Kory: i will need to do some more testing to see if the 500KB should be lowered even more but either way everyone can relax because the database will not crash or implode in anyway due to page size so splitting pages isn't a huge priority and is just more of a suggestion. For pages that actually load slow, splitting the pages will help slower internet users navigate these pages better.
It looks like pages over 500,000 characters (html formatted, that is) are crashing the server when someone tries to edit them. programmer's whine
They need to be fixed, anyway. Way too big for one page. They need to be broken up into subpages of a reasonable size.
I'm trying to get better about communicating before big changes, so we'll let this one run for a while before taking the action. The server crashes do come under the heading of 'urgent', though.
another programmer's thing
Explanation of what triggers the too-long page warning
Edited by kory on Dec 18th 2023 at 2:36:21 AM
NaNo 4328 / 50,000
Both of those proposed pages should be namespaced to Tabletop Game, as the original medium. I like the idea of turning the Franchise redirect into an index even more.
edited 16th Jun '14 7:11:38 PM by crazysamaritan
Link to TRS threads in project mode here.
^^How much of the stuff about the settings is about stuff true across settings, how much is about settings that don't have pages (and how much of that group is about which settings), and how much is about settings that do have pages?
Actually, regarding Dungeons & Dragons, the page history suggests that trope examples get added on a semi-frequent basis, so I do not expect that merely splitting parts of the description off will work.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
NaNo 4328 / 50,000
If I understood Jovian's suggestion correctly, the pages will be taking examples with them.
Link to TRS threads in project mode here.
Sharknado Warning
... Have alphabetic splits gone out of fashion? Seems like it'd be simplest. Splitting by settings is somewhat redundant since most settings already have pages. And you can see how well that has worked keeping the main D&D page being cluttered. Not counting that such a split can be annoying when a trope appears on some un-setting related book once so it just gets added to the main page anyway.
Just split the page alphabetically. Or make the current folders each their own subpages.
edited 20th Jun '14 5:57:40 AM by CobraPrime
The problem with alphabetic splitting is that the page's examples are ordered by "category", not alphabet. When the pre-existing page ordering is at odds with the common splitting procedure, I ask for discussion.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
If any examples currently on the page can/should be on the setting pages, they should be on the setting pages. If that's not the problem, then that's not the problem.
Going back to #1253, if the problem is predominantly the first category we can create a new page specifically for things that are true across settings, if it's the second category and specifically a small number of settings producing a disproportionate number of examples we should create pages for those settings, and if it's the third category we should move examples to their respective setting pages and possibly put a note on the page not to add new examples for settings that have pages.
And if the problem isn't the Settings folder at all then talking about it is a waste of time.
edited 20th Jun '14 1:16:38 PM by MorganWick
So, is there any follow-up on Dungeons & Dragons?
Also, methinks that we could use a new report. The last one was in April.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
My vote is to merge the list into an alphabetical one, and then split it along those lines. Sorting tropes by other categories just gets complicated and confusing far too quickly.
On the basis of this, methinks that the best fix for Dungeons & Dragons is to de-softsplit the page and then hardsplit by alphabet.
Also, another dicey case: RedLetterMedia. It has 4 separate example sections.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
I've been moving stuff from Touhou to a few subpages, but its character count in the index isn't going down (although it is getting easier to scroll through). How often does this index update?
Hi
It updates when Eddie can run the report...I'll ping him.
Nineteenth , Ein Four
I'm a little late to the party but after reading some of the pages in the OLP article, it's safe to say the majority of them are just pointless natter that wouldn't hurt anyone or anything if they were outright deleted.
I am also not sure if this has been mentioned but couldn't Headscratchers and WM Gs simply be converted into Forum Posts? The majority of them devolve into discussions regardless of how well the posters behave — and some of the WM Gs just redefine pointless.
Meanwhile the Character's pages should just pertain to THAT topic. So the same character appeared in 3 different stories or mediums - - Keep their information there.
Blatent example that shows that nobody really cares. The King of Fighters Rugal Saga Entry. Does the Athena entry need modern Athena information? This article is -supposed- to be about the Athena from KOF 1994~1995. Not KOF 2012 Athena or Maximum Impact Athena. Those have not happened, nor does she have the same tropes or traits she developed later on. Padding her entry is just silly.
In fact, there's so much irrelevant information in character pages, it's like someone said " HEY , I DON't FEEL LIKE LOOKING AT THE PREVIOUS ARTICLES, LET ME JUST CUT AND PASTE EVERYTHING INTO EVERY ARTICLE"
Blah, the problem is too widespread. Nobody would willingly clean up these pages.
Dear Sony , Shut up and take my money.
Neither Headscratchers nor WMG is suitable for the forums for a multitude of reasons. Also, all these ideas need more discussion than what we can have here.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Agreed.
Anyone opposed to de-soft splitting TabletopGame.Dungeons And Dragons and then hard splitting it by alphabet?
NaNo 4328 / 50,000
- Settings (but not Campaign settings)
- Items
- Creatures
- Mechanics
- Gaming
- Meta
I agree that the above folders should all be lumped together in alphabetical order. I've already said that Campaign Settings and probably Editions should get their own pages, getting indexed on the Franchise page.
Link to TRS threads in project mode here.
I support this, but I notice that ~despoa has apparently started to split it in the current folders already. I'll call them in - methinks that was a bit too fast.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
While putting all those tropes together is a good idea, there is a possibility of duplicate trope listings occurring. Plus, I'd rather not alphabetize all of them by hand.
Duplicate examples can be merged. And it's not a given that you have to do the alphabetizing.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
NaNo 4328 / 50,000
I'm going to start work on the Editions page, using Sandbox.Dungeons And Dragons Editions until I'm ready for review.
Link to TRS threads in project mode here.
I've split the THE iDOLM@STER: Cinderella Girls to reduce it's size and staunch the bleeding. In all honesty I'm double impressed that: 1.) It got that large. 2.) Only half the cast has been covered.
I've recently split some Useful Notes out of Drink Order (National Drinks) and American Football (National Football League, Canadian Football League).
I discovered that Standard Status Effects is at 435596. I was thinking it would be appropriate to make it a supertrope and split the different effects, or at least the most common different effects, into their own subtropes. Would that be something to discuss here, in TRS, or maybe just start YKTTW the subtropes?
Reposting my thoughts on that from the D&D thread:
Just looking how the page is set up now, I'd suggest splitting off a separate Dungeons And Dragons Official Settings page (as has been mentioned, a lot of them have their own individual pages, but there's still a ton of stuff about them on the main Dungeons And Dragons page), and possibly the entire "Editions" folder — either put it in Trivia.Dungeons And Dragons or else spin off a Dungeons And Dragons Editions page. That would take out a huge chunk of text without actually touching any of the content on D&D itself in terms of tropes the game itself uses.
Really from Jupiter, but not an alien.