Complete Monster Cleanup

Keep Queem for now, but keep a close eye on him.

Got an expansion for Mandroid from Transformers Earthspark as I knew beforehand but forgot during his original EP that there was a tie-in game set after the events of the Season 1 Finale that sees him making another attempt to wipe out the Transformers.

• EarthSpark: Dr. "Mandroid" Meridian is a brilliant human scientist who harbors a bigoted hatred for all Transformers after he lost his arm in their civil war. Routinely kidnapping Transformers to experiment on them, Mandroid butchers their bodies and drains them of their Energon, leaving a trail of bodies in his wake. His malice extending to anyone who allies themselves with the Transformers, Mandroid regularly tries to kill the Malto children and their parents, and mind rapes their Terran allies into his slaves. Mandroid further arranges false flag operations that endanger hundreds of humans just to stir up anger towards Transformers. In his final gambit, Mandroid murders his partner Croft, turns himself into an abomination of alien technology just to slake his destructive desires, and tries to set off a device that will kill every single Transformer on Earth—including Mandroid's own Sharkticon minions. Even after his death, Mandroid returns in the tie-in game Earthspark - Expedition through an AI duplicate of his consciousness and manipulates Bumblebee into retrieving the pieces of a Decepticon superweapon, intending on reassembling it in another attempt to wipe out the Transformers. Though the loss of his arm is a legitimate grievance, Mandroid is defined as nothing but a prejudiced, wannabe "savior" of the world, and is directly called out by the benevolent Dot—a fellow amputee and victim of the war—as being motivated by his own blind hate and lust for power.

I should probably mention that the version of Mandroid seen within the game isn't the original version of him, but an AI replica of his consciousness created as a failsafe by Mandroid. However, even if the Mandroid seen within the game is an AI replica, I feel there's enough justification in treating the AI replica seen within the game as an extension of the original Mandroid.

While I’m here, I found a character that is listed as a Complete Monster, but I’m not convinced that said character actually qualifies. Lucifer from Angel Cop is listed as a CM, but she’s also described as being Brainwashed and Crazy both on the show’s page and the trope’s Anime and Manga page, with the latter saying that she underwent this procedure in order to help humanity, and that she still believes that she’s helping people while going on rampages. Basically, it doesn't seem like she was evil before the brainwashing procedure, and she largely lacks agency.

Edited by GamerBoy18 on Mar 27th 2024 at 12:08:45 PM

@Volo: Uh not really? The continuity of masters to the main games is super loose? Sl I'm not sure it Will supr matter

Jackie I think that was yours. Mind filling in. As I swear this was discussed in ep

Edited by miraculous on Mar 27th 2024 at 8:25:21 AM

Switching to keep on Queem

Yeah, I thought Masters was its own thing separate from the main series.

Keep Queem.

Keep Queem. Likewise don't think Volo will be cut thanks to Masters.

@ACW: Kim Possible is a Disney series, Monkey Fist should be on the Disney Fan Works page.

Got it.

Masters is about as canon to the OG games as Dissidia is to Final Fantasy. Namely that it's a celebration of Pokémon rather than a new story. Unless Pokemon Legends ZA continues Volo's story, he's not going anywhere.

Edited by Klavice on Mar 27th 2024 at 6:51:37 AM

Ok then. What are your thoughts on my suggestion about Lucifer from Angel Cop?

Here is the effort post.

I know this is heavily colored by my age (the 1980s versions of DC/Marvel characters will forever remain the "real" versions to me, or at least "realer"), but...

Is anyone else bothered by New Gods – Darkseid being considered a Complete Monster? To me it's very much Depending on the Writer, and much more common in later works, post-Grant Morrison, when Darkseid truly is completely defined by his most heinous actions and goals and is truly more of a force for totalitarian evil than an entity with a personality of his own.

Older depictions (pre-Morrison) of Darkseid have him a little too much inclined to Evil Virtues, even if it's in a Lawful Evil way, a little too inclined to be in Enemy Mine situations with the heroes, a little to inclined to letting the heroes go because... (several) reasons... and that's not counting appearances in Lighter and Softer Justice League International era where he is a bit too chummy with the good-aligned New Gods characters.

Not that I would remove Darkseid as CM, I'd only expand it to the say that this only applies to Post-Morrison depictions.

So the version of Volo who showed up in ‘’Masters EX’’, barring any twist later down the line that contradicts it, is almost certainly not a CM. There’s an exchange with N at some point where N translates what Volo’s Togepi is saying, which is that she loves Volo because Volo treats her and his other Pokémon with care and kindness, which N commends. So Volo in this game gets the Even Evil Has Loved Ones treatment.

And it’s worth noting that the game treats Volo as more or less the same as the Volo from ‘’Legends Arceus’’ and says the events of that game occurred but it’s said that Rei is the kid he betrayed, battled, and tried to murder, even though Akari is also there on Pasio in the game. So there needs to be a consensus whether or not what’s shown of Volo in this game can be applied to his character from ‘’Legends Arceus’’, in which case he’d have to go from the trope. If not, then he can remain for the time being.

