The Scrappy Cleanup

Doomsday has a solid fanbase. I say cut it.

In The Black Eyed Peas, someone added

• The Scrappy: Fergie.

Besides being a Zero Context Example and a real life one, I noticed that it already has been deleted before in 2016. What should be done?

Remove it due to being a Zero-Context Example and real life people can't be The Scrappy.

Edited by ADrago on Jun 27th 2018 at 2:40:04 PM

Another for Baldur's Gate here. My suggestion is... Jaheira.

*WHIRRRP!!*

Wait, wait! I'm talking about the version from the novels!

While the game version has had her share of fan backlash for one reason or another, ranging from that forced-Good Party BS to her often arrogant and abrasive personality, she still has a solid enough fanbase to not qualify. The version from the books on the other hand is right up there with Abdel Adrian himself, Imoen suddenly being a lesbian who's forced to sleep with a mysteriously Depraved Bisexual Phaere and other insufferable changes as prime reasons the books are hated. She's video game Jaheira In Name Only. She's a prime example of a Faux Action Girl. She's the books' choice of Love Interest and it's handled in the worst possible way. Her husband Khalid was rewritten as an abusive dickwad so she wouldn't look bad for cheating on him. Like every other character she dies ahead of the overall ending, further proving she's an Adaptational Wimp.

Overall, I'd say she handily qualifies.

Edited by MinisterOfSinister on Jun 27th 2018 at 5:12:35 PM

What I've heard about those novels (which at this point is several forums) is that all fans hate everything about them. They're more hated than The Star Wars Holiday Special.

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That's true, but some things are more hated than others, and Jaheira is typically held up (at least from what I've seen) as an emblem of how little the writer understood the source material while adapting it to literary form and his problem with the Informed Attribute trope.

I remember stalking this thread before I got an account, and I remember The Scrappy page for Shin Megami Tensei being bought up, but the examples that were deemed unworthy (e.g. Ohya and Mishima, I think it was agreed upon that Yuzu didn't qualify as a scrappy too?) were never removed from that page.
Now onto the thing I wanted to ask, does Sugimura count as The Scrappy if he's a villain? He's listed on the Shin Megami Tensei section of Hate Sink and isn't listed on the Shin Megami Tensei Scrappy page, yet on the Persona 5 YMMV page he's listed as The Scrappy (ironically, there's no Hate Sink entries on Persona 5's YMMV page). I remember reading in exceptional cases a villain can actually be a scrappy, and since Sugimura is an Upper-Class Twit Karma Houdini who isn't even a character people Love to Hate, I wanted to ask here if he actually qualifies as The Scrappy or if he should be classed as a Hate Sink instead.
Also, one last thing. Do Take That! moments that happen to characters who are Base-Breaking Characters or Americans Hate Tingle count as Take That, Scrappy! moments?

Edited by Metaverse on Jun 30th 2018 at 10:18:09 AM

I'm illiterate. Superman 64 has a better characters than The Last of Us Part II.

Hate Sink is not a YMMV trope. It's not about how the audience reacts to the character; it's about the intended reaction.

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Thank you for the clarification. I'm new here so I assumed it was a YMMV trope.

I'm illiterate. Superman 64 has a better characters than The Last of Us Part II.

From The Dream Stone:

• "Wildit and Spildit tend to get flak for occasional Spotlight-Stealing and being the product of Executive Meddling."
• "The hero ensemble as a whole is often less popular than the bad guys (though some not unanimously), largely due to their Designated Hero status, winning too easily, and their avoidance of humour and slapstick in a Zany Cartoon making them rather boring. The show attempted to rectify this later on (see above)."

Any issue with either entry getting cut?

IPP Wick Check created.

Nope. The former is too weak to count as written, and the latter straight out isn't. "Less popular" isn't what the trope is about. It's also a group.

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I've found these on Animal Crossing:

• "The snowmen in the GCN game, especially if you don't make them correctly, in which they would chastise you. See That One Sidequest. New Leaf fixed this with the Snow family being quite friendly, even if you don't make them correctly."
• "Villager-wise, smug villagers tend to get the most hate because of perceived "creepy" lines, and it doesn't help if they're seen as ugly by the players. In terms of villager trading (see Character Tiers above), if it's to be believed, Quillson the Duck is one of the most (if not the most) hated characters in the game; whereas players are paying tens of million bells to have their dream villagers in town, Quillson is a character who people are paying to not have in their town; sometimes up to 100k bells, if just to get rid of him. Apparently he's a common villager to move in, since there's more than one story of people paying to get rid of him. Marshal the Squirrel, on the other hand...."
• "Just about any villager in New Leaf has the capacity to become a Scrappy to someone if they dare build their house in undesirable places, such as over roads, trees or gardens, or directly in front of the player's house. Doubly so if the villager is one of the more unpopular ones as listed above. Fortunately, Welcome amiibo prevents villagers from building their houses on patterns, so, with patience, villager locations can be mapped out with the right pattern-laying."

