So, was Hades actually defeated for good in the ending, or was getting knocked into the giant whirlpool with all the dead souls just a final coup de grace thats meant to be one last humiliation on top of his whole scheme going down the drain rather than something that actually harms him (especially since he's a god)? Would he actually remain stuck down there, unable to die because he's an immortal god but still remain trapped in a limbo of the dead, and if that's the case, who's gonna run the underworld in his absence? And considering all the crap he pulled on the other gods, would they actually try to do something about him if he managed to get out, or would they just have to put up with him on even more sour terms solely because of his duties?
How did Hercules manage to grab the Tornado Titan in the climax? Funnel clouds aren't remotely solid, much less one unified object...
The beginning of the movie showed that Zeus could form clouds into all sorts of different things, like columns, his own throne, or Hercules's horse Pegasus. Either being able to handle clouds is something all gods (even ex-gods) have, or Hercules inherited it from his father.
Why on Earth did they make up Philoctetes? Actual Greek Mythology already has a half-human wise elderly hero-training mentor, the centaur Chiron. What was the point of creating an Expy instead of using him?
They didn't make him up. The mythical Philoctetes is associated with Hercules, having lit his funeral pyre and inherited his bows and arrows. Which is to say, he's directly responsible for Hercules' ascent to godhood in the myths.
How does Hercules know Hades, and vice versa, in the Animated Series? They both met when Hercules was already an adult in the film, Hades literally introduces himself to Herc. Yet in the Animated Series, they act as if Hercules knew about Hades since day 1. This was the biggest Plot Hole that irritated me out of the series.
I've heard that they fixed this at the end of the series by having Hades, Pain, and Panic (and possibly Hercules - I don't recall) all be doused with water from the River Lethe, only a single drop of which would cause you to forget even who you were.
Even if reuniting Meg's soul to her body brings her back to life, how does it bring her back to full health? Her body was, and is, still crushed from the falling pillar.
Hercules was a god at the time so maybe he healed her magically.
This makes more sense than you think—Heracles was one of the gods of health (in the fitness sense, but still). In fact, this makes so much sense it deserves a place in Fridge Brilliance
Hades and the Fates didn't even know this, so they were taking Hercules's deal blind to the fact that they wouldn't benefit.
Hercules was getting his arse kicked considerably hard during that first part of the fight with the Cyclops, after Hades took his godlike strength. Did just his strength get taken away, or both strength and endurance? Much of the damage he took should have effectively killed him.
Simple, the Cyclops wasn't actually trying to kill him, he was just torturing him for the fun of it.
Plus, powers or not Heracles was just that strong enough to take it. He reminded me of Gohan near the end of the Cell Saga in DBZ. Even without powers (or not using them in Gohan's case), he could take a beating that would otherwise kill a regular person.
Yeah, remember despite his Super Strength, Herc went through his training with Phil for many years. So his body would have high endurance from the years of working with him.
Actually, Hades *specifically* only mentions his strength. He never says 'powers' as a part of the deal, just strength.
You still need endurance when dealing with a 50-foot cyclops, which Hercules had due to the fact that he killed the Cyclops by blinding him and Meg was hurt only by the column the Cyclops knocked over during his Disney Death.
Why is Hercules able to ascend Mount Olympus to fight off the Titans, but was told that the only way to ascend Olympus was to become a god?
Well, the Gods were kinda incapacitated at the time, so any nitpicking by them would be impossible. Second, this was more about his return to Godhood to LIVE on Mount Olympus. Besides, flying Pegasus up isn't ascending, it's flying.
Zeus's exact words were that someone had turned Hercules mortal and "only gods can live on Mount Olympus". In any case, I think it's within the same realm of logic and rules as the law that you apparently must return to the Underworld if you eat any food from there. There is no physical obstructions keeping Herc from visiting Olympus, but only some strange whim of fate that keeps him from staying there full-time. In addition to that, the gods in ancient mythology were known to consume nectar and ambrosia for nourishment, neither of which can be consumed by mortals, and it was said that their true forms could incinerate anyone who looked upon them. So even if there wasn't some magical force keeping Hercules from living amongst the gods, doing so would be inconvenient to him at best and fatally impossible to accommodate at worst.
