DC Comics General

Okay after reading this weeks new Flash where surprise, surprise Waller is a total asshat and makes things worse with her anti-hero bullshit and rants, I will formally state this

I will consider Absolute Power great as long as it ends with Waller finally losing

And I'm talking actually losing, her plans go up in complete fire, the people turn against her, she completely beaten, the heroes give a final speech about how wrong she is while she's left screaming in impotent fury

This story will be worth it if we finally put Waller to pasture after all the check's she's been wracking up

Yeah, Waller just needs to go at this point. They've been pushing it with her, and if they don't wrap her up with Absolute Power, her and her plotline will have majorly and unforgivably overstayed their welcome.

it needs to be boomer who takes her down hes been taking her shit the longest.

With a pie to the face, just like old times.

She is so insufferable because she never gets any pushback.

Like this issue she raids Terrifitech while Terrific is away so she shuts it down and outs the current experiments about the interdimensional breakdowns to blame it on heroes, and then barges into an interview Iris is having with someone to shut it down cause its "hero propaganda".

Its like the heroes can't even get a minor win against her, its so annoying.

This whole premise really does remind me a LOT of Dark Reign.

Its like Dark Reign but Waller doesn't get enough focus like Norman as a protagonist leading us to see her steady breakdown and loss of control as she handles unruly lackeys.

So Waller comes across as an invincible villain like the BWL who never suffers any losses.

It also helped in Dark Reign that the other supervillains in Norman's Cabal immediately saw him as a Paper Tiger from Hour 1.

That sums up the issue with Waller here.

She can just bully everyone into submission, and nobody can put her on the backfoot by contrast despite being just a normal human.

Not even like a super genius like Luthor. Everyone constantly kowtows to Waller who always has all the cards.

Edited by slimcoder on Apr 27th 2024 at 8:42:00 AM

So does that mean Amanda Waller is going to form a "Dark Teen Titans"

Who is going to be Dark Kid Flash(Thajalfi, Nordic not god who runs fast)? Dark Robin(Deathstroke's kid, the male one)? Dark Aqualad(Triton, shave your beard!)? Dark Wonder Girl(Devastation, try to look like you're close to the age of consent!)?

What about the new Teen Titans? Dark Beastboy(Are there any white martians left)? Dark Herald(Let's just make Longshadow canon)? Dark Bumblebee(Give Atomia a pair of wings!)? Dark Cyborg(Find Bobby Barnes and turn him into an OMAC), Dark Starfire...that one's easy actually, but how the hell to you do Dark Raven? Will she be Light Raven instead? Bright Raven? Shiny Raven? Rainbow Raven(Liar Liar with a blood clotting injection)?

What about the Titans Academy students, the Dark Teen Titans in training?

Waller's plans have already been revealed to be going the robot route.

She will be creating Amazo robots to take the powers of each of the 7 JL members and for the Titans she will be sending Demonazo, a demon empowered Amazo android against them.

So she's throwing the bulk of her resources at the team that doesn't even exist anymore? I have a feeling how things will go, but at this point I wouldn't adhere to logical plotting, I'd just go all in on Waller. She has eight Amazos and seven of her targets don't even know they're in a fight until it is too late. She wins and establishes herself as invincible, the end. Next story arc. One about who her new bosses actually are, and Earth 3 is up to without its dictator.

As these details are covered it is then revealed that Amanda Waller is viewed as an irritating by capable and legitimate authority figure, respected by most if not liked by many. She'd like to know what happened to prominent super team and those well beloved public figures who used to be a super team too, but investigating it isn't her job, please inquire through the proper channels. Well someone does. Three investigators Waller never saw coming. Infamously selfish and slow minded foreign national Kong Kenan. Turns out he's a big Superman fan and has also become the embodiment of Yin and Yang! The Shaolin Monks/CCP/Gods Of China really have relaxed their standards haven't they? All the same, he's now on the case and he is proving to be a problem. One Waller could probably handle if not for Zur-En-Arrh, the superior Batman who mostly wants to lord it over Bruce Wayne but does care for his lesser half in his own way. Well something has happened, to Bruce, to Dick, Tim and maybe someone else he should probably care about but whose name he keeps losing Failsafe's databases. Whatever, he's ensured the Chinese tourist will help him in this task. And to make matters worse, Artemis of Bana-Mighdall is on vacation, and hunting demons is one of her favorite past times. What's that? A devil robot took down the runt with the silver rope? This will not stand! On her own she'd be too incompetent of a tracker to do anything before vacation's over and Faruka II comes calling, but she's met up with Zur-En-Arrh. With his direction there's no telling what Artemis might do. Keenan, Zur and Artemis together happened so quickly, Waller onto them, but everything she tries seems to stall or make things worse! It's like a nightmare! No, it is a nightmare! She will be waking up any minute now, and all will be right with the world. Amanda Waller is conqueror of Earth 3 and savoir of the USA. She doesn't get caught by surprise, she doesn't get outsmarted, she certainly doesn't lose. She is invincible!

Amanda Waller is the Villain Protagonist of DC.

I have no idea what you're trying to say here, but the main plot of Absolute Power and her machinations for the last couple years is Waller waging war against the superhero community to either conquer them or genocide them all.

The culmination of her plan is the creation of new Amazo androids who rob each of the 7 because they are among the most powerful superhumans on Earth. So violent androids with the powers of Superman, Wonder Woman, and Green Lantern would obviously be a huge thing in-universe.

What I'm trying to "say" is that Waller probably will only get a Near-Villain Victory here, and I think I know how it's generally going to go, a Kang The Conqueror type story.

But I think if they're giving Waller eight Amazos then Wallershould just win absolutely by the end of this arc. I'm not "saying" they should go so far as to rebrand DC Comics to Waller Comics, funny as that would be, but she should at least achieve the goal of defeating the "seven" Justice League members and the Titans she is aware of. Then they should reveal what Earth three now looks like without her ruling it, and who her new masters who convinced her to leave her conquered planet are.

Then Waller should finally be beaten by Keenan, Zur and Artemis, or an equally unlikely alliance. Zur is the other unstoppable one at the moment, so he seems like the most logical choice, the Doomsday to Waller's Gog. From there the plot could either keep escalating, with the attempt to take down Waller's masters, or go sideways to deal with Zur himself, since he's also a problem. I expect the heroes to put up far more resistance than Waller intends. Back in the Silver Age Superman defeated Amazo by himself with the Supermobile. There's no particular reason he couldn't build another one in this "Dawn Of DC" continuity and start curb stomping Amazos with it, but since they're trying so hard to make Amanda Waller this nigh unbeatable Climax Boss I want DC to really make us believe it and have her win Absolute Power exactly how she plans to win it. And no, the disbanded league and The Titans should not be saved by The Justice Society, Infinity Inc, The Outlaws, The Outsiders or anyone else Waller should reasonably expect to try. She should have them all fooled or accounted for only to be bested by an alliance she never saw coming.

Waller's been winning for 4 years straight now. What your propositioning would only further aggravate all the problems with the character.

It's why people are so tired of her, she's an insufferable invincible villain. People hated the Earth-3 arc because Waller won basically everything with no consequence.

Her winning at the end of Absolute Power which is supposed to be the end of the Waller meta-arc would only serve to piss off everyone already massively tired of the character.

Edited by slimcoder on Apr 28th 2024 at 1:07:44 AM

At this point, just see the Amazos get wrecked and have someone bitchslap Waller's head off as everything she made just crumbles.

I did not realize Amanda Waller had been on a winning streak since the pandemic, but after four years, what is another two to six months of winning?

"Yes, that's it folks! Amanda Waller's saga of victory has come to a close! She thinks her triumph is absolute, but there is still much she doesn't know! She has played with that which she doesn't understand and things will only get worse for her from here on out! But how? When every superhero team has been defeated buffered against? What is her blind spot? Just where is this chink in her armor? Who will find and exploit these weaknesses? What kind of damage has she left in her wake already? Who has she been working for anyway? Buy *upcoming DC title* to find out!"

So kinda off-topic but I was recently thinking about the Legion of Superheroes and how DC has continually struggled to revive the series for a lot of reasons, and it got me thinking of a project/pitch me and my best friend have kicked around for awhile for a modernization/elseworlds of the Legion. Figured I'd share it here and get some thoughts.

Premise: Basically taking the core concept of the Legion and putting them in their own little Black Label universe, specifically reimagining the book as a transhumanist science-fiction horror/mystery setting in the vein of stuff like Eclipse Phase, Alien, Event Horizon, The Expanse, and the works of Johnathan Hickman.

Setting: In the 30th century, the solar system is a Used Feudal Future in which all of the planets, moons, dwarf planets, asteroids, and Kuiper belt have been colonized and are now ruled over by the United Planets, the controlling polity of Earth struggling to maintain their grip over a fracturing system coming off a war with an a fleet of Khund Invading Refugees. The solar system is inhabited by humans, uplifted animals, robots, and various species of aliens descended from refugee ships, failed invasions, and exiles ranging from asylum-seeking activists to hardened criminals; poor interactions with prior contacts, technological limitations, and general political instability means that Sol is now a very insular society that isn't expanding any time soon, but still bears the marks of contact with wider universe.

Several years ago, one Dr. Londo - a geneticist, corrupt businessman, and Jim Jones-esque cult leader of a group dedicated to human evolution - cracked a holy grail code and perfected the creation of transhumans. He created a "legion" of such transhumans, some by altering test subjects, others by creating them wholesale, all of them possessing incredible yet often terrifying powers. Eventually, Londo's cult was shut down by the government while preparing a coup, and the existing transhumans, viewed by many of the public as victims, were given amnesty and citizenship... after they were used as living WMDs to defeat the Khunds. Furthermore, the technology and scientific research that Londo created was taken by the governing bodies and is now leading to the creation of yet more transhumans. These beings are now a growing but small minority and subculture amid the United Planets' already diverse population, struggling to find their place within it.

Characters:

• The Legion of Superheroes: The protagonists, obviously. A crew of heroes/adventurers/activists from all across the system dedicated to defending the innocent, punishing the guilty, and helping wherever they can. Funded by R.J. Brande, a well-intentioned magnate, and inspired by ancient legends about a "Superboy" who saved the planet eons ago, they only seek to do good and find meaning for themselves in the chaotic universe, but are a Dysfunction Junction increasingly divided on how to do that and struggle to deal with growing distrust and pressure from the United Planets government.

• Light Speed Vanguard/Legion of Supervillains: Originally a small-time crime syndicate run by Tarik the Mute and recruiting disaffected transhumans in the Kuiper Belt, the LSV slowly grows into a radical terrorist organization embracing the ideal of Dr. Londo, seeking to bring down the United Planets government and to force all of humanity to begin "ascending".

• The United Planets: The ruling government, led by President Wazzo and a council of planetary governors, guild leaders, and nobles, all operating from Earth.

• The Science Police: The ruthless CIA-esque top enforcers of the United Planets.

• Heroes Of Lallor: Rebels from the asteroid state of Lallor who have modified themselves gruesomely and desire independence from the United Planets and an end to the dictatorial power ruling their home.

• Mike Carter and Skeets: A bumbling janitor and his Robot Buddy who stumble into a conspiracy one night at work.

• The White Triangle: The conspiracy in question, a anti-nonhuman group plotting to take over the United Planets through the construction of a mysterious doomsday device known as "Validus".

• Computo: A seed AI that merges with a small moon and becomes a recurring threat to the solar system, aided by it's army of drones and it's "son", a cyborg nicknamed Brainiac created from the corpse of a young colonist.

• Khunds: The remnants of an invading fleet of exiles, now coexisting uneasily in United Planet space. Divided between those who want peace and those who want to restart the Earthwar against all reason.

• Mordru: A trouble-making evil mage and regular thorn in the side of the Legion who is really trying to prepare the system for...

• The Time Trapper: The Big Bad. A horrific and incomprehensible Eldritch Abomination of alien origin that nears Sol and seemingly seeks to corrupt and destroy everything in it's path. Already it is sending advance agents and psionically recruiting followers; when the being itself arrives, every living thing in the system will be needed to stop it.

There's a great deal more and we came up with lots of crazy, horrific revamps of the various Legion characters, but there's loads of them and this is already a Wall of Text. So I'll save the more specific character descriptions for if people here would like to know more.

we do have a reinvention thread here on the forum if you want to elaborate more on that idea.

To get back to Waller, one criticism I've seem for this arc is that the retcon of her origin and why she does what she does is less compelling than her initial backstory.

In Waller's original backstory, she became involved in politics and government work when her husband three of her kids were lost to Street crime. But this Absolute Power arc seems to be changing it so that Waller's prime motivation is sticking it to superhuman because of something one or some of them did to her in the past.

This could be argued to be a microcosm of everything that's wrong with how Waller had been written for years: she only exists to make things more complicated for superheroes instead of being a character whose goals simply clash with them on occasion but aren't about superheroes.

Basically, she went from Nick Fury to a combination of Henry Peter Gyrich and Dark Reign Norman Osborn.

And this is on top of her story now being less grounded in realit which was part of her appeal.

Edited by windleopard on Apr 29th 2024 at 1:51:17 PM

And we'll be getting a follow up on that soon since one of the upcoming AP tie-ins will be a miniseries diving in Waller's origins written by John Ridley.

Which it's John Ridley so who knows how that's going to go.

Edited by slimcoder on Apr 29th 2024 at 6:16:14 AM

Wait was that the guy who had T'challa get kicked out of Wakanda and had Namor Laughing about it and also made Captain America call T'challa Boy and to go back to where he came from?

Same guy yup.

He's done a lot of work for DC including the Other Side of the DC Universe mini, a GCPD: Blue Wall mini, and tbe I Am Batman ongoing for his Jace Fox Batman character.

The latter of which infamous for the derailment it gave Lucia's Fox into turning him into a cheating neglectful asshole rich dude.

Edited by slimcoder on Apr 29th 2024 at 4:59:47 AM

Ridley is, to put it bluntly, not a good writer.