Random Questions Thread

I, uh, would not recommend using Lionel Shriver's speech as your yardstick when it comes to the intersection of writing and social issues.

While she may be simplifying the issue, I believe she has a point: it is part of a writer's job to try to emphatise with the experiences of others and how they see the world around them, and there is a small yet loud number of people (specially on the internet) who act as if anyone who is not part of their culture shouldn't be allowed to even talk about it, because they are so afraid of misrepresentation they wish to block themselves away from the eyes of outsiders.

Remember that I am not saying this is the case here, or that it is what happens most of the time, but sometimes it does happen and it does not give a good impression of the group that the writer wanted to represent.

edited 27th Sep '16 7:29:04 AM by EternaMemoria

@ Sharysa

Thanks

@ Marq FJA

But when writing the full name, supposed that your female Malay character is named "Ayu" and her father's name is "Awang," is it "Ayu binte Awang" or "Ayu bintii Awang?"

The former, I think. I'm no expert in Malay culture, though; I'm just speaking on the basis that it's a word from Arabic, which is my mother language.

Are Tropers allowed to create Work Pages of their own published works?

Yes. I've done it for basically all of my published stuff.

Inigo: Why is everyone talking about the "STAY AWAY FROM MY CULTURE" response when I clearly did not say that?

When Ewolf said they just wanted some Filipino flavor and ideas because it was interesting, I went, "Okay, just do some basic research. Don't waste your time on intensive research, because it's going to take years and the Spaniards who wrote most of it down are REALLY racist."

I'm not going to demand that everyone looking to include the Philippines or their Fantasy Counterpart Culture must do X years of research if the culture isn't going to feature heavily in the story. That's unnecessary and pretty masochistic.

And while there's definitely a Vocal Minority of... well, minorities, who demand that everyone who wants to include X culture in their writing must immerse themselves in research to get it right, the main group of people crying about "BUT YOU MEAN WE CAN'T DO ANYTHING OUTSIDE OF OUR OWN CULTURE ANYMORE???" are white/Caucasian people who just want to keep taking other cultures because they "REALLY REALLY like it," yet don't want to give back to that culture or treat the people with respect.

edited 28th Sep '16 12:39:36 AM by Sharysa

this again. i'm gonna say it. i'm black, nigerian american to be exact. i know i might know more about african culture, a bit native american culture and celtic but i always loved obscure tribal cultures more than the usual european fantasy. i really would love to see more fantasy stories take place in other places that have yet to be explored in fiction.

I'm sorry if I mistook you for white, but those are the people I usually have to deal with asking these types of questions. I'm actually pretty lucky to live in North California, since my region is really diverse.

Plus, it really didn't help that someone ELSE told you to ignore me and do as much research as possible. Like, that's a textbook response of "Don't listen to a Filipino girl about Filipino culture! Just do what you want because you reeeeeeally like it."

edited 28th Sep '16 12:22:24 PM by Sharysa

i get that alot but even if i was white, i would most certainly not do such a thing. thought i don't really get why some people have a gripe on white people (i'm aware they done some terrible shit back in the day.)

All peoples have done terrible stuff if you look far enough into the past.

The only difference is that Europeans had ships, gunpowder and reasons both economical and religious to colonize and assimilate while others generally kept their crimes close to their homes.

edited 28th Sep '16 1:03:16 PM by EternaMemoria

re: Sharysa: as one of the someone elses in question, I stand by my assertion that more research is almost always better. Different point of view: while I might object to a depiction, I cannot in good conscience advise anyone to study less.

And I did concur with you that it'd be better for him to make an entirely new culture with some broad traits inspired by the one she's researching, rather than trying to copy it over wholesale. More research into the topic should—hopefully—lead her to that conclusion, too.

edited 28th Sep '16 2:14:44 PM by SabresEdge

she. didn't you see the avatar?

I stand corrected. Though avatars really don't tell you much about the gender of the writer on these forums.

also note: i might take a third option on it and say study it for about 10 weeks when necessary.

I didn't mean that I ONLY want you to Google some basic articles and never do anything else—I just think that seems to be the level of research needed for the story. You can always build on more research later, but trying to dive headlong into pages of research will inevitably bog down the story's plot, writing process, or both.

As someone mentioned, research alone doesn't mean the story itself is worth anything. It might actually CAUSE the story to be shit since most people tend to cram in worldbuilding/exposition breaks because they're just so excited about showing off their knowledge. I would VASTLY prefer someone who did basic research on the pre-colonial Philippines and then focused on a good story with interesting characters, instead of a sprawling epic of pseudo-Filipino culture that's clearly set up for a Mighty Whitey coming in and ruling it all.

You can do a lot of things with Character X being from Tribe A, but advising the others not to wear too much green while traveling through Tribe B's territory because it's only worn by their priests, so they'd get a lot of mistaken requests for help and it would slow everything down. And on their supply run, a merchant from Tribe C surprises Character X with Tribe A's greeting because his aunt is from Tribe A, and they both laugh about how EVERYONE'S got a relative from Tribe A.

It only takes a couple of paragraphs, but it immediately tells people that the world is bigger than the places that the story covers.

edited 28th Sep '16 3:11:58 PM by Sharysa

dude, there will be no mighty whitey man, john's basically ambiguously brown ( he has a very mixed background that consists of ancestors from the middle east, greece and italy.) but due to the bullshit society i live in, a olive skinned kid like john over here is considered "white"

edited 28th Sep '16 3:36:42 PM by ewolf2015

An "western" savior for a foreign people with brown skin isn't that different from one with pale skin IMO. The idea behind the "Mighty Whitey" is at least as culturally supremacist as it is racialy supremacist.

edited 28th Sep '16 4:08:25 PM by EternaMemoria

sigh. i feel like shit really i do. i guess i should just give up and....

Don't. Everyone also made dumb mistakes at least once.

i mean the fact that john is technically "white" or western whatever. ( this isn't technically going to help me but he never rules it since well...he screws up a lot. he's merely but 13 year old boy for crying out loud.)

Well, then I guess the answer is not making him the savior but only a helpful foreign kid that acts as a Supporting Protagonist to the native leader.

I mean, a character does not need to be the savior to be interesting, and the interaction between the young and creative fish-out-of-the-water and a more experienced and cynical character can be very nice to watch.

edited 28th Sep '16 4:46:44 PM by EternaMemoria

allow me to explain, john is one of the five bearers of the anikai, ancient, powerful nature spirits sealed within five bracelets. he and his friends (who'll all Poc) are tasked on protecting magea from all those who wish to harm it. ( note: there is no clear leader but andre, the black kid, usually assumes the leadership role most of the time)

that tribe idea seems interesting. i had a similar scene concerning that, Sharysa

edited 28th Sep '16 4:52:59 PM by ewolf2015

crap, i killed it again

This is a topic that devolves into occasionally-specialized conversations in a relatively little-frequented subforum of a fairly obscure forum. Sometimes people just don't post because a) there aren't many people browsing here, and b) they have relatively little to say about the topic at hand.

On the generally fraught topic of depicting another culture, though: I've seen this infographic◊, or variants thereof, a few times. Generally speaking, the little details that will be crucial will be the hardest ones to unearth, so you really do have to commit to doing your research—and realize that there's always a lot more you haven't seen, sometimes including crucial things.

i might as well call it a close. sorry for bringing it up but a ain't study years because i'm trying to get mey series out there.