Here's what bugs me. Despite all the stuff Hercules did, he wasn't worthy of godhood until he risked his life to save his love, correct? Ok, but Meg, not only risked her life, she LOST her life saving Hercules from the falling pillar. She had no way of knowing that Hercules was going to go to the Underworld and save her. So...how come Meg doesn't get to qualify as a goddess? Instead of Hercules giving up godhood to be with Meg, how come he didn't ask if Meg could be a goddess with him? Ok, technically she wasn't the daughter of any of the gods, but still.
She wasn't the daughter of any of the gods. That's the answer. Hercules already was a god, it was just dormant until he performed a selflessly heroic act. She was selflessly heroic, but she's not a goddess.
Of course, there also is the question begged of why the Olympians didn't just make her immortal anyway. The gods and goddesses married mortals right and left and turned them immortal quite easily and as the wife of Hercules, Meg should have qualified. Yes, it was to show that Hercules values his love for her over being a god, but still...
Maybe they did that in the original mythology, but this is the Disney adaptation. It's possible that the gods and goddesses kept to themselves in this alternate universe, considering Hercules was originally a half-mortal himself. I also doubt it even happened in mythology, since most gods' relationships were little more than one night stands.
Actually, in the original mythology, Hera curses Hercules with madness in which he kills Megara and that is what causes him to do The Twelve Labours.
It happened at least once in the orignal mythology, Eros and Psyche. But the rest of your point stands.
...As memory serves, Psyche wasn't made immortal. She burst into flames at the sight of Eros' true form.
No, you are thinking of Semele...who was eventually made a goddess in some versions of the myth, too.
And Zeus and Ganymede. And several children of Apollo were also made gods by their father.
Am I the only troper who realised the Fridge Brilliance in this? Meg has a terrible fear of heights, remember?
Who says they didn't make both of them immortal, although not gods ? The two concepts are different. Phil, for instance, seems to be functionally immortal, but not a god. My guess is that Hercules and Meg were given that: immortality, plus Hercules retaining the powers he had before turning into a real god. Otherwise, that would make the ending a tearjerkingDowner Ending, if you think of Zeus and Hera, who'll live for ever and would suffer the terrible fate of seeing both their son and his love interest withering away, aging and eventually dying. And dying to go where ? To that dreadful underworld ruled by both their and Zeus's worst enemy ! Really, if they didn't do that right away, they probably thought of making both of them immortal a few days after the end of the movie.
Fortunately, The Animated Series reveals that the Elysian part is actually ruled by Zeus, while Hades just rules the neutral Underworld and the Tartarus section.
Note: I haven't seen the TV Series so my problem just apply to the movie. Why was Phil so obsessed about the constellation thing? We clearly saw in his hall of heroes the statue of Perseus which also has one. Seriously, this borders Fridge Logic.
Because the constellation and the recognition ("That's Phil's boy!") was his dream - yes, he trained the other yeuseus, but no one recognized them as Phil's students, and the one who they knew of had become a laughingstock because of that furshlugginer heel of his. The heroes got the recognition while the person who trained them to be what they became winds up living in a hovel in the middle of nowhere having to resort to spying on nymphs. The constellation would mark them as someone so important that learning about the origins of that hero would result in recognition of him as their teacher.
How can Zeus not find his son? He's the freaking KING OF THE GODS! Why the Big "NO!" when all you really needed to do was cast a "Find Hercules" spell?
Because he's not all-powerful. None of the Greek gods were. The concept of an omnipotent god, at least in the Western world, is a fairly recent one that probably originates with the Hebrews (but don't quote me on that). Before the Jews came along, gods had limits. You could fool them, you could hide from them, you could imprison them, and you could even kill them (though not easily, obviously). The level of power attributed to each god varies depending on the culture they originate from
He did say that they found Hercules but it was too late, he wasn't a God anymore.
How the fuck does Hades not know Hercules isn't dead? HE'S IN CHARGE OF THE UNDERWORLD!
He hasn't been doing his job very well.
Hades is just administration. He oversees the underworld but doesn't know the name of every single person in there. Sort of like the top administrator at a hospital doesn't know the name of every single patient in his building. Multiply that times the millions of people who have already died plus the thousands that die every single day and Pain and Panic could justtellhim Hercules was dead (which they did) and he would just go with that.
He didn't have any trouble finding Meg.
Meg had sold him her soul - he may have been able to keep tabs on her through their deal somehow.
