has made a decision that all articles in the Let's Play namespace (list of pages in that namespace) should be moved to other namespaces.
Since let's plays are usually video-based, the target namespace is usually WebVideo/. However, some are text-based, and the consensus was to handle the namspacing of those on a case-by-case basis, with Blog/, Fanfic/, and Literature/ brought up as potential targets.
Before any given article is transplanted, we should confirm that it meets the standards for being a TV Tropes work article. Note that these often serve as hybrid articles for their creators in much the same way as the Music namespace. If there is insufficient content, the articles end up becoming about the creators, violating our "no troping real people" policy.
The crucial question is whether the article has any tropable, creative content. This means that it's more than just "Alisha plays games and makes faces." What counts as tropable, creative content? Here are some examples.
- Creating a fictional/roleplaying narrative that is distinct from the game being played or the real person doing the LP.
- Using the game as a medium to craft original content: songs, videos, machinima, and so on.
- "MST'ing" or creatively riffing on the game's content, as long as it's sufficiently transformative.
What are not criteria for a tropable Let's Play by themselves?
- Adopting a quirky personality, cracking jokes, making funny faces, or overreacting to jump scares.
- Cosplaying, playing with toys, unboxing merchandise, etc.
- Having a "gimmick" that makes them stand out, such as a repeated Catchphrase, eating loudly on microphone, or calling their viewers "Doggo fam".
- Playing games in a particular way (speedrunning, evil runs, no-kill runs, etc.) that fall within what it is possible to do in the game itself, with or without mods.
- Modding the game.
- Being very popular.
- Having lots of memes arise in their fandom.
Note that the same general principles apply to any Web Video creator, especially those whose main work is in news, reviews, vlogging, and/or reaction videos.
There are a few outliers that will need to be handled on a case-by-case basis.
- After-Action Report: I would move it to literature, although it could be considered fanfic.
- Liveblogs, which are probably not tropable.
Web Video cleanup sandbox
This project has several purposes related to all things Web Video:
- Cleaning up the WebVideo index
- Cleaning up the WebVideo/ namespace to move pages that belong elsewhere
- Cleaning up individual Web Video pages that have massive issues
Overview
The easy-seeming part when I started on Web Video (the index) was just removing things not even located in the namespace— found in Creator, Film, Web Animation, etc. Then I started noticing there were many things put in Web Video (the namespace) that were basically Creator pages, lots of Let's Play, other video game streaming that doesn't currently have an index, other misuses in index and/or namespace placement...
- original live action, meaning not animated or reusing existing footage;
- narrative/creative, a bit unclear, but it's not someone simply reviewing another work/reacting to other works/playing through another work;
- a work, which is... a work, not a creator.
) is much more broad:
"Live-action videos and video-based Lets Plays originally or only released online. Covers both YouTube videos and web-exclusive series, but does not include those that belong in the WebAnimation/ namespace. For big-budget series exclusive to streaming services such as Netflix, use Series/ or the appropriate animation namespace instead." — Not limited to original or live action footage, narrative works, etc. However, people have mistakenly created Web Animation pages in this namespace, made what are essentially creator pages, typed it as "Webvideo", etc.
:
Reaction channels tend to straddle a line here, but are not generally tropable unless they create some sort of distinct creative endeavor rather than stare at a video and laugh a bit. Also it helps if they are reacting to fiction, not to real life. The latter may be entertaining but falls into the same general category as gossip. We can trope these only for their use of production and artistic tropes, not for their topics.
-
No Analysis Channel index— corrected! - No index for non-Let's Play video game streaming unless they're on Twitch. If they don't fall into the Let's Play format and aren't on Twitch, where do they go?
- No
Gag Dub orGag Sub index - Where should we put channels based on prank calls, scam-baiting, other audio-based things where the video is incidental?
Pages identified for cleanup:
- A Dose of Buckley — see this ATT for more info
- The Mysterious Mr. Enter and subpages — issues include troping the creator and not the works
- The Nostalgia Critic and subpages — see this project thread
- Smosh and subpages — Smosh is a channel, and the pages have multiple works (may need a hard split)
- Thomas Sanders — Creator, lots of biographical details, previously hard split for Sanders Sides but may need another
See also:
- Cleanup: Review/Let's Play YMMV Tropes
- TLP: Actual Play genre/index
Just the index cleanup itself is a considerable project, figuring out what stays and what needs a different index, but there are also many pages with significant issues to clean. This is a very big project, but I've seen other people notice these issues, too. I hope we can at least get the index under control.
