingAlone in a prison cell]] while said teenager was trying to achieve closure with his abuser (also known as c!Dream). Even when c!Dream does get his comeuppance, it's ''other people'' who pay the price.[[note]]For clarification, the "c![X]" prefix is used to indicate this is referring to the character who shares a name with the content creator that plays them. The real-life Dream (or cc!Dream) is ''not'' a murderous, tyrannical child-abuser.[[/note]]

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* It can be legitimately hard to get invested in the ''LetsPlay/DreamSMP''. The setting takes place in a CrapsackWorld where nearly everyone has some form of PTSD and are more than likely to get [[YankTheDogsChain worse]] [[FromBadToWorse and]] ''[[HappyEndingOverride worse]]'' as the series progresses. This is all while people like [[BigBad c!Dream]] Dream]] [[KarmaHoudini can get away scot-free]] with various acts that nobody on the server would be able to tolerate like [[NukeEm ending an entire country]] or beating a teenager to death [[DyingAlone in a prison cell]] while said teenager was trying to achieve closure with his abuser (also known as c!Dream). him. Even when c!Dream Dream does get his comeuppance, it's ''other people'' who pay the price.[[note]]For clarification, the "c![X]" prefix is used to indicate this is referring to the character who shares a name with the content creator that plays them. The real-life Dream (or cc!Dream) is ''not'' a murderous, tyrannical child-abuser.[[/note]]
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** ''VisualNovel/SayaNoUta'' was once popular since the release, it's now despised in some countries and is one of the darkest [[HGame H-games]] to ever exist. Not just because it's written by Creator/GenUrobuchi himself, but the whole premise is also horrible: The protagonist, who used to have normal eyesight and senses, now has to live with his creepily distorted vision, in which ''everything he sees and senses'' becomes WombLevel except Saya, so she's the only one the protagonist who can befriend. Many players who are into H-scenes are turned off by TheReveal that [[spoiler:Saya is a malicious EldritchAbomination whose looks can make everyone GoMadFromTheRevelation, but it becomes "inverted" by his distorted vision]].

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** ''VisualNovel/SayaNoUta'' ''VisualNovel/SayaNoUta'', written by Creator/GenUrobuchi himself, was once popular since the release, it's popular, but is now despised in some countries and countries. Not only is it one of the darkest [[HGame H-games]] to ever exist. Not just because it's written by Creator/GenUrobuchi himself, exist with its frequent suffering, gore and death, but the whole premise is also horrible: The protagonist, who used to have normal eyesight and senses, now has to live with his creepily distorted vision, in which ''everything he sees and senses'' becomes a WombLevel except Saya, so she's the only one the protagonist who can befriend. Many players who are into H-scenes are turned off by TheReveal that [[spoiler:Saya is a malicious EldritchAbomination whose looks can make everyone GoMadFromTheRevelation, but it becomes "inverted" by his distorted vision]].
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* ''WesternAnimation/TheGroovenians'': In a very bizarre way. Jet, and Glindy come across as a pair of unlikeable, selfish bums while the "antagonists" such as the parents and Norman are exaggerated and unrealistic caricatures of human behavior, it's hard to find anybody whose genuinely likeable.
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This reaction is often the result of writers believing that TrueArtIsAngsty, and going overboard with it.

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This reaction is often the result of writers believing that TrueArtIsAngsty, and going overboard with it. Keep in mind, however, that a work doesn't necessarily ''have'' to be angsty to qualify for this trope. There are plenty of comedies, typically [[BlackComedy black comedies]], that tend to be so dark or mean-spirited that audiences will struggle to find anything funny about it.
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None

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* ''Theatre/MerrilyWeRollAlong'' has a BackToFront structure that starts with its DownerEnding. It can be very hard to engage with the story when you already know everything turns out horribly for everyone involved.
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Distinguished this trope from Angst Aversion, as well as precisely what makes a work NOT this trope


This trope frequently gets misused for any work that is dark, angsty, or depressing. That is just Administrivia/ComplainingAboutShowsYouDontLike. It only applies when '''there is no meaningful conflict''' because everyone is awful and the world sucks, and therefore '''there are no stakes for the audience'''. If people enjoy the work despite its tone, this trope does not apply.

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This trope frequently gets misused for any work that is dark, angsty, or depressing. That is just Administrivia/ComplainingAboutShowsYouDontLike. It only applies when '''there is no meaningful conflict''' because everyone is awful and the world sucks, and therefore '''there are no stakes for the audience'''. If people enjoy the work despite its tone, grim setting, this trope does not apply.
apply; and if people dislike a work because it's too depressing, AngstAversion applies instead (as mentioned above).
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* ''VisualNovel/CorpseParty'', even in its first incarnation, was pretty bleak, featuring a setting where [[OrdinaryHighSchoolStudent ordinary high school students]] are pulled into an [[DarkWorld alternate version]] of their school, featuring a StringyHairedGhostGirl and other ghosts that all want them dead, along with [[TheCorruption the Darkening]], which turns them into undead monsters if they [[DespairEventHorizon lose all hope]]. Even then, the protagonists usually solved the mystery and escaped relatively intact in the first few incarnations of the story. Later adaptions, however, go straight for the EverybodyDiesEnding. Even the OVA adaptation of the first story kills all but two of the protagonists, one of whom ends up sitting in a rocking chair for the rest of her life, too traumatized to even speak.

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* ''VisualNovel/CorpseParty'', even in its first incarnation, was pretty bleak, featuring a setting where [[OrdinaryHighSchoolStudent ordinary high school students]] are pulled into an [[DarkWorld alternate version]] of their school, featuring a StringyHairedGhostGirl and other ghosts that all want them dead, along with [[TheCorruption the Darkening]], which turns them into undead monsters if they [[DespairEventHorizon lose all hope]]. Even then, the protagonists usually solved the mystery and escaped relatively intact in the first few incarnations of the story. Later adaptions, however, go straight for the EverybodyDiesEnding. Even the OVA adaptation of the first story kills all but two of the protagonists, one of whom ends up sitting in a rocking chair for the rest of her life, too traumatized to even speak. The manga, ''Corpse Party Musume'', treats several of the darker moments of the actual game as if the author has a humiliation fetish but ends basically the same as Ending A of the game... until [[spoiler:the kid sister of the protagonist dies while declaring her incestuous love for him, he sacrifices himself to be with her in the afterlife as her lover out of guilt, and his girlfriend gets molested as she's dragged into the pocket dimension the school's curse is centered on to become its new host.]]
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* ''TabletopGame/Warhammer40000'' is a game that was meant to be as over-the-top satirical in its grimdark setting for the sake of humor. However, there have been periods in the game's history where the creators at Games Workshop have forgotten or at least downplayed the intended black comedy of the setting, treating the material as deadly serious. This has made the already [[CrackIsCheaper cost prohibitive]] hobby less appealing to potential players. The swing-around back in the other direction is rarely a change in how dark the series is, but rather how it's treated.
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The trope's been cut by TRS.


* ''Film/RepoTheGeneticOpera'', both the musical and the film of the musical. The basic premise is that a company controls the supply of organs needed to live, and they remove them by force if you are late making payments. The characters include an heiress addicted to drugs and surgery, a mass-murdering heir, a man who wears the removed faces of women, a CorruptCorporateExecutive who sends hitmen out to remove the organs of those who fail to pay him, and the titular Repo Man. There's only three characters with a shred of decency - the tragic opera singer, the IncorruptiblePurePureness IllGirl, and the grave-robbing, drug-dealing GreekChorus. It just keeps getting worse.

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* ''Film/RepoTheGeneticOpera'', both the musical and the film of the musical. The basic premise is that a company controls the supply of organs needed to live, and they remove them by force if you are late making payments. The characters include an heiress addicted to drugs and surgery, a mass-murdering heir, a man who wears the removed faces of women, a CorruptCorporateExecutive who sends hitmen out to remove the organs of those who fail to pay him, and the titular Repo Man. There's only three characters with a shred of decency - the tragic opera singer, the IncorruptiblePurePureness IllGirl, ill girl, and the grave-robbing, drug-dealing GreekChorus. It just keeps getting worse.
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* ''Webcomic/{{Prequel}}'''s Katia just keeps losing everything, leading to many readers quitting the strip after [[spoiler:Sigrid takes almost everything she has]].

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* ''Webcomic/{{Prequel}}'''s Katia just keeps losing everything, leading to many readers quitting the strip after [[spoiler:Sigrid takes almost everything she has]]. However, the follow-up to this was one of the most absurdly funny parts of the story. [[spoiler:Katia manages to finally use magic consistently and get some help from a soul cairn contract, letting her wash off Sigrid's charisma-enhancing perfume and revealing that it was making Sigrid narcissistic as a result of being affected by it just like everyone else.]]
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Fixed slight grammar issue in the DSMP entry. Also, Death Of A Child doesn't apply because the 'child' in question was 16 as of time of the incident, while the trope only allows up to age 11 or so.