This is an even bigger issue if you attempt to regard the spin-off midquel TV series (set while Hercules was still in-training with Phil) as cannon - there, he and Hades encountered each other in just about every episode.
I haven't watched an episode of the series in quite some time, but maybe he thought it was a different kid? Didn't Ares - as in, one of the gods living on Olympus who would have knowledge of the fact Hercules was alive - not recognize him until it was pointed out by Athena (I think)?
They did address this in the series. Hades knew he was alive it would be hard not to find out. In the last or second to last episode they introduced a younger Megara and she enlists Hercules's help in finding the Plot Device an urn full of Lethe water. The urn is tumped over on Hades, Pain, Panic, and Megara Resulting in them developing Laser-Guided Amnesia.
I totally agree with the complainer on this one. It's one of the most argued points in the movie. Yes, lots of people pass through the Underworld, but this is Hercules, son of a god and the guy who could bust up a plan for total global domination. You'd think Hades would have been paying attention to his death. Also, Zeus (who seems fairly pally with Hades, even if it's not returned) mentions that the gods DID search for Hercules. He would surely have asked his brother Hades to help out? And sure, Hades wouldn't be looking very hard, but surely that would mean he would find out through the grapevine, as they say, that Hercules was alive but mortal.
Bear in mind that Hercules was a baby at the time, and babies tend to all look pretty much the same. How's Hades gonna tell Herc apart from all the other infants headed down to the Underworld that day?
Ignoring the fact that Hercules has red hair (which isn't a very common hair color), maybe it would be the necklace that he was wearing that said "HERCULES" on it?
There's also another point to bring up. Zeus and all the other gods on Olympus knew Hercules was alive but mortal. Why didn't they tell Hades? Did it not even come up in conversation? I get that Hades doesn't see them much, but over the course of 18 years it seems like Zeus would bring up the fact that his son had turned mortal and has to live on Earth.
Not if he assumed that everyone- including Hades- knew. Why would Zeus bring that up at all? It's probably really painful for him and Hera.
Not only would it be painful to discuss in detail, but Hades seems like just the type to brush his brothers issues and worries aside as it is, so it would be especially so if those worries were caused by something Hades did and thinks he knows full well about. "Oh, it's times like these where I can't help but think of what little Hercules would-" "Yeah, yeah, sadness, loss, mourning, it's all really tragic, I just gotta go now, places to be, things to do, sorry, bro, see ya later."
I can think of a couple reasons—probably not the reasons the writers intended, but No Prize worthy anyway—for one, Hercules is "biologically" (as far as that term counts) a god, not mortal. It's possible he doesn't actually have a soul in the traditional sense. Even if he does, Hades might not know that unless he's seen another god die before, or a god-turned-mortal.
For what it's worth, in the House of Mouse TV series, Hades says at one point: "Maleficent… a name to warm my soul. You know, if I had one." So yes, perhaps Hades believes that gods don't have souls proper.note That does make sense: the gods do not seem to be really physical in the movie, more like made of smoke. It's reasonable to assume that they might not be "a body with a soul in it" but rather "a powered-up soul"… Destroying a god would be destroying the soul, there's no searching for an inner soul of the first soul.
So did Hercules actually do any of the Labors in the original myth? The most we see is that he tames Cerberus for a moment and he kicks what's presumably the Nemean Lion over a goalpost in the Zero To Hero montage, but otherwise, he doesn't perform any of the labors that made him famous.
This one can be justified — in the original myths he did the Labors to atone for killing his wife and children in a fit of Hera-caused madness. Since the Disney movie wasn't going to go anywhere near any of that, they left some hints in as a Genius Bonus and took the plot elsewhere.
This troper recalls that he fought all the monsters he had to fight. (They left the stables out.)
Actually, both the stables and obtaining the girdle of the Amazon queen were mentioned briefly; they're a part of the itinerary Phil reads aloud while Herc's getting his vase portrait done.
The TV series actually had various episodes centred around each labour.
The 'stables' one involved Herc rerouting the River Styx to clean them out - Hercules diving into the Styx to rescue Meg's soul could be seen as a Call Back to that too.
Actually, Heracles diverted the rivers Alpheus and Peneus, not the Styx.
Watch "Zero To Hero". It has brief references to the Boar, the Hydra and the Minotaur.
