Legends of Tomorrow, the Flash/Arrow spin-off

i'm more concerned by that accent

Maybe it's some convoluted plan to get the Legends to find him. Make a movie, send it to someone in the present that can get a message to the Legends.

edited 8th Dec '16 6:04:48 PM by Mullon

Never trust anyone who uses "degenerate" as an insult.

i.. is mick gonna end up being the present vixen's grandpa?

Who knows?

That's gonna be pretty crazy though.

And yeah, it wasn't until I got a close up of his face that I realized that it really was Arthur Davril.

He sounds so completely different without his accent.

One Strip! One Strip!

I love that Rip Hunter is now directing what looks like a low budget sci-fi show in the 1960s. Because, well, you know.

Also: Mick Rory has a death wish. Of course Mick Rory has a death wish. Man, somehow Dominic Purcell imbues Heat Wave with a lot more character than he really should have.

Also also: the Legion of Campy Doom is so much better than last seasons Vandal Savage.

it might explain Mari's anger issues, heh.

that was a pretty good episode. Poor Martin, he keeps getting tortured this is what, the fourth time? Good fight scenes, I desperately appreciated Clarissa's theme playing when Marin was on the dock, and I really enjoyed Micks character.

it could have done without Snart hallucinations, IMO, but w/e.

Got a degree in Emotional trauma via fictional characters aka creative writing. hosting S'mores party in Hell for fellow (evil) writers

I kept expecting the reveal that it wasn't a hallucination and Snart was really there and Mick just assumes he's a figment of his imagination.

You fell victim to one of the classic blunders!

Forget the Flash, Rip "The Last Centurion" Hunter is the most meta human in all of time, oh ho ho.

I definitely feel like with the crossover taken care of the shows can actually go back to making some sense again. The Legion of Doom is shaping up well, Malcolm was neutered because he doesn't have a good hand, but Eobard definitely proved to be the biggest threat the team has faced. The anti-speedster gun was disappointing, neutralizing him for 5 seconds makes it far less effective than an actual gun.

Not fond of the constant movie references, we get enough of that from Cisco. And the whole This Is Reality claim is rather absurd compared to all the historical factual mistakes the show already makes.

I can't wait to learn in what way Eobard's plan is applicable to fucking with Barry's life. Because it's always about Barry. It's Eobard, after all.

Seriously, though, the general theme here seems to be undoing deaths - Eobard knows that he was erased from history (even though he technically escaped that timeline after Flashpoint... somehow... it's complicated), or maybe he's just trying to change reality so that Barry isn't the Flash and he is. Malcolm is evidently trying to bring Tommy back (if he is, there goes the theory that Tommy is Prometheus). And Darkh of course is trying to undo his horrible fated defeat.

Cold is evidently going to be there at some point, with them trying to reverse his death no doubt. But no superteam - good or evil - is complete with less than five members. Who else do you think might work here? I can't help but feel this concept would hit peak awesomeness if there was one more show from which to draw villains from.

Although... Supergirl, maybe..?

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.

I'm guessing Vandal Savage, because they've got two Arrow villains and two Flash villains (even if one of them was a hero on Legends) already. Savage is about the only Legends villain they feasibly *could* use. Unless they wanna pluck someone out of Jonah Hex's rogues gallery, I suppose.

What about the Fantastic Four? And the Fearsome Four, their enemies? My own belief is that a team should be from 4 to 8.

edited 9th Dec '16 5:50:52 AM by tricksterson

Trump delenda est

I didn't care for this episode as much as I thought I would:

• Obviously we have to have some contrivances for Thawne to not just impale the Legends with their own severed hands in the first nanosecond of the fight but good god he might be an even bigger f'ck-up than Barry. The Legends didn't even do the smart thing and have Gideon lock down parts of the ship to keep him contained.
• Thawne only took Sara and Gray when he could have captured all of them. Contrivances
• Jax getting the better of Thawne was...
• Almost as questionable as Thawne pausing to take the amulet from Heatwave and Amaya shooting him in the back, but at least that was funny.
• "The effects of the [Cold Gun] are only temporary!" Really Thawne? Really? If that's the case the Speed Force really does hate Barry Allen.
• Somehow Merlyn gets to look cool in a fight, while simultaneously showing off his Badass Decay. They didn't even give him a bow and arrow. Why not have him take out Capone's men at the start of the episode to introduce him in a badass way and illustrate the effectiveness of the team-up?
• So did Thawne think it was a smart idea to bring in an archer, but not to go forward and get Damien Darhk his magic which was kicking everybody's asses in Season 4?
• Not a fan of Snart coming back this way. A) him coming back as his selfish old self sounded more interesting than the typical "force ghost" bullshit sci-fi shows love doing.B) Why would Rory "hallucinate" Snart acting selfish when Snart's last actions were heroic, and seem to have a significant hold on Mick's current personality? Why is Rory hallucinating at all?
• So are Amaya and Rory a thing now or...?

