Too Much Fanon:: Uke

...So, I'm not really the person to be making changes to this, as Boys' Love is not something I generally touch. (I was browsing shipping tropes). But correct me if I'm wrong, isn't this article supposed to be about the character type in canon, not the character as the fans imagine them in Slash Fic? Many of the examples seem to be the later.

Sounds good, the only problem is that fan fiction is a type of work, and I suspect that the fan fiction section would quickly dominate the entire page. Perhaps making a Uke page for the ways it's done in fiction?

Turning characters into Uke-types for fanfic apparently has its own trope: Ukefication.

And a very large number of the examples are about characters that are canonically straight and on which the plot has nothing to do with Boys' Love, nor are they expressly mentioning fanfic. Oddly, Seme doesn't seem to suffer from this as much, at a casual glance.

edited 29th Nov '10 8:54:42 AM by Elle

Oh my god...maybe I shouldn't be surprised it devolved into that, but, yeah, it needs a clean-up. If Ukefication already exists, I really think the article needs to be scrubbed down to actual examples. I'm amazed what's included. Vincent Valentine, Tidus, Ichigo, Toki...jeez. There doesn't seem to be too many actual examples.

edited 29th Nov '10 5:44:14 PM by helterskelter

I think part of the reason there aren't many actual Boys' Love examples on the page is because (unless the work features a reversible couple) having a Seme and an Uke is the default state in BL. One could go through every work indexed on the Boys' Love page and simply list semes and ukes on the respective trope pages, but that's not very interesting unless there's something more to be said, hence why there aren't many legit BL examples. I don't really know whether the trope would benefit more without examples or only listing BL aversions, but a bunch of examples simply saying "such and such is the uke in this work" is pretty pointless. You may as well just point people to the works on Boys' Love page and let them figure it out for themselves (the page pictures are usually pretty telling, for starters).

^ In that case, maybe we should acknowledge the seme/uke dichotomy (as in "the smaller, more femme guy is always the reciever") in these sorts of works as the default and then only list subversions or inversions. Not a perfect solution, but it might work.

edited 22nd Dec '10 8:15:49 PM by Sparkysharps

I just cleaned this trope up of vague fanon examples, natter, and This Troper.

Just clean up blatantly wrong examples.

I have to ask; is this one of those rare gender/sexuality tropes that is not equal opportunity? That is to say... Well. There was an example for Setsuna from Mahou Sensei Negima. I'll grant I'm a little fuzzy on these things, but wouldn't being a girl kind of disqualify her from being a homosexual male?

Just sayin'.

Venus Versus Virus, Don't think Sengoku Basara belongs either.

Nowadays, the Seme/Uke system seems to be used for Yuri and even straight couples too. But I think that's only in fanon, so I don't think that a girl would count.

edited 12th May '11 6:13:21 AM by Nyarly

Uke and seme are not exclusive to yaoi. It's just that the tropes are found far more in yaoi than in yuri.

The yuri equivalent is basically that one of the girls is usually either Tall, Dark and Bishoujo or Butch, while the other is a fairly standard Girly Girl. But since lesbian sex is less inherently...ah...how shall we say...penetrative, there is a somewhat different dynamic from het or gay male sex.

But there certainly are female Uke, and clear examples should be listed.

I generally steer clear of Boys' Love as well but is there a reason Seme and Uke couldn't be merged into one article, Seme And Uke, detailing the dynamic and listing examples as Alex (Seme) and Bob (Uke)?

It just strikes me as being one trope with two characters. They're archetypes I know, but do you ever really have one without the other?

edited 12th May '11 10:45:20 AM by savage

^ Boys Love Notes already details the common combinations of semes and ukes. However it's written as...notes, rather than a trope + examples page. Also, this may seem odd but I think that even if it were a trope + examples page it wouldn't get that many legit Boys' Love examples still because stating the obvious is often boring.

I think there are examples already on the two pages where there is one without the other in non-Boys' Love works. Just because they're character types that are the romantic backbone of one genre doesn't mean they don't appear in any others.