Super Smash Bros.

I think it's too exaggerated to say characters "combo him to death," unless there are just so many infinite combos I'm awkwardly unaware of. Combos have to end eventually, and Dedede has a decent enough nair to break out of them, and has strong combos of his own. Not to mention that many of these heavy combo players are lightweights, which Dedede will gladly chew through with just a few attacks. And less we forget that as a heavy weight with good recovery, you're going to have to get huge combos on him to put him in a kill range.

Add in gordo traps, a suicide, strong attacks, you've got a decent enough fighter. The only reason Dedede is seen so poorly is because everyone dismissed him after they heard gordos get deflected back and because they think Jet Hammer is still useless.

If we're gonna talk match-ups, I'll agree folks like Pikachu and Sheik have their advantage on him, but Mario and Falcon? I'd argue that's more 50-50. Again, the bias exists here because so many more experienced people play these top-tier characters, it makes their match-ups seem significantly better. Dedede's potential is largely untapped by the greater community.

I'm pretty sure the concept of Law having limits was a translation error. -Wanderlustwarrior

Has the Smash Ballot site been updated?

You know, I have to wonder why Pit is obsessed with this site. It’s gonna ruin his life!

Pretty sure that "update" to the ballot resulted in nothing, and may have had something to do with getting the current date?

We've still got a whole month to go for it, after all.

Dedede's N-Air is frame 7. That's an iffy at best combo breaker. Dedede's attacks are all slow with his fastest being frame 6. His huge range won't help much if he keeps getting hit out of his attacks, Shulk has a similar problem. Dedede just struggles to get in against most characters and a lot of them can make Gordos a liability.

Also Jet Hammer is pretty useless.

This is why customs are nice. Replace that useless jet hammer with one that moves forward or has super armor, and it can at least be used occasionally. Bounding Gordo is also hilarious.

I have a message from another time...

As for my opinion on customs, I'll go over that once I'm home.

I feel the same way about them as I do custom teammate assists in other fighting games, or perhaps movesets in Pokemon. You may not know exactly what they have at the start of a match, but you know what they can have.

I have a message from another time...

I really only use customs when I play Smash Run and/or I'm playing as a Mii. Otherwise, I perfectly fine with just using the standard moves.

"Pardon me, that extremely loud and extremely deep voice you may have just heard. It was me. Oh, it is such a long story..."

So, the other day, I managed to complete my quest to try out everyone.

Well, except the DLC characters. I'm still deciding whether or not to get the DLC content for just the 3DS version, or the 3DS and Wii U version. I don't have a Wii U, but while I don't have any immediate plans to get one just for its version of a game I basically already have, I could end up doing so one day if enough other games on it pique my interest (so far, that list is just Hyrule Warriors and maybe Splatoon).

So this means that the DLC is a gamble for me right now. If I buy the 3DS-only versions of the DLC and later get a Wii U, I'd have to buy the Wii U DLC separately and miss out on the discount for buying both at once. But if I buy the two-system versions of the DLC and end up never getting a Wii U, I'll have wasted money on something I'll never use. What do you all think I should do?

And in other news, I think Shulk is starting to replace Pikachu as my main, but there are still some things I need to get the hang of on him, like what his general strengths and weaknesses are, and when to use which Monado Art. I also find myself whiffing on his Final Smash more often than I'd like.

edited 2nd Sep '15 4:43:02 PM by Lightblade

The Living Guildpact rules that coffee is an acceptable substitution for rest as specified in subsection … whatever.

It's a shame my main's customs aren't worth shit. Nooo, please make good customs for Sheik and Rosalina and Pikachu, they sure need it.

Dopants: He meant what he said and he said what he meant, a Ninety is faithful 100%.

I honestly don't see how Jet Hammer can be written off, it's probably one of my most-used kill moves. We're talking about the same move, right? The one that's a mobile smash attack on-the-go? You can hold indefinitely? Jump with it? Turn? Fully charged, it's gonna kill very easily on the edge, which is the only place you're gonna use it.

I mean I feel like if you're gonna call Jet Hammer useless, then there's a lot of specials even worse than it. And its customs sacrifice so much killing power for little benefit.

Have you guys ever put someone off the edge with Dedede? His game is exceptional when he's guarding the edge. He lacks flashy combos but he makes it very difficult for people to come back once he's hit them off.

I'm pretty sure the concept of Law having limits was a translation error. -Wanderlustwarrior

Is there a standard moveset for Palutena or something? Does she have a lack of kill moves? I find it a shame that she, Zelda, Samus and Mewtwo are apparently quite bad.

I've already posted how I'd buff Mewtwo, but I'll have to think on the ladies.

The sad, REAL American dichotomy

From what I can tell, default Palu's more optimal kill moves generally require the opponent to basically be on top of her, which isn't particularly easy to set up for someone with such mediocre movement.

Up-tilt Gordo on someone below a curved ledge = most satisfying KO in the game

edited 2nd Sep '15 5:54:36 PM by Demonfly

"Tell them to shut up and have some faith in me." - dead flashback guy

Palutena's default specials are Autoreticle (neutral), Reflect Barrier (forward), Counter (Down), and Warp (Up). That makes for a very defensive play style.

edited 2nd Sep '15 5:57:52 PM by Lightblade

The Living Guildpact rules that coffee is an acceptable substitution for rest as specified in subsection … whatever.

Ugh, Pally's my main, but I've gotten used to her default set and it's hard for me to practice her Custom moves (particularly Lightwieght, which everyone says makes the character) since going against the AI means I'd have to deal with them wearing Equipment. Sometimes, I really feel like she should've gotten the same treatment the Mii Fighters have when it comes to Custom moves, which would allow her to play in standard/neutral Smash without worrying about any equipment changes.

As for what the consensus was, I believe most people said that Explosive Flame (neutral) and Lightweight (Down Special) should've been her defaults instead of Auto Reticle and Counter respectively (though I feel like Counter was buffed at some point in one of the previous patches, so it's not as useless now). I don't recall how anyone felt about Reflect or Warp, though I personally find Warp more useful than any of her other Up Specials.

edited 2nd Sep '15 6:12:57 PM by Customer

Supposedly she gets some wicked combos with Lightweight and Super Speed. She's built around customs (and has them all unlocked), which means the customless environment of the meta really fucks her over.

Dopants: He meant what he said and he said what he meant, a Ninety is faithful 100%.

If you're trying to hit me at the ledge with Jet Hammer I'm just going to keep holding the ledge until you decide to let go of it. The longer you keep charging it, the more you're hurting yourself and pretty much doing my job for me. If you try to drop off and hit me with it, then I'm just going to climb it with my invencibility frames protecting me from harm.

Jet Hammer only works on people who don't know how to deal with it, or you get a hard read.

I'm not sure if the Jet-hammer's swinging arc really hits ledge grabbers, like Kirby's does. That might be something to keep in mind, if it does.

Also...trying to jump off with Jet-hammer is almost guaranteed self-destruct because of cool down.

edited 2nd Sep '15 6:25:31 PM by randomness4

YO. Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie.

I don't use custom moves or equipment.

Aside from a thing to make me start battles with a Beam Sword to make the "clear 20 rounds of Crazy Orders as Mario" challenge easier.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!

I've found I'm most comfortable with Palutena's default loadout, save for swapping Counter out for Celestial Fireworks- It really helps her to have a poke.

I use custom moves sometimes for some characters, and favor using equipment in solo stuff, using the best no-extras pieces I can so the general feel of the character doesn't change relative to the others when I'm playing as them.

edited 2nd Sep '15 6:32:59 PM by Pulse

I sure said that!

Hammer damage caps off at 100%.

"Tell them to shut up and have some faith in me." - dead flashback guy

Jet Hammer might hit some characters whose head peek out over it like Charizard and Villager, maybe. Characters like Greninja that only have their hand over the ledge can only get hit by stuff that hits really low to the ground.

As for customs, I'm mixed on them really. They really help some worse characters get better (Ganondorf, WFT, Palutena...) but they also help some of the top tiers (Pikachu, Rosalina, Diddy) and some low tiers are left in an even worse state in that meta (Dedede, Zelda, Mewtwo).

They also have an issue of sometimes the really good customs being unhealthy not because they're OP, but because they basically centralize the character around that single move or two which makes the characters have a much more linear, boring gameplan with very little depth to it.

Some of you might remember this very exciting Villager gameplay in customs which helps explain what I'm talking about.

edited 2nd Sep '15 6:43:12 PM by FullMoon

Mewtwo has no customs...

And I find Jet Hammer to be a useful attack. Though I don't use it to edgeguard.

Though when I was Roy once, my friend walked right into me charging up Roy's Shield Breaker and I released it and killed him. That and the fact that I was able to counter his attempts to egdeguard me perfectly is the reason why I like using Roy so much.

You know, I have to wonder why Pit is obsessed with this site. It’s gonna ruin his life!

About the only good thing in that match in the music.

And you pulling a win against that camping son of a bitch, but that's obvious.

edited 2nd Sep '15 7:24:53 PM by Pulse

I sure said that!

He said that Mewtwo was made worse by the custom move environment. Meaning that with customs around, life is even worse for Mewtwo as his opponents have even better options against him.

Re: Counter Timber. Of course, the possibility of a terribly overpowered custom is there. Especially on a platformless stage like Final Destination. But I'd rather specifically ban certain customs than all customs.

And yeah, Jet Hammer has problems. If I use customs, I definitely swap out for a different version.

edited 2nd Sep '15 7:43:16 PM by Enlong

I have a message from another time...