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Bhaal said "No, Orin" in response to what she said about doing everything for her grandfather. He did not say "No more Orin".


* DeathOfPersonality: [[spoiler:If she becomes manic and breaks down when her grandfather's treachery is revealed, Bhaal steps in. "No more Orin" is explicitly said, before she is transformed forcibly into a mindless slayer.]]
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It is not averted, the trope is about siblings killing each other.


* CainAndAbel: Potentially the Cain to [[spoiler:the Dark Urge]]'s Abel, whom she will even refer to as 'sibling' and 'her kin.' Averted if [[spoiler:the Dark Urge is played as being just as psychotic as she is]].

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* CainAndAbel: Potentially the Cain to [[spoiler:the Dark Urge]]'s Abel, whom she will even refer to as 'sibling' and 'her kin.' Averted if While whether or not [[spoiler:the Dark Urge is played as being the good sibling or is just as psychotic evil as she is]].her]] varies by player choice, regardless the two have a bloody history. [[spoiler:Any origin other than Dark Urge will stumble upon the default Dark Urge's dead body in the temple of Bhaal, with the implication being that Orin tortured him to death. If playing as the Dark Urge, not only did Orin still betray you before the game proper, but completing the Urge questline leads you to confront her in combat in the Temple of Bhaal, where one of you will kill the other in a duel (or a proper fight with your companions if you reject the duel.)]]
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this is a (usually) comedy trope about when someone finds their admirer abhorrent, not about someone who admires abhorrent behavior.


* AbhorrentAdmirer: When the Dark Urge subjugated and empowered the Absolute with the Crown of Karsus, it was impressed by their debauchery and plan to enact bloody conquest across all Faerun in Bhaal's name, so much that it would have followed the plan had Orin not betrayed them. With the Dark Urge either out of the picture or severely weakened enough to become a pawn, the Absolute defaults to enacting the Grand Design instead.
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* AlienBlood: Something (or a lot of things) she's done to herself has resulted in her blood becoming contaminated. A companion Astarion will have to be browbeaten into doing so and it'll drop his approval significantly if you make him.

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* AlienBlood: Something (or a lot of things) she's done to herself has resulted in her blood becoming contaminated. A Despite her eagerness, a companion Astarion will have to be browbeaten into doing so drinking her blood and it'll drop his approval significantly if you make him.
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* AlienBlood: Something (or a lot of things) she's done to herself has resulted in her blood becoming contaminated. A companion Astarion will have to be browbeaten into doing so and it'll drop his approval significantly.

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* AlienBlood: Something (or a lot of things) she's done to herself has resulted in her blood becoming contaminated. A companion Astarion will have to be browbeaten into doing so and it'll drop his approval significantly.significantly if you make him.
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* AlienBlood: Something (or a lot of things) she's done to herself has resulted in her blood becoming contaminated. A companion Astarion will have to be browbeaten into doing so and it'll drop his approval significantly.
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I was very surprised to see Minthara's red eyes again after I let her take the upgrade she asked for.

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** You can also see a physical limit in how far her impersonations can go: [[spoiler:if she kidnaps a character who's accepted the [[TaintedVeins Astral]] [[BlackEyesOfEvil Tadopole]], she uses their original appearence instead when confronting you.]]
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* LaughablyEvil: His arrogance, abrasive demeanor, flowery vulgarity and complete nonchalance towards his horrifying experiments all result in some delightful BlackComedy.
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* YouHaveFailedMe: [[spoiler:Trying to use ''speak with dead'' on his corpse after you his death will have you talking with his patron god Bane instead, who will inform you that Gortash's soul is now being punished within his divine realm for his failure.]]

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* YouHaveFailedMe: [[spoiler:Trying to use ''speak with dead'' on his corpse after you his death will have you talking with his patron god Bane instead, who will inform you that Gortash's soul is now being punished within his divine realm for his failure.]]
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* YouHaveFailedMe: [[spoiler:Trying to use ''speak with dead'' on his corpse after you defeat him will have you talking with his patron god Bane instead, who will inform you that Gortash's soul is now being punished within his divine realm for his failure.]]

