Discussion YMMV / DanganronpaV3KillingHarmony

On an only barely related note, I think that entry is an example for Franchise Original Sin, not Harsher in Hindsight.

Should we move the example then after all, if it isn't already on that page?

I'm sorry I came across as hostile. However you can't be too controlling over the examples you write here either, this is a collaborative effort and no one's trying to ruin your work. We're all trying to make this page better however we can, and I was trying to explain why I made the changes I did as clearly as I could, not offend you. Please remain respectful of others trying to help you.

I called your actions intentional as even though you saw and read why I changed your phrasing, as "enormously more controversial than the previous examples" wasn't an accurate statement since the gap really isn't that "enormous" compared to the fallout of DR 3's controversies, you very specifically chose to phrase it that way again despite this feedback. I did not mean to accuse you of lying, but it felt as though you wanted to exaggerate things to make a point in a way that you were already told didn't feel right. This is also why my edits to help strengthen your comparisons between DR 3's story and medium were meant to reflect more on your comment's defense on it, because the original phrasing proved to not elaborate itself well enough before.

Because the muffling was patched out and the touch controls are A. A skill, and B. Overpowered in DR 1 and 2.

Patch? What patch? Don’t confuse me with your talk of patching patches. The muffling’s still there.

I ahve the Vita version, and don't hear any muffling at any point.

Have you gotten to chapter 4? EDIT: sorry, I didn’t realize the patch was on the ps store.

Yes, I've played it three times. No muffling. And I didn't realize it was on the PS Store either. I just knew there wasn't muffling and had heard it was patched out at some point.

There is no real difference. Most people go with Alternate because that's the actual name, though. But one way or the other, it works fine.

One of Kodaka's biggest comments on the popularity poll was that he was surprised with how low Shinguuji was, so I think Hate Sink is definitely not the case here.

I think that could have been thinking with the logic of, say, Junko. She was popular BECAUSE she was crazy. He could have been thinking along those same lines when he said that. He probably expected him to be Love to Hate like Junko, because there's no way he wrote him with being a likable character in mind.

Yeah, he was definitely not meant to be traditionally likeable like, say, Akamatsu. I guess he expected his unique Blue-and-Orange Morality to be more appreciated kinda like it happened with Komaeda. There's also how the creepier parts of his character get Played for Laughs in the bonus modes, so he probably expected us to find it funny?

Sorta like how Genocide Jack was?

Base Breaking.

It's hard to say whether Shirogane is the scrappy or base-breaking character, but she's definitely not an ensemble darkhorse.

I personally haven't seen anyone praising her, so I vote for The Scrappy.

Base Breaking for sure. It's much more common for me to see someone having Shirogane as one of their favorites than vocals haters, but they I'm almost sure they exist.

Wow, where the hell are YOU looking, Comun? I haven't seen that much love for her at all. I've seen some, but not nearly more than her haters or those who don't care.

Pretty sure she's too important to the plot to be an "Ensemble Darkhorse" even if people did like her, but I've also yet to find that many praise her as a character or the overall mastermind. Due to the polls the page already links to I'd strongly vote for her being a Scrappy if we can only have the one trope. Dead last for Japan's official poll and second to last for Reddit's student list is rather damning I think if we're putting characters that are technically more popular than her there.

Mostly Twitter, but the most popular from what I see there is Ouma, so that's that. Most people who loved the ending have her on their top 3, as far as I see. As for haters, I only know one guy who used to send me troll spam in very broken English.

Would it be fair to just to note feelings for her may depend on what players think of the broken base nature of the ending as a whole somewhere then? That's less her being the base breaker than the plot twist element itself I think, as I've also yet to interact with anyone who does like that ending at all.

Lorealie, I don't think so. Plot twist aside, I've seen people berate her because they think she has an annoying voice, was a poorly written character and her constant shout outs wear off their welcome pretty quickly as far as humor goes.

Poorly written?

Yes. A well written one wouldn't be the obvious mastermind because nothing else is being done with her as early as chapter 4, leaving you frustrated the game's taking so long to catch up with you. This is a mystery game after all, that's kind of a red flag here and other characters in this series who weren't well utilized, like arguably Souda or Hagakure, were at least viable suspects in cases.

Badly-written or not, I can attest that I find it absolutely annoying when a character speaks in nothing but memes and shout-outs. Buuuuuut, I'm just one person among how many others...

However, it could be considered clever if she was intended to be annoying. Shirogane is obsessed with Dangan Ronpa, and her identity revolves only around fiction, like a textbook otaku. It doesn't seem likely that her constant shout-outs were *supposed* to be annoying, but I might put it in the Fridge page.

If we're defining a "Base Breaking Character" as a character the fandom is more evenly split feelings about it doesn't sound like this suits Tsumugi at all as the "hate" side's a lot more present overall.

Considering how fans took to Yamada in the past I'd figure the creators would realize this type of character is easily seen as annoying, even if they put the style of "comedy" in a more conventional looking character's mouth. Even if it's not intentional since this trait does suit the character in way it should be fine as fridge.

@Lorealie, well, to be fair, Yamada was hated by a plethora of reasons. He was a huge gross nerd, who was in love with a computer program, killed a very well loved character, maybe they thought a relatively cute girl making the shout outs really would be better received.

Well, to be honest, I haven't seen enough evidence of Tsumugi's supporters to find her a Base Breaker over a Scrappy. You also have the pools (dead last and penultimate place) proving that there's definitely not enough praise to justify her being a base breaker.

I think we can go for Scrappy by now.

I'm honestly impressed on how the sides of the fandom I see are completely different from yours. Specially Lorealie's comment about never seeing fans of the ending.

As for supporter evidence, I see fanart of her very frequently without specifically searching for it, pretty much all analysis posts about V3's society or her performance as the mastermind were positive and in a Twitter fan awards page, 9 people claimed her as her favorite characters in the series, which, if you look at the rest of awards thing, is above a big majority of the characters.

I never got the feeling she was unpopular until this discussion started.

Look, every character, no matter how hated or meant to be hated will have it's fans, having fans don't mean they aren't a scrappy. Shirogane has fans, I'm not saying she doesn't I'm saying that the amount of fans are outdone by the amount of haters, I've also seen a popular artist on tumblr who often makes very nice Shirogane fanarts, even Korekiyo and Angie, who are considered Scrappies, have tons of fanart

I just think that by her position on the popularity pools, it's inevitble for her to be considered a scrappy, specially because Angie and Korekyio are cosnidered ones, though they get about the same treatment from fans

Yeah.

Yeah, agree. I'd refrain from talking about audience reactions in the english speaking fandom until the game is officially released if that's possible.

I would understand if other people disagree though, since there's no policy that says that you have to wait till an official translation is out to add YMMV examples. But I feel like waiting would be the most sensible thing to do in this specific case.

I think opinions are opinions regardless of how well informed they are and, despite how much I hate the fake spoilers content, I still think they shouldn't be removed for "historical records" purposes.

Hmm, yeah, but a bunch of fake spoilers have been deleted (like everything involving the one about the game being actually an alternate universe where Mukuro was the mastermind). Should we put them back for archiving purposes? Or put them in another page?

I actually don't know if Urban Legend of Zelda falls under YMMV or Trivia.

Trivia. It says on its page.

I don't believe it should be added. Not only is whether or not the ending is good very YMMV, it still doesn't detract from the fact that the rest of the game is fantastic.