Edited by ANewMan on Mar 28th 2024 at 9:30:54 AM

Honestly sounds like a variant.

Got a quick trimming coming up. Now that El Sueño is back up, I noticed his current entry.

• Ghost Recon Wildlands
  • El Sueño ("The Dream") is the leader of the Santa Blanca Cartel and responsible for turning the once-prosperous Bolivia into a narco-state. Within the cartel El Sueño personally oversees and partakes in the production and distribution of cocaine, the trafficking of children, and the torture and murder of thousands; there are numerous corpses hanging from telephone poles found throughout Bolivia. El Sueno orders the kidnapping of anyone who opposes the cartel before torturing and executing them, then manipulating the mentally disabled man into turning the corpses into "meat" soup. When El Sueño learns that one of his men is an undercover DEA agent, he personally tortures the man for 47 hours straight. His acts of cruelty also extend to even the most loyal of his subordinates; should they fail him in any way, he would arrange for them to either be tortured, murdered, their loved ones kidnapped and murdered, or all the above. When the Ghosts manage to dismantle his cartel, El Sueño reveals that he made a deal with their government granting him immunity while he would use them to take down rival cartels and gloats about his victory by throwing at them a recently decapitated head of rebel leader and former ally, Pac Katari. With nearly every atrocity committed by the Santa Blanca Cartel being traced back to El Sueño, underneath his religious and charitable exterior lies a towering and brutal egotist, utterly unfeeling to the violence caused by his actions.

So, I don’t think his rapsheet 240 words, even for a spanning drug boss. He’s got a few personal crimes, with the bulk of his rapsheet is systematic.

• Ghost Recon Wildlands:
  • El Sueño ("The Dream") is the leader of the Santa Blanca Cartel, responsible for turning Bolivia into a narco-state. El Sueño personally oversees and partakes in cocaine production and distribution, child trafficking, and the torture and murder of thousands; leaving hanging from telephone poles across Bolivia. El Sueño has any opposition abducted and executed, having a mentally disturbed "cleaner" dissolve their remains. Discovering an undercover DEA agent in his cartel, El Sueño personally tortures the man over forty-seven hours. Should his subordinates fail him, he'd arrange their executions, that of their loved ones, or both. When the Ghosts manage to dismantle his cartel, El Sueño secretly makes a deal with their government for immunity, using them to take down rival cartels, gloats about his victory by presenting the recently decapitated head of rebel leader and former ally, Pac Katari. Behind nearly every one of Santa Blanca's atrocities, El Sueño's religious and charitable front masks a vicious egotist, unfeeling to the suffering he brought about.

Edited by Beast on Mar 28th 2024 at 9:16:35 AM

For characters like Darkseid, who've been around for decades with countless writers we go with Depending on the Writer and go off what they're written like most of the time, and most of the time Darkseid is written as evil incarnate, also an Enemy Mine is not inherently redeeming, it depends on why they're doing it, if they're doing solely for their own benefit that's just Pragmatic Villainy and doesn't DQ them

Will edge a keep on Volo for reasons Klavice described.

Keep Darkseid and Volo.

However... I did notice this through my browsing of the site. Father Elijah of Fallout: New Vegas has these under his tropes folder despite being listed as a Complete Monster.

• Morality Pet: Is genuinely relieved and proud to hear that Veronica survived the battle at HELIOS.

• Pet the Dog: For all his faults, he does seem to genuinely care about Veronica, who sees him as a father figure. He also had her separated from Christine due to his own homophobia. You can even find a message on his terminal intended as a goodbye note to her and as a gift (teaching her a new fighting technique).

Now I know diddly squat about Fallout, so could someone familiar with New Vegas' Dead Money DLC weigh in on this? I'm not saying this is an instant cut because I have myself proposed and landed CMs (Namely the Angelis Ethereal) who had tropes that sounded redeeming but were wholly inaccurate to the actual game, to the point of being flat out Alternative Character Interpretation (My edit that removed them can be seen here) so if these tropes could be fact checked I would be appreciative!

This came up a few moths ago, Elijah tries to gas the entire Mojave, including Veronica with him explicitly saying that only he will be left. He might've once cared for Veronica but it's gone by now

Okay, I missed that one. Thanks for the info! Should I go and cut those tropes since they are completely invalidated by his actions, and thus inaccurate to the character?

I read the effort post, and it left me confused. Is it truly accurate to say that Lucifer enjoys being evil and is in control of her actions if she was brainwashed, or is this more of a ‘Michio Yuki from MW’ type of scenario?

Definite keep Darkseid, Elijah and I think Volo

Anybody want to give more input on this?

Like Darkseid, if he develops a redeeming quality that sticks, he might have to go (think Apocalypse), but for now he's fine.

to Dr. Mandroid‘s rewrite