The General D&D thread

Ehh, Ravenloft is very low fantasy, for the most part. There's magic, but magic is rare, generally speaking.

Which is actually more like Tolkien than high fantasy, funny enough. We see, 2 wizards in LOTR, a couple more are mentioned, and a handful of artifacts are seen. Your standard high fantasy Wizards are rare, but by no means "5 or less in all of existence".

I prefer Ravenloft as a shifting, loosely-connected network of domains that are difficult to navigate between. I don't really care for the idea of the setting having a set map, with clearly defined borders and such.

Ravenloft "sorta" had defined borders, but you have to remember, the mists never allowed people to just go where they wanted.

Yes, but there was still a defined geography. If you managed to pass through this border here, you'd end up in that country there. I'd prefer if the setting lacked that sort of certainty.

I didn't like Ravenloft. I prefer campaign worlds that allow a sense that it's possible for the characters to ultimately triumph over evil.

So basically, you like your fantasy campaigns to be FANTASY, amirite

Oooo, cynicism burn!

Essentially, yes.

Silly Rabbit, Cynicism Is for Losers!

I actually like the idea of Ravenloft, if run in a certain way. It can be handled with a sort of Castlevania feel — Ravenloft is an entire demiplane that's a Genius Loci whose sole purpose is to act as an Epiphanic Prison for the various Big Bads that end up there. Given the standard D&D cosmology, where evil people go to the lower planes when they die (where they're given the chance to become powerful fiends and get up to even more evil shenanigans instead of undergoing any sort of appropriate punishment for their actions in life), this makes getting stuck in Ravenloft a Fate FAR Worse Than Death for them... at least until they get to the "epiphany" stage of the Epiphanic Prison thing. Naturally, of course, sometimes the demiplane might need a little outside help (to either keep its residents contained or else give them a push toward their epiphany), which is where the players come in.

So yeah, Ravenloft can be a lot of fun, even if you prefer your gaming with an optimistic tone. Ravenloft is where even the evilest of evils go to be redeemed! (If against their will and with great difficulty.) Of course, a lot of people run it as "the evil place where evil rules forever because evil evil evil evil evil!", which I agree is dumb and unsatisfying as a campaign setting.

edited 13th Feb '15 5:29:33 AM by NativeJovian

Ehhhh... historically I feel like most Ravenloft baddies end up saying no to redemption.

I recall Lord Soth having a major back and forth where it was like "REDEEM YOURSELF!" "NO!" "DO EET!" "NO!" for instance.

Azalin had a weird thing happen, though the book and the game module disagreed on the outcome so I forgot what the canon resolution was.

Aren't the Dread Lords picked for Ravenloft mainly because they are so stubborn that they will refuse to acknowledge that they did anything wrong, so they keep repeating the same behaviors over and over?

,Well, yeah. That's what makes it an Epiphanic Prison. They're only still imprisoned because they refuse to face their epiphany.

That does of course raise an interesting question. Do the Dark Powers leave the Dread Lords the possibility of escape because they actually want them to have an epiphany and get out? Or do they put it there specifically because they know that the Dread Lords will never realize the error of their ways and accept their punishment?

I was just watching the episode of Counter Monkey where Spoony talks about how Lord Soth got booted out of Ravenloft specifically because he realized that he deserved his fate.

But what are the odds of somebody like Lord Strahd or Vecna coming to the realization that they earned their eternal torment because they're such assholes?

Eh, if I recall, Vecna outright cheated his way out just via O Pness.

And thus gave birth to 3rd edition.

Strahd, never. The dude is basically the fedora-wearing dudebro of the setting. He could never admit that Tatyana just may not be that into him.

I always liked Azalin the best, but come to think of it, I can't remember jack about him. Just that he was once BF Fs with Strahd and then his mortal (well, immortal~) enemy.

edited 13th Feb '15 9:06:13 AM by TheyCallMeTomu

So according to The Fifth Element, Milla Jovovich is an element. So could I make a wizard focusing on Milla Jovovich-based spells?

Yes

It's worth it for conjure multipass alone.

Would it also involve gratuitous nudity and/or waking up with amnesia? \

I'm more interested in a spell that produces kickass opera/fight sequences.

Discussion with drunken friends led to the decision that I was to DM a campaign based on Thomas The Tank Engine. This should be interesting.

Railroad your players!

That pun's been made