Actually, Herc fights the Hydra just before "Zero to Hero. He's also shown wearing the pelt of the Nemean Lion...even if that lion turned out to actually be Scar. "Zero to Hero" also includes him defeating a giant monster bird, which is probably supposed to be a stand-in for the multiple Stymphalian Birds.
About Herc's contract with Hades. If Meg was injured in any way ("he promised I wouldn't get hurt"), Herc gets his strength back. Why couldn't Meg hurt herself in some small way to give Hercule's strength back? Like tripping down the stairs or something? If any kind of pain, big or small, counts as "getting hurt", it didn't have to be as drastic as a a giant pillar! We could have avoided the whole drama, and then Herc could go and kick the fat brown Titan's ass like KABOOM!
Simply because they didn't realize it.
Hades doesn't say 'any harm'. That was Herc. Hades just says 'Meg is safe', and they both know it's in the context that Hades has no intention of hurting her. It's a Deal with the Devil - it's not written on paper for picking over later for loopholes. It's sealed with magic (or whatever), and the magic decides if the contract is broken, not a lawyer.
Also, the thing that was troubling Herc most of all at that point was that Meg had betrayed him by helping Hades all this time, not that he had lost his strength. Her giving it back to him by finding some way of hurting herself, even if it would've have worked, wasn't what Hercules needed - he needed a pep talk to help lift his spirits, and Meg knew that only Phil could do that for him, so she went to find him.
If you've read The Iliad, you know that Hercules lived before Achilles. No matter what Phil might say.
That's Greek mythology. This is Disney Canon. Two different things, however similar. Which they are not.
During the training montage, Phil orders Hercules to get down and do push-ups. Hercules is strong enough that he can easily pick up and fling a giant stone arm and discus out to sea. Push-ups would be useless unless they stacked statues on his back (which they didn't — in that scene, at least).
It might the difference in training endurance versus strength. Sure, Hercules is strong, but he really only exerted himself for a few seconds or minutes when lifting those things. Even a minor activity like push-ups, when done for a half hour, might be tiring.
The reason it's exerting is because you're lifting your own weight. Hercules can lift things that weight well over a ton—he will exert himself lifting his own weight.
Repetitive exercise develops not only strength, but muscle tone. If you rewatch the scene, right before Herc starts pushing, Phil measures his bicep and shakes his head. Part of being the Disney hero is looking the part, and that includes having the proper physique.
Granting Herc's ridiculous strength, it would take him a very long time to start getting tired from push-ups. However, the thing about doing push-ups is that he will eventually get tired from it. It might take him a day or week or something, but his muscles are doing work, and will continually expend their stored energy. Do an experiment. Holding your arm straight out from you is a very simple and easy task. Now, do it for ten minutes, without moving it at all. You can probably do it, but it will get more difficult as time passes, because your muscles are expending their energy stores even though it's an easy thing to do. Further, this sort of training will exercise the weaker muscles before the large ones, because the large ones will have more energy, so it's probably a way to specifically build Herc's less developed musculature and build endurance, rather than a method of building his power, which, frankly, doesn't really need it. Note, however, that it might be more effective with weights on his back anyhow, since he is so obscenely strong to begin with, to wear his muscles down faster. On that note, it may also be a method of teaching Herc self-discipline. Even though Herc will get bored and, eventually, tired, he has to keep doing it anyway. Deal with it.
Even though I like the film (despite being a minor mythology buff), it still makes me scratch my head as to why Ares wasn't made the Big Bad instead of Hades, considering that Ares was definitely the god with the least amount of redeeming qualities.
A Values Dissonance moment, perhaps? In modern Western societies, the Underworld is associated with Hell, so the god of that realm would be associated with the Devil. Hades in the original myths was actually a rather sympathetic character.
The Values Dissonance gets even more confusing if you know the Greeks never really viewed Hades as sympathetic. They liked him more than Ares, but the Greeks still hated the guy.
Hades indirectly gives some possible motives at the very beginning of the film. While every god has certain duties, Hades is the only one who has to work 24/7 (you could argue that Apollo, being the sun god, had this too, but back then it's doubtful that the followers of the Greek pantheon were aware that the sun was shining on other parts of the world when it was night in Greece), not to mention that Zeus forced that job on him in the first place; so while all the other gods and goddesses at least got to take parts of the day off, Hades didn't get much of a break at all. Taking control of Mount Olympus probably seemed like the best solution to him.