(![[nja]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/user_ninja_2074.png "[nja]"){kind=small}
For clarity and re: review stuff. Continue to edit as things occur that are useful to keep at the top of the thread.)
Edited by GastonRabbit on Dec 2nd 2023 at 9:02:00 AM
Friends forevermore
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Leaning cut on this one.
As someone who has watched James Stephanie Sterling for years, I can confirm that there IS an element of alter ego acting at work, as their offscreen persona is way different from their onscreen one (they dress up as a dictator and generally act far more hostile, combatative and pugnacious than they are in real life) and there are quite a few recurring jokes and visuals that I think can be troped. That said, the majority of what they cover is the real life workings of the games industry and looking over the tropes I don't think there's many that can be kept. At the very least, the subpages like heartwarming and tearjerker need to go as that's all real life content and nothing else.
Edited by Atlantis1930 on Nov 12th 2023 at 5:04:39 PM
(he/any)
If anyone else would like to help, I would appreciate assistance in changing wicks to Yogscast Minecraft Series to the appropriate series page where applicable, there's still a lot to go through... I'm slowly getting there, though.
As soon as that's done I can properly dig through the Yogs pages left in Let's Play to move stuff where they go and see what we can cut.
And I guess if no one disagrees I'll go ahead and cut Call Me Carson, since it looks like we're of the opinion that he's not tropable?
Edited by Serilly on Nov 12th 2023 at 1:37:10 AM
LP Deprecation Cleanup | Ask me about SMPLive
Ambassador of Eurogames and Touhou Music
I feel that Jimquisition should be kept because it features meaningful discussion about elements in video games and why they show up. It's not just one of those "random person streams video games while talking about their life" shows.
This thread had quite a bit of support for allowing pages for works with meaningful trope analysis, and as I brought up there, I think "is the presenter enough of a fictional persona?" is a bad way to determine whether such a show deserves a page because the substance of the work is the analysis, not whether it's coming from a "sufficiently fictional" persona.
Edited by MathsAngelicVersion on Nov 13th 2023 at 12:57:09 PM
Lots of coffee
If crosswicking examples on that page would benefit an audience's understanding of the trope in media, I think there's worth in keeping it. So if James Stephanie effectively breaks down certain tropes, trivia-related tactics, audience reactions, etc, I see worth in keeping them.
I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.
Came across Super Butter Buns today and it looks to be mostly RL troping or troping her actions in games she streams. The description says her content is mostly tips guides for beginners in video games and streams of her playing games, both of which I don't believe are tropeworthy.
CSP Cleanup Thread | All that I ask for ... is diamonds and dance floors
(he/any)
I would agree that page doesn't look salvageable
Agreeing as well.
Also, on the subject of Jimquisition, whilst I agree with keeping the main page I still maintain that the Heartwarming , Awesome and Tearjerker pages at the very least need a thorough review as nearly all of the entries are about real life moments.
EDIT: I have added Super Butter Buns to the cutlist as it seems we're in agreement.
Edited by Atlantis1930 on Nov 14th 2023 at 3:53:13 PM
(he/any)
I will remove their page from the Lets Play Wick Sorting sandbox then
Bringing up Slimecicle again, I finally split Slimecicle Cinematic Universe, which much of the page was about, so now we just need to figure out how tropable what's left is. I proposed earlier in the thread that given how many works he's in that have a page on here we could also turn him into a creator page?
Edited by Serilly on Nov 14th 2023 at 9:34:05 AM
LP Deprecation Cleanup | Ask me about SMPLive
Hrm, this seems like where I should cross-reference my Ask The Tropers Thread on where to put a Web Video creator's page.
"I'm looking to make a page for Monster Island Buddies, a Youtube channel best known for Monster Island Buddies which shares its name, but obviously there are collision problems here.
The creator is generally referred to as MIB in the videos, so I'm thinking of making WebVideo.MIB, or Creator.Monster Island Buddies since that's still what the channel is formally known as."