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* YouHaveFailedMe: [[spoiler:Trying to use ''speak with dead'' on his corpse after you defeat him his death will have you talking with his patron god Bane instead, who will inform you that Gortash's soul is now being punished within his divine realm for his failure.]]
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* FreudianExcuseIsNoExcuse: Lots of the Cult's members, including it's leaders, have some pretty messed up backstories but, while characters do acknowledge the effect of their respective traumas, no-one suggests going easy on them as a result.
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[[Characters/BaldursGateIIIClasses Classes]] | [[Characters/BaldursGateIIICompanionsAndFollowers Other Companions & Camp Followers]] | '''The Cult of the Absolute''' | [[Characters/BaldursGateIIINPCsAndFactions NPCs and Factions]] | [[Characters/BaldursGateIIITieflingRefugees The Tiefling Refugees]]-]]]

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[[Characters/BaldursGateIIIClasses Classes]] | [[Characters/BaldursGateIIICompanionsAndFollowers Other Companions & Camp Followers]] | '''The Cult of the Absolute''' | [[Characters/BaldursGateIIINPCsAndFactions NPCs and Factions]] ('''The Cult of The Absolute''' | [[Characters/BaldursGateIIITieflingRefugees The Tiefling Refugees]]-]]]
Refugees]] | [[Characters/BaldursGateIIIHouseOfHope House of Hope]])-]]]
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* NightmareFetishist: She's always wanted to be bitten by a vampire. Astarion is extremely creeped out by this.
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* EvilPowerVacuum: [[spoiler:If Gortash is killed without Ulder or Wyll Ravengard stepping up to become Grand Duke, the leadership of Baldur's Gate is left in disarray. One potential ending with a romanced Minthara can have your PlayerCharacter plot to fill the vacuum themselves.]]
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This is a comedic trope, and his hatred of her is not played for laughs.


* SitcomArchNemesis: Shares one with Astarion.

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* ChekhovsGunman: She can be encountered again in Act 3 if you have agreed to take part in her experiment.
* LastOfHisKind: She is one of the last survivors of House Oblodra, a house who was hunted down due to their associations with illithids. Araj intends to restore her house to its former glory.

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* ChekhovsGunman: She can be encountered again in Act 3 if you have agreed to take part in give her experiment.
some of your own blood for her experiments back in Moonrise Towers.
* LastOfHisKind: She is one of the last survivors of House Oblodra, a drow house who in Menzoberranzan that was hunted down destroyed during the Time of Troubles due to their associations with illithids.illithids (as well as for its matron mother's attempt to take the city from House Baenre). Araj intends to restore her house to its former glory.


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* MyBloodRunsHot: If you gave her some of your blood back in Moonrise Towers and meet her again in Baldur's Gate, she would offer you a powerful potion that causes your blood to permanently become a flammable substance upon drinking it. She would then be able to sell alchemical bombs fueled by your volatile blood if you agree to part some of your own blood again for her to make them.
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* MinionMaster: Balthazar has a huge amount of undead under his command, ranging from simple skeletons to ghouls and even a flesh golem. Like his fellow necromancer Presio from ''Baldur's Gate's'' [[VideoGame/IcewindDale sister series]], Balthazar can both speak through his minions remotely and imbue them with verbal scripts.

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* MinionMaster: TheMinionMaster: Balthazar has a huge amount of undead under his command, ranging from simple skeletons to ghouls and even a flesh golem. Like his fellow necromancer Presio from ''Baldur's Gate's'' [[VideoGame/IcewindDale sister series]], Balthazar can both speak through his minions remotely and imbue them with verbal scripts.
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* TalkingTheMonsterToDeath: The first phase of his second boss fight can be skipped if the player character succeeds in the Persuasion check to offer him to stand down before both fights with him. It won't stop him from fighting you as the Avatar of Myrkul, but it does shake his conviction enough that Myrkul decides to beckon him to him to make sure he doesn't buckle.

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* TalkingTheMonsterToDeath: The first phase of his second boss fight can be skipped if the player character succeeds in the Persuasion check to offer him to stand down before both fights with him. It won't stop him from fighting you as the Avatar of Myrkul, but it does shake his conviction enough that Myrkul decides to beckon him to him to make sure he doesn't buckle.
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Misuse. By that logic, both the Absolute Power Corrupts and Sins of the Father endings would be Stupid Evil.


