Changed w/o discussion: Joan Of Arc

The image was taken away because, "An image is not required. It's an illustration of Joan of Arc from someone who never saw her. Please leave it off." I think it's fine but it is the same as the one from Wikipedia.

I would prefer something from fiction like [1]◊

No, an image is not required. And yes, it was an image by someone who never saw her. Both of those are feeble reasons to strip a page about a person of the image and can be restated pretty much as "I don't like it.".

The suggestion is good.

A counter suggestion: the cover of the old ''Classics Illustrated''◊ ...comic book, I guess you'd call it.

edited 11th Oct '14 12:51:09 PM by Madrugada

I dont know, seeing how she is a Historical Domain Character we should at least put up an image of what she is typically portrayed when said Historical Domain Character shows up.

The old image isn't quite that though.

Ah. The one I suggested in #2 was the first cover. Here's the second: Classics Illustrated Joan of Arc◊

Messaged Westrim over this.

I got edit sniped.

I already suspended him. It's not the first time he's decided all by himself what's best for a page.

Terrible reason to pull an image. Also, Jeanne d'Archétype has another picture of her.

I kind of think Jeanne d'Archétype should have a fictional/derivative image of her, while Joan Of Arc has one that at least tries to portray the real Jeanne d'Arc.

I like the image quite a bit, actually. However, since there is no known illustration of her by someone who saw her, and we have the Jeanne d'Archétype page with an illustration, I don't see a reason to have an image on this page as well. In fact, not having an image presents an opportunity to note the curiosity that someone of great prominence and in a royal court or a trial for a couple years has no images of her.

I would have been happy to have discussed the matter if asked, and after the edit I checked the discussion page a couple times in the following week, but no one commented. I gave my reasons for removing it. No reason was given for adding it. If an image was added without discussion, it follows that it can be removed without discussion, and I gave more than that by giving an edit reason. ^note  Is there anything more I can do- or am obliged by courtesy or rules to do- than give a reason for my edit and watch for a reply? For that matter, would we be having this conversation, and would I be suspended, had I done less and given no reason at all? I don't tend to ask rhetorical questions, so I am genuinely curious about those questions, though I put them in a note since they have to do with me, not the issue of a page image, so any response to them might work better as a PM or in another venue.

Another Duck, as someone who has done quite a bit of informal research in the time period and person in question, I have unfortunately not come across any public domain images that could be said to match written contemporary descriptions of her (though those are themselves contradictory as perspectives on her evolved).

edited 12th Oct '14 12:21:00 AM by Westrim

Adding an image is a free action and needs no (edit) reason.

Removing images require discussion first. that pretty much means that one have to start a thread here.

edited 12th Oct '14 12:48:54 AM by m8e

Seeing as this page is about Jeanne d'Arch as a public domain character and Jeanne d'Archetype is about different characters inspired by her, I think it would be best to illustrate this page with some pop cultural interpretation (I like 4.1 the best, but OP and 2.1 would work, too) and that page with an obviously different character that fits the archetype.

I'm good with this one◊, although I didn't have any issue with the one that was pulled.

I like the old image and the one that's currently on Jeanne d'Archétype for Joan Of Arc.

I prefer having an older image on Joan Of Arc to show how old the character is/have been used. The old image◊ is a fictional representation of her.

Jeanne d'Archétype should have an image that illustrate an example of the trope.(ie not a image of Jeanne.)

edited 12th Oct '14 10:01:29 AM by m8e

Worth noting also that Jeanne d'Archétype is a trope about inspired characters, not Jeanne herself, so I would not use a portrayal of her there.

Yeah, not one person in Jeanne d'Archétype should actually be Joan Of Arc.

Like was said, adding an image is a free action and needs no (edit) reason. Fast Eddie has said "Removals without replacement should only be done when the image is actively harming understanding of the article, or if the image is NSFW," and that's talking to IP, not individuals.

I agree Jeanne d'Archétype shouldn't have Joan Of Arc as the image.

Move the pic from Jeanne d'Archétype to Joan Of Arc?

That sounds good.

That works and we could create a collage of Archétypes as a replacement image. Such as Chris Lightfellow◊ from Suikoden III and Saber◊[1]◊ from Fate Stay Night.

edited 12th Oct '14 10:15:17 AM by Memers

I kind of wonder if Saber isn't actually a subversion, although I'm not too familiar with that series.

... do I understand correctly that, since Jeanne Darchetype is "a fictional character inspired by Joan of Arc", that all the real life examples on that page are wrong?

Might want to hop over here and mention that.

edited 12th Oct '14 3:17:14 PM by AnotherDuck

This one◊ by it's self would be best because it looks like more than a woman in armor.

Add another to the list who would prefer to see the Ingres portrait on the Joan Of Arc page rather than the Jeanne d'Archétype one.

Another Duck: I'd say it's a valid comparison; she is a subversion (because she's actually a GenderFlipped King Arthur), but early on, when no one knows her identity, it's one of the identities people speculate on because it seems like a good fit.