Found a Youtube Channel with political stances you want to share? Hop on over to this page and add them.
(he/any)
Creator pages don't get YMMV pages so I'm not seeing a world where Creator.Monster Island Buddies would cause notable collision? If absolutely necessary you could disambiguate, but I wouldn't use MIB as that's a common acronym in general.
You're half right. Creator/ pages don't get YMMV pages... except for their work(s) that don't have separate pages. So if Creator.Monster Island Buddies gets made, then it would get a YMMV page for all his non-WebVideo.Monster Island Buddies videos since that would be troped under that Creator page same as if I made WebVideo.MIB.
As of right now, there's no play to trope, say, MIB's Video Game Reviews even if they're tropable content.
Edited by Larkmarn on Nov 14th 2023 at 3:40:51 PM
Found a Youtube Channel with political stances you want to share? Hop on over to this page and add them.
(he/any)
I've started a sandbox for pages currently in the Web Video namespace that probably shouldn't be: Web Video – Wrong Namespace
LP Deprecation Cleanup | Ask me about SMPLive
He/Him
So, I guess we're fine with keeping WebVideo.The Rageaholic? I didn't see anyone oppose keeping him.
Art Museum Curator and frequent helper of the Web Original deprecation project
(he/any)
I'm not sure, I can't tell how much of that is a persona
~War Jay 77 Here's our thread, and here's the Let's Play sandbox: Lets Play Wick Sorting o7
Edited by Serilly on Nov 17th 2023 at 6:06:09 AM
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Big Catch, Sparkle Edition
Oh, I've been to this thread lmao I thought I remembered there being an LP specific thread though. Like I have distinct memories of that so I assumed it was what you meant. My memory may have lied though.
So, anything on the sandbox that needs further discussion?
Edited by WarJay77 on Nov 17th 2023 at 9:14:22 AM
Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
(he/any)
I think there was one but it was just policy discussion and not a project thread?
Right now I'm still unsure on what to do with Slimecicle now that Slimecicle Cinematic Universe has been split out. There's a post above talking about that.
There's a couple pages in the sandbox that can definitely just be moved but some of them like Dream have a ton of wicks. There's also a lot of pages that look potentially salvageable or look like they're untropable but that I'm just not really familiar with and the pages are in a state where it's hard to tell/I don't want to just assume
Edited by Serilly on Nov 17th 2023 at 6:17:16 AM
LP Deprecation Cleanup | Ask me about SMPLive
Big Catch, Sparkle Edition
Maybe? I remember it being used as a cleanup but I could be wrong. Or it's a thread that fell so far into the backlog nobody cares.
Ah well, yeah I've been lurking here but I always procrastinate on pitching in.
Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
(he/any)
A lot of it so far has mostly just been sorting things in the sandbox into "this looks like it could be salvaged" and "this looks beyond repair/just untropable" folders and cutting really obvious offenders. It's a slow process.
Linking since it got buried, but here's the post where I proposed making Slimecicle into a creator page again.
Edited by Serilly on Nov 17th 2023 at 6:23:40 AM
LP Deprecation Cleanup | Ask me about SMPLive
Big Catch, Sparkle Edition
Creator's page seems fine to me.
Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
the Retromancer
Slimecicle has non-letsplay game reviews that very probably can stay at Web Video. Plus 2 videos with an attempt to start live action content.
Edited by Amonimus on Nov 17th 2023 at 9:46:22 PM
TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
(he/any)
I'm fine moving him to Web Video if we think there's enough tropable content left.
LP Deprecation Cleanup | Ask me about SMPLive
9 days late but oh geez, I remember the Rageaholic. It's not a persona, he's just genuinely quite an angry person, his tropes page is pretty similar to Mauler or Critical Drinker in that it's just a list of his opinions and things he likes and dislikes.
Big Catch, Sparkle Edition
How can you be sure it's not a character?
I mean the page probably needs to be cut anyway just for lacking creative tropes, but to me it seems like his rage could be entirely exaggerated as it is for most online reviewers.
Edited by WarJay77 on Nov 27th 2023 at 11:02:04 AM
Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
Anyone familiar with Jimquisition? It mentions Alter-Ego Acting, but I'm not confident in it from the trope list.
TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup