Toy Story 3... I still don't get it.

OK guys, look.

I almost like Toy Story 3. It's a passable movie, a mostly decent ending to the series, it has some good points - several, in fact. The escape scenes are interesting and well written, Lotso's a great villain, the animation is pretty neat, there's some charm to it, and it has a warm ending that wraps up the story well. And hey, it's still Toy Story at the end of the day.

But sometimes I feel like one of the very few people who regard it not only as the weakest movie in the trilogy, but much, much weaker than the first two movies. Hell, Toy Story 2 is my favourite movie ever, and as as result it makes Toy Story 3 seem so far behind it when I compare them.

Just tonight, I re-watched Toy Story 3. I wanted to like it more. I wanted it to finally hit me. I wanted to finally scream "Yes! This movie is fantastic! It's a Pixar classic!".

...But no. In fact, after viewing it tonight, I has still left me cold, wanting more. I mean, it's mostly good, it's certainly not a bad movie. But in my honest opinion, this movie had dozens of flaws which seriously bring it down. It's very inconsistent to me. At times it ticks along well - at others, it's like watching a child's nightmare.

Indeed, the biggest one is how uncomfortably dark it is. I mean... Dear God. This movie has way too many moments that, even as a 21 year old, make me go "Uggggh!!!". For example, the entire scene where you see the toys being damaged by those toddlers is a complete train wreck, a scene that I find painfully unfunny and hard to watch. In fact, we see this scene twice. And the toys retain all the paint stains and damages they get from this torture throughout the movie, like injuries. It's uncomfortable. Really uncomfortable. What were Pixar thinking?

But that isn't just it. The general plot of the movie I just find so lacking in humour and way too focused on showing us how depressing Sunnyside is. It's constantly dark, ugly, tense and edgy. The colour scheme is so often murky and for me, renders almost every joke unfunny because they can't be appreciated in such gloomy atmosphere.

Then there's that screaming monkey. That monkey might be one of the most terrifying and obnoxious characters in the Pixar canon. Big Baby I also found to be creepy, like some kind of possessed child. Even Chuckles, and that phone. They're both evil-looking clowns. They're not evil, but they look it. Why, Pixar? Why?! Is this a family movie, or not?

In fact, when I think of the movie, those dark, ugly scenes are all I think about. I instantly see Big Baby's possessed face, the toys being abused by those toddlers, that horrendous monkey, the toys being jailed by and yelled at by the evil version of Buzz, etc. So it doesn't even bring good thoughts to mind. If this were like a dark parody of Toy Story, I'd be fine with it. But I feel honestly disturbed when I think about how it's supposed to be so heartwarming and grand.

And also, that bloody incinerator scene. This is the scene which so many people regard as Pixar's finest moment. To me, yes, it is pretty gripping and powerful... but did it truly move me? No! Sorry, but I've always found it pretty manipulative and predictable, a scene designed to play on the emotions of nostalgic viewers, and I find it far less entertaining than Buzz and Woody's miraculous escape from Sid in TS 1 and that solid gold moment in TS 2 where Woody and Jessie escape the plane taking off, to me possibly the best moment in all film (though, I think TS 2 has loads of moments which are just as perfect as that one).

So, why do people think so highly of it? Many people - and I mean MANY people - regard Toy Story 3 is untouchable, the greatest animated film ever. ...Are we even watching the same movie? How can a movie with so many horrific, depressing elements and scenes of pain and torture be considered the greatest? I mean, okay, I think Toy Story 2 is the greatest movie of all time, so yes, you can call me a hypocrite for thinking highly of a Toy Story movie as well. But to me, Toy Story 2 does EVERYTHING right. Every little detail in that movie is solid gold perfect, and that's why it has 100% on Rotten Tomatoes. I can't see why anyone would even think of ranking TS 3 above it. So many people say how everyone HAS to like it and worship it, and if you don't you're a monster.

I just don't get it. I really do not get it. I hate to say it, but Toy Story 3 is, to me at least, unbelievably overrated and doesn't deserve the praise it gets. Every time I see it ranked #1 in animated movie lists, or at least ahead of the first two movies, I actually cringe and swear under my breath. Can someone here please explain to me how this movie is so widely regarded as better than the first two? (Apart from the most obvious and overused explanation "the ending made me cryyyyyy!!! It was my childhood!!!")

At least it's better than Shrek Forever After. I'm going to be nice and give it a 5/10. I just wish I could give it more.

edited 26th Nov '14 5:50:21 PM by TT454

All of the things you complain about are basically why people enjoy this movie. for example:

That scene is not supposed to be funny at all. It is to show how cruel and ruthless Lotso is and how living in Sunnyside is a truly terrible place.

It is exactly because Pixar was willing to go so far and be so dark that makes toy story 3 such a great film, it made the story much more powerful. it's still probably my favorite pixar film.

if you don't like dark stuff, that's fine, but that does not make toy story 3 underwhelming.

"That scene is not supposed to be funny at all. It is to show how cruel and ruthless Lotso is and how living in Sunnyside is a truly terrible place."

Exactly. THAT'S THE PROBLEM.

The fact that such a majority of this movie takes place in such a dystopian location is the movie's biggest flaw, and it doesn't make the movie powerful, but rather tedious and cold. At least Sid's room in the first movie was at times comical.

Toy Story 3 doesn't really do anything that The Brave Little Toaster didn't already do and better long before.

There, I said it.

I suppose, dare I say it, that these people think that because this film is Darker and Edgier than all the other films in the franchise, it's quite obviously the best in the series because of that darkness.

Or, alternately, it really struck a chord with the vast majority of people and that's why they love it.

I would say the latter of these two scenarios.

My negative feelings towards it aren't nearly as strong as yours, but I get where you're coming from. I've never understood the "Darker and Edgier = good" mentality. I personally find the second one the best.

edited 26th Nov '14 6:50:35 PM by Mort08

It's Earn Your Happy Ending. What matters is that they got through all of the dark stuff and were all the better for it.

I'm curious - what did you want out of the film?

Also:

Isn't this what movies are supposed to do, affect people emotionally? I fail to see how the scenes from the first two movies are any different from this one.

edited 26th Nov '14 7:00:38 PM by KarkatTheDalek

My biggest problem with the movie was that for a large portion of it, one of the most major characters wasn't that character, namely, Buzz. Buzz para Espanol? No. So essentially we have a character who isn't who he is supposed to be and doesn't develop any. Not interesting, not entertaining.

However, Bonnie was a bright point of the film for me, I'm a sucker for adorably cute children.

I think the biggest problem the movie has is it's too overhyped. It IS more emotional and deeper than the other two (although, as I've said before, it does it in a way that was hardly new or revolutionary, as many seem to think), but that comes at the expense of some of the 'fun' sense of the other two.

So basically, while my brain may say 3 was the best one, my heart may say otherwise. My heart already suffers way too much in real life. So my heart isn't enthused by fictional suffering-but-guess-what-everything-is-okay-after-all! unless it's done in a really new and exciting way. Which TS 3, good as it is, doesn't really deliver.

Whether it's interesting is up in the air, but I strenuously disagree that it isn't entertaining.

Your heart pumps blood through your body. It tells you nothing.

To the OP, just curious, did you at all enjoy any of the other Toy Story films or did you find them underwhelming as well.

I have a theory, but I'm going to hold off saying until I hear your response.

Spanish Buzz was one of Pixar's funniest moments...along the stuff like 'Ms. Nesbitt" and "YOU TELL ME WHERE MY SUIT IS, WOMAN!"

I still say that TS 3 is my fourth favorite Pixar because of how it tugs at your heartstrings. You had to have grown up with the first two to understand why 3 strikes a chord with people.

Why do you think a Pixar movie is required to be comical? I found the overall serious, melancholic tone of TS 3 incredibly gripping from beginning to end.

this is extremely ymmv and even if i agreed with it i don't see how it matters.

Darker and Edgier can be good or bad. I would argue that TS 3 is a case of it being good because it made the film more emotionally impactful and yes, mature. part of growing up is realizing that the world isn't always a welcoming place.

edited 26th Nov '14 7:50:17 PM by wehrmacht

Which is why the movie loses a lot of punch when you already learned that lesson well long, long ago.

Maybe to you, but it's never stopped being a gripping concept for me.

Eh, it's a lesson worth repeating.

With that kind of logic you can basically dismiss any lesson ever because it's already been repeated ad naseaum by media, regardless of where the story's tone falls in the scale of cynicism and idealism. it's not about how many times the lesson has been preached, it's about how well-executed it is.

But it isn't any really better executed than when it was done in many, many other works out there, yet it keeps being hailed as the Holy Grail of that lesson.

"The world is cruel and unwelcoming" (which is the only "lesson" that has been mentioned in this thread so far) is such a broad and all-encompassing idea that can be executed in so many different ways that it seems pretty pointless to me to compare them based on that. I would not even say that Toy Story 3 is about that in particular, it just goes further than the previous two films and shows many of the darker implications of the universe pixar created in a very gripping fashion.

I have not seen the Brave Little Toaster in a very long time. I am sure it is a great film, but I do not think that it is comparable to TS 3 in the sense that many people grew up with Toy Story 1 and 2 and were of Andy's age in Toy Story 3, which strikes a chord in conjunction with the fact that the film is overall darker and more serious.

I feel pretty comfortable saying that Toy Story 3 is one of my favorite films of all time and one of Pixar's crowning achievements as a studio. Not simply because it's Darkerand Edgier, but because it's Darkerand Edgier done in the best possible way with Pixar's usual strong storytelling. I don't really begrudge anyone having a different opinion since people look for different things in their media anyway, but overrated or not I would still argue it's a pretty great movie.

edited 26th Nov '14 8:08:30 PM by wehrmacht

Which makes me wonder if the whole positive reception of the film is due to nostalgia.

If, as said, it really struck a chord because the generation that grew up with the original films matured with Andy... Can it be appreciated as a film without that?

edited 26th Nov '14 8:08:56 PM by Aldo930

I agree with Napoleon. But then again, since TBLT is my third favorite movie ever, that just made me like TS 3 more.

I'm not exactly sure why people keep screaming at Toy Story 3 being too dark for viewing. It's not like any of the other films didn't have particularly dark elements to them.

Also, by PIXAR standards, the film isn't even the darkest. Are we forgetting that Muntz murdered several wary travelers who he only suspected were after the bird? Or the chilling fact that the Autopilot was keeping humanity in a permanent stasis for over 6 centuries? Or that Syndrome killed several superheroes, attempted to murder a family, as well as kidnap a child only to be brutally destroyed through a jet intake?

Sorry, I'll take toys being burned alive by a furnace any day.

I would say so yes. It is factual that these characters have a lot of nostalgic value to many people, but Pixar took that into consideration when crafting the film. nostalgia aside, i think the film is still pretty well written and engaging. I was not even that big into toy story when I saw it in theaters, and had not seen the previous two films in years.

to be fair, the incredibles, up, and wall-e all had more moments of levity and comedy than toy story 3, which overall feels very depressing and oppressive. while i agree that the vast majority of pixar's movies have some surprisingly dark overtones and themes (try watching finding nemo again, that movie is an incredible sobfest), people are talking about the overall tone and feeling they get from the film.

edited 26th Nov '14 8:21:53 PM by wehrmacht

edited 26th Nov '14 10:50:59 PM by Odd1