That makes zero sense. Hades is bitter and stressed out because his job is 24/7. So his solution is to take over everything, thereby increasing his workload?
Once he's in charge, then he can delegate some other guy to guard the land of the dead, like Zeus.
Zeus didn't force the responsibilities of the Underworld on Hades. They all drew lots after defeating the Titans to see who got what - Zeus won the sky, Poseidon the sea, and Hades the Underworld.
Hades at least could provide a more interesting motivation than Ares. Even in the original mythology, Hades was never entirely happy with his lot in life, since the other gods ostracized him for his role in overseeing the Underworld, which was what made him so bitter. Ares was a chaotic war god who pretty much caused conflicts For the Evulz. As for Hera, it'd similarly be difficult to provide her with a decent motivation if she was only portrayed as Hercules's evil aunt, and going into any more detail about their relationship might've seemed like a bit much for a children's film. (Not to mention, most of her revenge plots were very petty, and it's not like Herc ever could've faced off against her in a meaningful way.)
When Zeus tells Hercules he had to abandon him after he was turned mortal because "only gods can live on Mount Olympus", what exactly does he mean? Is he saying it's physically impossible for a mortal to live there (like if one tried, they'd be automatically teleported out by the universe itself) or that there's a rule that forbids it. And if it's the latter, does that mean there's an authority figure above Zeus that we never see, or just that he made the rule and won't change but he'd feel hypocritical if he made an exception for Hercules? I'm just trying to figure out what's to actually stop the king of the gods from letting Hercules live on Mount Olympus despite being mortal.
In reality, Mount Olympus is considered one of the highest points in Europe. Looking at the other wiki its height is at 2,917 metres/9,570 ft which is high enough to cause altitude sickness to anyone who doesn't hike or climb at great heights regularly. It's extremely unlikely that a baby, especially one rendered mortal, could live at such height without getting sick. And if they just kept baby Herc there while he was sick, the altitude sickness would only get worse and could cause permanent damage or even death. Zeus not keeping his now mortal child on the mountain with them is logical if it was to keep him from constantly being at risk of severe illness. Though that doesn't defend why Herc couldn't at an older age build up his ability to breathe in those conditions and be then invited back onto the mountain, other than the rules say he can't.
I think principle may play into this one a bit. Mount Olympus is for gods, and if you start letting mortals come up, it loses the whole "sacred" aspect.
The little potion that turns gods mortal... Where did Hades get it, and why didn't he use it before?
Possibly too risky to try and drop all the gods just like that. It could potentially throw them onto his trail.
Considering that how mortal one becomes is proportional how much of the potion one drinks, it would be too hard to get one of the gods to drink the whole bottle without them noticing.
Considering how gradual baby Hercules turned mortal, an adult god would have to be really clueless not to notice that suddenly parts of him were no longer glowing.
The gods are also much bigger than baby Hercules and every drop of the potion was needed to make him fully mortal. Maybe the potion works the under the same rules as medication and Hades would need a higher dosage for adults. As far as we know he couldn't get any more.
I have a theory on this, I believe maybe Hades had the potion made not for Hercules or the other gods but for himself. We all know he wasn't content with his life and maybe he just wanted to end it quick and painless. Just a theory though.
Another reason might be that he just couldn't use it any other time. At that moment he only had EXACTLY the amount needed to work on a newborn baby god and even a single drop less would make an incomplete effect. It's easy to assume that however the potion is made it can only be done so in extremely limited amounts (extremely rare ingredients and/or very long brewing time) and perhaps he was planning an adult dosage in a few centuries but lucked out that his main obstacle was just a baby vulnerable to the amount he had at the time.
I've always assumed that the potion is actually the water of some magical Underworld river. The film changes it around so that swimming in the Styx will kill you instead of making you immortal - if not that one, there could be some other river that does something similar to gods. There were five of them in Greek mythology, and the Lethe is mentioned in the TV series.
At the end of the movie, since Hades can't die, as he is a god, he is instead sucked into the underworld and trapped there for good. Why didn't they somehow trick him into drinking the potion, and then kill him? Perhaps the writers weren't able to come up with a clever way for Hades to be tricked, or something?