What's the word on these entries?

IPP Wick Check created.

The last two are group material so should be cut. That said Quillson the Duck as an example could be expanded on, if it's not a case of Germany Loves David Hasselhoff

Edited by ReynTime250 on Jul 1st 2018 at 9:24:05 AM

The second one refers to a group rather than an individual. Cut.

Where there's life, there's hope.

Bringing up this example from Fantastic Four (2005):

• The Scrappy: Debbie. While her shock at Ben's new Rock Monster form is understandable, there's no excuse for outright dumping him for it so coldly and wordlessly — especially since he just, you know, saved the day for an entire bridge.

That sounds like complaining. Just a single event the example is judging on, rather than explaining how the character is hated by the fanbase.

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Actually, all of the Animal Crossing examples are not about any individual character. Scrap them all.

Where there's life, there's hope.

I am no longer in the Dragon Ball Z nor Super fandom, but I really think that Chi-Chi should count as a Scrappy (in Super, mostly). I noticed in Super, the writers are intentionally making her as unlikable as ever, and there are so many anti Chi-Chi videos on Youtube talking about how she's the worst character and she should be killed off. There's even a petition going around saying that the creators should remove her form the show. Just saiyan.

Edited by MsCC93 on Jul 2nd 2018 at 11:48:27 AM

Intentional unlikability is a Hate Sink, not The Scrappy.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

YMMV.Death Battle:

• Their portrayal of Yang seems to have earned the ire of quite a few fans, feeling they didn't get her in-character. Her casual disregard for the well-being of others, her willingness to commit property damage, and her nonchalance towards the fact that she viciously murdered someone in cold blood over something that was her own fault might make it hard to find this incarnation of the character likable.
• Toph, for many of the same reasons as Yang stated above.
• Virtually any character with a "No-Limits Fallacy" ^note In Versus community terms, that means any character whose power/powers haven't been shown to have clear limits, and are therefore assumed to be unlimited. will become universally hated overnight. Examples include but are not limited to Superman, Scorpion, Sol, Yang, Dante, and Ganondorf.^note To be more specific: Superman's power increases for as long as he is exposed to sunlight, Scorpion's power rises whilst in the Netherrealm, Sol's headband limiting his true Gear form, Yang's Semblence increasing her strength while she takes damage, Dante surviving all sorts of fatal attacks, and Ganondorf is unable to be killed by anything except holy weapons.
• Superman is definitely this after his flat-out victory against Goku. The hosts completely pointing out his incredible, and somewhat unrealistic, feats and the Desk of Death Battle episode involving who can defeat him has increased a lot of hatred against him. This only worsened after his rematch with Goku: He not only won again, but did so with even less effort than before — thus drawing countless accusations of Death Battle actively using him as a walking Take That, Critics!.

The third violates the no groups rule. Yang and Toph OOC is a Necessary Weasel for their fighting opponents to the death. Superman might be legit. Is this any different than the inevitable complaints from fans of those they defeated?

I don't see how we can honestly list Death Battle characters. They aren't OC's; it'd be like listing examples from fan fiction. Which I suppose there might be, but it's getting mad over a portrayal of a character in a derivative work with no official status. Come on, people.

More specifics: the entry for Toph is piggybacking off of the prior one without any detail, making it a ZCE, and the third example is a "general" one and invalid on that ground. I can't speak to the other two, but I can say quite honestly that, without a horse in the "Goku vs. Superman" race, I could not give less of a fuck what people think about how DB portrayed it. We had to perma-redlink the DMOS subpage for DB because people would. Not. Shut. Up.

Edited by Fighteer on Jul 2nd 2018 at 10:46:32 AM

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

Is she intentional though? She is just so stereotypical and so utterly sexist that it really cant be an intentional Hate Sink.

I don't know why you'd think those would be contradictory attributes.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

Agreed. Her whole character is just sexist as hell. She's no Hate Sink, but she's a joke character that fans are supposed to make fun of and to not agree with. She's always seen in the wrong despite her having good points, which explains some of the bile she garners from fans.

Edited by MsCC93 on Jul 3rd 2018 at 8:38:42 AM

That's my point. If she's intended to be disliked, then doesn't that mean she's not a Scrappy, since that is unintentional by definition?

Edit: Okay, well, the trope allows for Intended Audience Reaction variations, but it does say that it can veer into Hate Sink if taken far enough.

Edited by Fighteer on Jul 3rd 2018 at 9:28:05 AM

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"