Needs Help: Amazonian Beauty

Again, depends. The problem is that this unreliable to the point of Citation Needed, which we really should try to avoid. If one character, this one time, mentioned that a character is "buff and attractive", how do we verify that she fits the "defined and massive" portion of the trope unless we can see it or they're described?

Depends on if a character says they find it attractive. As I said, I thought about expanding the criteria to include Attraction Tropes in addition to Fanservice. In fact, that may actually work.

EDIT: I added that criteria to the description, which should fix your objection, nitrokitty. Sorry for going ahead and doing it everybody, but I wanted to see how that looked before the discussion continued.

edited 18th Jun '12 6:01:12 PM by KingZeal

That actually goes a long way towards fixing my complaint, and it nicely lines up with the new definition for Hot Amazon (Amazon Chaser).

Yeah, that's a definite improvement.

I also added The Beautiful Tropes, because why not.

Bump.

Everyone happy with the new changes?

That certainly covers the "too narrow" problem. ("Too broad" is a different issue.)

Is it too broad, though?

Well, potentially. That's was the argument for the qualifiers, right?

For instance, Alice is muscular. Bob is attracted to her. Does that make Alice any character type in particular, or have we just learned that Bob is an Amazon Chaser?

Is Bob attracted to her because of her build, or because of her lovely personality?

Let's say we don't know. We just added her because Attraction Tropes are in play, in line with Amazonian Beauty's criteria.

Alternatively, let's say he's attracted to her muscles. Again, does the work therefore portray her as an Amazonian Beauty, or as any kind of beauty, or are they just developing Bob's character.

As a singular example, it can be both, or it can be neither. It's hard to tell without explicit references. I wouldn't count it as either if the only reason to put it there is speculation (however reasonable it may be).

It's sort of like having a woman who's in the police force where she's highly regarded, and it's not a desk job. That's all we know. Does that make her an Action Girl? Well, it's likely, but we don't know that, so she doesn't fit the trope.

Now, if more characters (one more is enough) commented on her beauty, or if he looked at another muscled beauty, it would show that the trope(s) is in play, at least to some degree.

edited 23rd Jun '12 11:10:20 AM by Feather7603

When we were initially building the trope a while back, we decided against the "attractive BECAUSE of her build" stipulation, because in most cases, it's nearly impossible to prove. Reread my post here for the train of logic why. This is also a problem faced with tropes like Big Beautiful Woman.

In short, "purpose" never works as a trope stipulation. It doesn't work with authorial intent, and it doesn't work here. Whether a guy finds a woman attractive because of or in SPITE of a quality is a very subjective sliding scale. The only way to know for sure is if a character expresses disgust at her looks, which would make her a Brawn Hilda.

edited 23rd Jun '12 1:33:35 PM by KingZeal

I think this should only include Fanservice Tropes and The Beautiful Tropes. I'm not so sure about Attraction Tropes. Mainly because most of those tropes indexed there don't even belong there, they should be under The Beautiful Tropes and this should just be about a character's looks and portrayal, not some Informed Attribute.

If there is any way I can help with the cleanup/fix, please PM me.

I don't think it would make much of a difference, but I'm not opposed to it, either.

Completely neutral on that action.

Does Korra from The Legend Of Korra fit this trope. I can't tell if she really fits this trope or it's just fans that wanna gush.

I say cut. I would have cut her before, but I'm under a temp edit ban.

Are we done here? Does any wick cleanup need to happen?

I think we're done, but another wick check couldn't hurt.

edited 31st Jul '12 1:43:21 PM by KingZeal

Okay, next question: will anyone do a wick check, or is that being too optimistic? :P

I've been trying to get to for the past week, but it's pretty low on my "shit to get done" list. Way down into the "if I need to kill some time at any point" territory, so I wouldn't hold my breath.

That answers that. Since it doesn't seem to be a huge problem in need of urgent cleaning, let's just lock this up.