But:

• How the entire mini-Legion of Doom here is made up of white guys. That's somewhat refreshing given how diverse the heroes are.
• The first major villain team-up since Frost and Silver Banshee and Thawne does most of the leg work sure, but the banter between him and Darhk is fun.
• The role-reversal between Sara and Stein was interesting.
• I imagine Thawne learning that Stein has a daughter is going to be important later.
• ...Rip Hunter, movie director of his own life? What?
• The Spear of Destiny. IIRC DC actually had Hitler use that in the old comics as a "shield." The reason Superman couldn't fly to Nazi Germany and punch Hitler in the jaw was because he had the spear. Nice inclusion.
  • And I'd wager we're going to have a Nazi Germany episode before this series is done. That should be neat.

edited 9th Dec '16 7:45:02 AM by Soble

I'M MR. MEESEEKS, LOOK AT ME!

Eh. Five seconds is enough time to put a bullet in someone's head. Even a Speedster.....well, maybe not them. If they get their speed back one second before the bullet gets them, they can still dodge.

One Strip! One Strip!

to be fair the last time we saw barry get hit with the cold gun was in episode...4, I want to say, though snart might have hit him in 22. he didn't in 16 or 10 or anything past season 1, and we know that one: this wasn't the original Cisco built cold gun and two: Thawne was a lot faster than Barry circa season 1, so the cold gun only getting him for a bit isn't /really/ that big a deal honestly? by far one of the more minor continuity issues.

Got a degree in Emotional trauma via fictional characters aka creative writing. hosting S'mores party in Hell for fellow (evil) writers

Am thinking Ray will probably be working on making the gun more effective.

Trump delenda est

There's also the anti-speedster nanites from the end of season 1, which Eobard just vibrated out of his body whenever he felt like.

That fight also ended with someone taking advantage of the brief moment in which he was still un-speed-ed to sucker hit him.

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.

...Ray invented those. I wonder why he didn't invent more of them. also Martin may not recognize Eobard's face but I'd hope he knows the name and the red lightning.

Got a degree in Emotional trauma via fictional characters aka creative writing. hosting S'mores party in Hell for fellow (evil) writers

The Legion never mentioned Thawne's name around the Legends. And most speedsters have red or yellow lightning, so that doesn't say much.

He might not know his name is Eobard Thawne (although I don't really know why they wouldn't tell Stein about Eddie Thawne's sacrifice and why that worked), but wouldn't he still recognize the yellow... Actually, the Legends haven't actually been around when Thawne's been wearing his Reverse Flash costume, have they? He's always worn plainclothes in front of them, correct me if I'm wrong. And they wouldn't know his face, right? That's...pretty cool, actually.

Stein was around to see Eddie's sacrifice, which is probably why no one's brought up the possibility of it being the Reverse Flash: when someone's been Ret Goned, you generally assume they're out of the picture for good.

"It takes an idiot to do cool things, that's why it's cool" - Haruhara Haruko

It wasn't the Cold Gun, it was just a generic "Anti-Speedster" weapon.

To be fair, I don't think he would be able to use it, considering he has only one hand. Although, hey, they gave Coulson and Ash mechanical hands, so why not Malcolm?

Eh, I can buy that Thawne has to stick with this Damien, since the other Damien isn't just busy with Team Arrow, he might not want to team up at that point.

edited 9th Dec '16 12:39:17 PM by alliterator

Malcolm can still use a bow with his mechanical hand. We saw it in the last few episodes of Arrow season 4. It's his off hand, so he just has to use it to hold the bow.

I just had a totally crazy theory.

This episode had Gideon mention that she can repair brain damage, and Nate jokes about why she hasn't done that for Mick. And Gideon (seemingly) jokes back, "What makes you think that I haven't?"

But what if that wasn't a joke? What if she's behind Mick's hallucinations of Snart? What if Gideon is able to keep a record of the team's brain patterns (we know she can see their dreams, after all, so that sort of technology has precedence) and then rewire someone else's brain so it can contain another person's memories and personality? She could have recorded Snart's brain patterns sometime during Season 1, then put them in Mick's head during those 70+ years he was in stasis under the sea, and Mick's visions of Snart are those brain patterns bubbling to the surface.

"It takes an idiot to do cool things, that's why it's cool" - Haruhara Haruko

Doesn't seem all that crazy to me. I imagine the Legion will snag a pre-Heel–Face Turn version of Snart for themselves, but the show's going to want to have some way of bringing back the heroic version eventually, even if it's just to say goodbye.