* StupidEvil: Downplayed, but [[spoiler: his plan for the Accelerated Grand Design is ultimately this. Granted, a big reason it didn't work out is because Orin ruined everything by getting rid of the Dark Urge, but enslaving an Elder Brain and trying to enslave the whole Sword Coast with it was only ever going to go one way - with him either killed by people trying to fight against it, or with the Elder Brain breaking free and killing him.]]
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** [[spoiler:He considers Orin's unhinged bloodlust to be repulsive and counterproductive to his ambitions. As he states, he wants to lead Baldur's Gate, not scorch its earth. He's fine with murder, as evidenced by his relationship with pre-amnesia Dark Urge, but he sees senseless slaughter as stupid. He outright admits that one of the reasons he liked the Dark Urge is because they could actually control themself. He will always offer to work with the player character, even though they are a huge thorn in his side and he doesn't even know them if they're not the Dark Urge or Karlach, simply because he knows how much of a liability Orin is, and that she 'only cares for blood'.]]

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** [[spoiler:He considers Orin's unhinged bloodlust to be repulsive and counterproductive to his ambitions. As he states, he wants to lead Baldur's Gate, not scorch its earth. He's fine with murder, as evidenced by his relationship with pre-amnesia Dark Urge, Urge and the ''many'' deaths caused by the Cult of the Absolute and his own underlings, but he sees senseless slaughter as stupid. He outright admits that one of the reasons he liked the Dark Urge is because they could actually control themself. He will always offer to work with the player character, even though they are a huge thorn in his side and he doesn't even know them if they're not the Dark Urge or Karlach, simply because he knows how much of a liability Orin is, and that she 'only cares for blood'.]]

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* EvenEvilHasStandards: [[spoiler: Utterly repulsed by Orin's bloodlust. As he states, he wants to lead Baldur's Gate, not scorch its earth. He's fine with murder, as evidenced by his relationship with pre-amnesia Dark Urge, but he sees senseless slaughter as stupid. He outright admits a reason he liked the Dark Urge is because they could actually control themself. He will always offer to work with the player character, even though they are a huge thorn in his side and he doesn't know them if they're not the Dark Urge or Karlach, simply because he knows how much of a liability Orin is, and that she 'only cares for blood'.]]


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** [[spoiler:He considers Orin's unhinged bloodlust to be repulsive and counterproductive to his ambitions. As he states, he wants to lead Baldur's Gate, not scorch its earth. He's fine with murder, as evidenced by his relationship with pre-amnesia Dark Urge, but he sees senseless slaughter as stupid. He outright admits that one of the reasons he liked the Dark Urge is because they could actually control themself. He will always offer to work with the player character, even though they are a huge thorn in his side and he doesn't even know them if they're not the Dark Urge or Karlach, simply because he knows how much of a liability Orin is, and that she 'only cares for blood'.]]
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* EvenEvilHasStandards: [[spoiler: Utterly repulsed by Orin’s bloodlust. As he states, he wants to lead Baldur’s Gate, not scorch its earth. He’s fine with murder, as evidenced by his relationship with pre-amnesia Dark Urge, but he sees senseless slaughter as stupid. He outright admits a reason he liked the Dark Urge is because they could actually control themself. He will always offer to work with the player character, even though they are a huge thorn in his side and he doesn’t know them if they’re not the Dark Urge or Karlach, simply because he knows how much of a liability Orin is, and that she ‘only cares for blood’.]]


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* StupidEvil: Downplayed, but [[spoiler: his plan for the Accelerated Grand Design is ultimately this. Granted, a big reason it didn’t work out is because Orin ruined everything by getting rid of the Dark Urge, but enslaving an Elder Brain and trying to enslave the whole Sword Coast with it was only ever going to go one way - with him either killed by people trying to fight against it, or with the Elder Brain breaking free and killing him.]]


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** [[spoiler: Even if the player does plan to eventually work against him, he is fully right that Orin needs to be gotten rid of first. Not just because of the personal history that her and the Dark Urge have, but also because she takes one of your campmates hostage.]]
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* ChekovsGunman: She can be encountered again in Act 3 if you have agreed to take part in her experiment.

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* ChekovsGunman: ChekhovsGunman: She can be encountered again in Act 3 if you have agreed to take part in her experiment.

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