Unclear Description: Tall Dark And Handsome

The article does go into the history of the term and instances of its usage a little, but while the trope image and mention of Clark Gable help narrow things down, the description doesn't really go into specifics as to what exactly the trope entails.

Is it strictly a Personal Appearance Trope? Or are some elements of personality and in-universe presentation, such as a refined demeanor or high charisma, also necessary? And just how specific a combination of traits is necessary for an example to fulfill criteria? For example do the characters have to be tall, or can they be short and fit all the other traits? And are we defining dark as dark hair specifically or is dark skin often a consideration?

As far as the examples on the page go, I don't really see anything that comes off as a blatant misuse of the trope; most of them stick with the basic gist of "somewhat aloof, classically handsome person with dark hair and serious disposition", primarily because pop cultural osmosis means most people have a general idea of what qualifies. Most of the invocation and parody examples are pretty straightforward. But the subversions, and the second half of the page as a whole, are very YMMV due to how unclear the definition of the trope is to begin with.

edited 20th Feb '17 12:43:53 PM by AlleyOop

Opening and clocking.

I'm not a western man, so I wanna understand what "dark" means to you guys. (Assuming you aren't confused yourself.)

Dark hair ( dark brown or black, not blond, sandy, red, grey or silver. Definitely not white.); dark eyes (deep hazel or brown not blue or clearly green); dark-ish skin tone, (not ivory or pale; may be suntanned).

edited 20th Feb '17 5:26:33 PM by Madrugada

Asian?

No, not usually. Not really ethnic at all, beyond "apparently of European descent", but if they are, more like Italian or Spanish. But really,skin tone has to be simply "not pale. Tom Hiddleson, for example, has the dark hair and dark eyes, but his complexion is right on the edge of "too pale" depending on the role.

As a native English speaker the "dark" part has never been clear to me either, but experience seems to suggest it refers to hair, with some loose favoritism towards tanned complexions. From what I can tell a hard minimum of dark hair (medium brown is extremely borderline) is necessary to qualify.

But from what I'm aware they can be any ethnicity. White or East Asian with Raven Hair, Ivory Skin, a tanned Latin Lover, a black person of any complexion as the current trope description itself indicates can all qualify, as well as everything in between. As long as their wardrobe itself leans towards dark colors. So a character who fits all the other traits such as having dark skin, tan complexion, and a refined and mysterious persona, but is a Man In White would not qualify. Likewise there might exist a possible gray area where some instances of Dark Skinned Blond may qualify in spirit.

It's one of those flexible tropes where, I forget the exact word or if a word even exists for it (maybe multiple realizability? at least outside the purview of philosophy), but there are different ways it can be fulfilled, as long as said example demonstrates at least some if not all of the criteria, and which ones don't have to be the same from example to example.

edited 20th Feb '17 9:31:44 PM by AlleyOop

I suspect (though I'm not old enough to confirm for sure, despite being a bit of an old fogy) that it has to do with older stereotypes of (I think) southern Europeans, e.g. Spanish or Italian. Who are traditionally supposed to be "hot blooded" and extra-romantic. And, traditionally, somewhat darker-skinned than those pale Northern Europeans.

I've heard it a lot about lighter skinned people as well (sometimes pale vampires), as long as they have dark hair and are reasonably tall. They also tend to wear dark clothes.

Considering that the Distaff Counterpart to this trope is Aloof Dark-Haired Girl, I've always assumed that the "dark" part of Tall, Dark, and Handsome refers to hair colour.

Yeah, it's the hair color. A light skinned vampire is quite often this, yeah.

That's not quite the distaff of this one, they are quite different. I don't know why the page claims it though, the pages read completely differently.

edited 21st Feb '17 12:40:53 AM by Memers

It's because the old name was Tall, Dark and Bishoujo, and there is some sort of functional overlap in that Tall, Dark, and Handsome characters often have some sort of similar in-universe idealization and are often if not required to be aloof, distant, or mysterious figures.

Well if we actually want it to be the spear to that it needs a big rewrite, get rid of the ladykiller and Clark Gable yada and bring up the unapproachable aloofness, confidence, The Stoic aspects, coolness, mystery and The Ace-like aspects and such.

The big poster child of this trope imo, to the point of parody, would be the MC of Havent You Heard Im Sakamoto.

edited 21st Feb '17 2:39:09 AM by Memers

Part of the reason that the trope was renamed I think was that it wasn't an exact Distaff Counterpart and that the title was misleading. Regarding Clark Gable, for what it's worth there was a documentary about him that went by "Tall Dark and Handsome" so apparently he's considered a strong example of the trope.

In the meanwhile I found this article that delves into the history of the term including the fact that it was once applied to women, though of course tropes evolve over time.

So far I think we've established that at the least, the description needs to make it clear that the "dark" refers to hair color, and that having dark hair is a prerequisite for this trope.

I guess I get what the term (and perhaps the trope) is trying to say: "This mostly dark-colored man (in outfit, hair or maybe skin) is dashing/charming". Those who always look dandy and well-groomed and ready to attract women everywhere.

Both Aloof Dark-Haired Girl and this are charming, but they're done differently, I guess? (and not just in the different gender sense)

I'd say dark refers more to general aesthetic (ie: dark hair, dark clothes, possibly dark eyes like brown as a bonus)

Not necessary skin tone.

Now that we have established the characteristics (dark = dark hair color, skin tone doesn't matter), can we focus on other points raised:

• The "dark" part must be put in the description (wording ideas)
• The examples list looks fairly ZCE / YMMV
  • I believe having the Subversion section above the Straight section has led to a number of straight examples end up in the wrong section (clean up necessary)