* It can be legitimately hard to get invested in the ''LetsPlay/DreamSMP''. The setting takes place in a CrapsackWorld where nearly everyone has some form of PTSD and are more than likely to get [[YankTheDogsChain worse]] [[FromBadToWorse and]] ''[[HappyEndingOverride worse]]'' as the series progresses. This is all while people like [[BigBad Dream]] [[KarmaHoudini can get away scot-free]] with various acts that nobody on the server would be able to tolerate like [[NukeEm ending an entire country]] or [[DeathOfAChild beating a child to death]] [[DyingAlone in a prison cell]] after said child had just overcome his oppressor. Even when Dream does get his comeuppance, its ''other people'' who pay the price.

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* It can be legitimately hard to get invested in the ''LetsPlay/DreamSMP''. The setting takes place in a CrapsackWorld where nearly everyone has some form of PTSD and are more than likely to get [[YankTheDogsChain worse]] [[FromBadToWorse and]] ''[[HappyEndingOverride worse]]'' as the series progresses. This is all while people like [[BigBad Dream]] c!Dream]] [[KarmaHoudini can get away scot-free]] with various acts that nobody on the server would be able to tolerate like [[NukeEm ending an entire country]] or [[DeathOfAChild beating a child teenager to death]] death [[DyingAlone in a prison cell]] after while said child had just overcome teenager was trying to achieve closure with his oppressor. abuser (also known as c!Dream). Even when Dream c!Dream does get his comeuppance, its it's ''other people'' who pay the price.[[note]]For clarification, the "c![X]" prefix is used to indicate this is referring to the character who shares a name with the content creator that plays them. The real-life Dream (or cc!Dream) is ''not'' a murderous, tyrannical child-abuser.[[/note]]
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Wiki/ namespace clean up.


It is often said that "conflict is the soul of drama." Without some form of {{conflict}} to fuel things there's no engine to drive the story and thus little reason to become invested in it. However, we here at Wiki/TVTropes would like to propose an amendment to this phrase which includes something important but sadly all-too-often forgotten, as [[Administrivia/TropesAreTools tropes are, after all, tools]]:

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It is often said that "conflict is the soul of drama." Without some form of {{conflict}} to fuel things there's no engine to drive the story and thus little reason to become invested in it. However, we here at Wiki/TVTropes Website/TVTropes would like to propose an amendment to this phrase which includes something important but sadly all-too-often forgotten, as [[Administrivia/TropesAreTools tropes are, after all, tools]]:

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Removed: 712

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* It can be legitimately hard to get invested in the ''LetsPlay/DreamSMP''. The setting takes place in a CrapsackWorld where nearly everyone has some form of PTSD and are more than likely to get [[YankTheDogsChain worse]] [[FromBadToWorse and]] ''[[HappyEndingOverride worse]]'' as the series progresses. This is all while people like [[BigBad Dream]] [[KarmaHoudini can get away scot-free]] with various acts that nobody on the server would be able to tolerate like [[NukeEm ending an entire country]] or [[DeathOfAChild beating a child to death]] [[DyingAlone in a prison cell]] after said child had just overcome his oppressor. Even when Dream does get his comeuppance, its ''other people'' who pay the price.



* It can be legitimately hard to get invested in the ''LetsPlay/DreamSMP''. The setting takes place in a CrapsackWorld where nearly everyone has some form of PTSD and are more than likely to get [[YankTheDogsChain worse]] [[FromBadToWorse and]] ''[[HappyEndingOverride worse]]'' as the series progresses. This is all while people like [[BigBad Dream]] [[KarmaHoudini can get away scot-free]] with various acts that nobody on the server would be able to tolerate like [[NukeEm ending an entire country]] or [[DeathOfAChild beating a child to death]] [[DyingAlone in a prison cell]] after said child had just overcome his oppressor. Even when Dream does get his comeuppance, its ''other people'' who pay the price.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

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* It can be legitimately hard to get invested in the ''LetsPlay/DreamSMP''. The setting takes place in a CrapsackWorld where nearly everyone has some form of PTSD and are more than likely to get [[YankTheDogsChain worse]] [[FromBadToWorse and]] ''[[HappyEndingOverride worse]]'' as the series progresses. This is all while people like [[BigBad Dream]] [[KarmaHoudini can get away scot-free]] with various acts that nobody on the server would be able to tolerate like [[NukeEm ending an entire country]] or [[DeathOfAChild beating a child to death]] [[DyingAlone in a prison cell]] after said child had just overcome his oppressor. Even when Dream does get his comeuppance, its ''other people'' who pay the price.
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YMMV can't be averted. Endings don't count as TBSC means you stop caring how and thus before it ends.


* ''VisualNovel/DiabolikLovers'': A lot of people outside of people with ravishment fetishes find the game overly bleak, this being the main reason the franchise is [[AmericansHateTingle mostly despised outside Japan]]. The female lead/player character is trapped in terrible situations without '''any''' ways out (and develops StockholmSyndrome), the romantic options are horrible people with little to no redeeming qualities, there's lots of gross and {{squick}}y elements, and most of the game's MultipleEndings are overly cruel or esoterically happy.

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* ''VisualNovel/DiabolikLovers'': A lot of people outside of people with ravishment fetishes find the game overly bleak, this being the main reason the franchise is [[AmericansHateTingle mostly despised outside Japan]]. The female lead/player character is trapped in terrible situations without '''any''' ways out (and develops StockholmSyndrome), the romantic options are horrible people with little to no redeeming qualities, there's lots of gross and {{squick}}y elements, and most of the game's MultipleEndings are overly cruel or esoterically happy.elements.



* ''VisualNovel/ShinraiBrokenBeyondDespair'', [[AvertedTrope which otherwise doesn't qualify]], plays this trope InUniverse with the horror movie the characters watch at their Halloween party. Raiko, the PlayerCharacter and the narrator, considers all the characters to be so unlikeable that she doesn't care what happens to them.
* Creator/{{Nitroplus}}, which is infamous for DarkerAndEdgier stories and {{downer ending}}s, it's not quite surprising for a number of players ended up getting tired of reading or even [[AngstAversion avoid reading visual novels created by them]]:
** ''VisualNovel/{{Hanachirasu}}'': Besides the BlackAndGreyMorality of the characters, [[ShootTheShaggyDog nothing good happens in the entire story]]. It also ends with a DownerEnding where [[spoiler:[[EveryoneDiesEnding all the named characters die]] (except the ones who are dead already), while Japan retains its fascist government forever]].
** ''VisualNovel/SayaNoUta'' was once popular since the release, it's now despised in some countries and is one of the darkest [[HGame H-games]] to ever exist. Not just because it's written by Creator/GenUrobuchi himself, but the whole premise is also horrible: The protagonist, who used to have normal eyesight and senses, now has to live with his creepily distorted vision, in which ''everything he sees and senses'' becomes WombLevel except Saya, so she's the only one the protagonist who can befriend. Many players who are into H-scenes are turned off by TheReveal that [[spoiler:Saya is a malicious EldritchAbomination whose looks can make everyone GoMadFromTheRevelation, but it becomes "inverted" by his distorted vision]]. All endings are bittersweet at best and downers at worst, either: [[spoiler:have your senses repaired, only to be locked out and get separated from Saya forever; become intimate with Saya, after which she will "grow" into a giant blob of flesh to eat the planet whole; or [[EverybodyDiesEnding everyone dies]], [[TheHeroDies including the protagonist himself]], while the only character who survives suffers a GoMadFromTheRevelation and might probably commit suicide soon]]. What's even worse is although the first ending is better than the rest, it's considered as a BadEnd.
* ''VisualNovel/BoyfriendToDeath'': The main premise is already dark: all the male characters that a main character can romance are (almost) irredeemable and there's no other way out. [[spoiler:And at least in the first installment, [[DownerEnding all endings]] [[FailureIsTheOnlyOption are bad]], with the survival endings not much better than the endings where you die.]]

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* ''VisualNovel/ShinraiBrokenBeyondDespair'', [[AvertedTrope which otherwise doesn't qualify]], ''VisualNovel/ShinraiBrokenBeyondDespair'' plays this trope InUniverse with the horror movie the characters watch at their Halloween party. Raiko, the PlayerCharacter and the narrator, considers all the characters to be so unlikeable that she doesn't care what happens to them.
* Creator/{{Nitroplus}}, which is infamous for DarkerAndEdgier stories and {{downer ending}}s, it's not quite surprising for stories, has a number of players ended up getting tired of reading or even [[AngstAversion avoid reading visual novels created by them]]:
** ''VisualNovel/{{Hanachirasu}}'': Besides the BlackAndGreyMorality of the characters, [[ShootTheShaggyDog nothing good happens in the entire story]]. It also ends with a DownerEnding where [[spoiler:[[EveryoneDiesEnding all the named characters die]] (except the ones who are dead already), while Japan retains its fascist government forever]].
story]].
** ''VisualNovel/SayaNoUta'' was once popular since the release, it's now despised in some countries and is one of the darkest [[HGame H-games]] to ever exist. Not just because it's written by Creator/GenUrobuchi himself, but the whole premise is also horrible: The protagonist, who used to have normal eyesight and senses, now has to live with his creepily distorted vision, in which ''everything he sees and senses'' becomes WombLevel except Saya, so she's the only one the protagonist who can befriend. Many players who are into H-scenes are turned off by TheReveal that [[spoiler:Saya is a malicious EldritchAbomination whose looks can make everyone GoMadFromTheRevelation, but it becomes "inverted" by his distorted vision]]. All endings are bittersweet at best and downers at worst, either: [[spoiler:have your senses repaired, only to be locked out and get separated from Saya forever; become intimate with Saya, after which she will "grow" into a giant blob of flesh to eat the planet whole; or [[EverybodyDiesEnding everyone dies]], [[TheHeroDies including the protagonist himself]], while the only character who survives suffers a GoMadFromTheRevelation and might probably commit suicide soon]]. What's even worse is although the first ending is better than the rest, it's considered as a BadEnd.
vision]].
* ''VisualNovel/BoyfriendToDeath'': The main premise is already dark: all All the male characters that a main character can romance are (almost) irredeemable and there's no other way out. [[spoiler:And at least in the first installment, [[DownerEnding all endings]] [[FailureIsTheOnlyOption are bad]], with the survival endings not much better than the endings where you die.]]out.



* ''Webcomic/{{Homestuck}}'' has [[AvertedTrope lots of well-loved characters and plenty of jokes even in the story's darker turns]], but ''Literature/TheHomestuckEpilogues'' are generally considered to be relentlessly downbeat to the point where even people who do like them have difficulty forcing themselves through some parts. Friendships break up, characters are DrivenToSuicide or die, Jane in one timeline becomes a fascist dictator and a rapist, Dirk in the other becomes a transphobic asshole who spends his time manipulating his friends' minds, and so on. Notably, in something of an AuthorsSavingThrow, ''Webcomic/Homestuck2'' has a quick synopsis of the Epilogues accessible from every page so that people don't have to actually slog through the real thing to get up to date.

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* ''Webcomic/{{Homestuck}}'' has [[AvertedTrope lots of well-loved characters and plenty of jokes even in the story's darker turns]], turns, but ''Literature/TheHomestuckEpilogues'' are generally considered to be relentlessly downbeat to the point where even people who do like them have difficulty forcing themselves through some parts. Friendships break up, characters are DrivenToSuicide or die, Jane in one timeline becomes a fascist dictator and a rapist, Dirk in the other becomes a transphobic asshole who spends his time manipulating his friends' minds, and so on. Notably, in something of an AuthorsSavingThrow, ''Webcomic/Homestuck2'' has a quick synopsis of the Epilogues accessible from every page so that people don't have to actually slog through the real thing to get up to date.
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* ''WesternAnimation/TheCrampTwins was largely seen as off-putting via its generally cruel nature and obnoxious cast of characters. TheBadGuyWins is in play too often, with Lucien, our protagonist not really being any better than his brother Wayne at times. So you don't really have anyone to root for most of the time.

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* ''WesternAnimation/TheCrampTwins ''WesternAnimation/TheCrampTwins'' was largely seen as off-putting via its generally cruel nature and obnoxious cast of characters. TheBadGuyWins is in play too often, with Lucien, our protagonist not really being any better than his brother Wayne at times. So you don't really have anyone to root for most of the time.
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Added DiffLines:

* ''WesternAnimation/TheCrampTwins was largely seen as off-putting via its generally cruel nature and obnoxious cast of characters. TheBadGuyWins is in play too often, with Lucien, our protagonist not really being any better than his brother Wayne at times. So you don't really have anyone to root for most of the time.

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