For one, it'd be entirely out-of-character for Herc to kill Hades. Secondly, Hades' job is pretty freaking important - If he died, another God would have to be found to fill his place, and as Hades implied it's not a very pleasant occupation.
Where would Hercules find this potion?
Who even says there's any more potion at all? Hades only ever shows one bottle and that only had the precise amount needed for the job and no more. Hades also never considers using more potion on Hercules later so one can reasonably assume he's just fresh out.
So if Zeus was able to beat all of the Titans by himself, why did he and the rest of the gods have such a problem defeating them at the end of the movie?
And at the same time, Hercules, who hadn't regained his godhood yet, was able to defeat the four that attacked Olympus by grabbing the tornado titan, sucking the other three into it, and throwing the whole thing into space...
This time, the Titans had the element of surprise working for them. Hermes didn't notice the Titans until they were literally on the doorstep, then add in the time it would take for him to flit around Olympus telling the others. Plus, once Hephaestus was captured, Zeus ran out of lightning bolts and couldn't fight back anymore. As for Hercules...I got nothing.
It's all very simple. In the very beginning, the Fates foretell that Zeus will finally fall if Hades attacks Olympus with the Titans. They also add that if Hercules fights, Hades will fail. Since in Greek mythology, You Can't Fight Fate, not only was Zeus predestined to be defeated by the Titans no matter what pull he had over them earlier, Hercules was predestined to make Hades fail simply by choosing to fight. Zeus was therefore incapable of defeating the Titans if his son did not fight.
Zeus also didn't truly defeat the Titans. He only imprisoned them. Presumably after months of careful planning and also with the benefit of surprise. Zeus's power was the lightning bolts. Hercules however had the physical strength to defeat the Titans for good.
He also used the Wind Titan to suck the others in and toss them far away.
What I wanna know is how the river of souls was high enough for Hercules to dip his hands for a moment, and then a few seconds later, he has to dive off the edge to grab Meg's soul.
Easy, the water receded. Probably at Hades' will to make things worse.
She was sucked down into one of the underworlds. The River Styx is simply the way in which the dead get there.
I've always figured that the river of souls is something akin to a giant toilet...of death. It waits until it's filled up with souls, and then 'flushes' them all down toward...wherever it is where souls go, and then refills itself with more.
Blue fire is at a higher temperature than orange fire, yet Hades' flame hair turns from blue to orange when he gets angry. His head cools off when he's irate?
What makes you think what happens to Hades' head has anything to do with physics?
Maybe blue fire requires some control from him, and anger makes him lose focus.
Blue fire is hotter but it's a lot dimmer too. It makes more sense to express emotion via light than heat. Also you could see it as his flames growing more uncontrolled, less efficient. That's precisely how fire usually works.
Red is the color of rage, so it makes perfect sense Hades would get angry and have raging fire spurting out everywhere.
Might just be magic fire too. It sounds like a cop-out answer but blue or purple flames are commonly associated with spirits and souls with little regard to the heat (if any) they produce.
The Fates? Sure, it's understandable that they tell Hades a "it can go either way" prophecy, but if they actually knew all, including the future, then why were they surprised when Hercules became a God?
They can see all, but that doesn't mean they HAVE seen all, perhaps? All they needed to do was tell Hades the 'either or' prophecy, then they were done with their responsibility, and really didn't care to find out what happened beyond. Hey, if you have the ability to know what happens, why not leave some things unknown on occasion? Why take all the surprise out of eternity?
Maybe they don't have the ability to know everything at once. Rather they have to look specifically. Like Hades arranged to meet them so they looked into that particular timeline (knowing he'd be late). And they could have just been very cocky that they were about to cut the life thread of a friggin Demi-God that they didn't bother to look into his future.
Given the nature of the original prophecy, it's possible some things they cannot foretell. For instance, godhood is something cosmic that shapes destinies forever, so perhaps it's something that they cannot predict.
Untrue. In Greek mythology, fate and the Fates were things even the omnipotent gods of Olympus were fearful of. Because what was foretold by fate, you could do nothing to fight, avoid, or overcome.
Yeah, well, this isn't faithful to the original Greek mythology. The question is about the Disney version.
How is it possible that Hercules had trouble beating a centaur and still be able to fight against the four titans at once?
Because with the centaur, he was fighting for ego purposes. With the Titans, he had the Power of Love on his side. And the Fate of the Universe as well.
Fighting Nessus was the first time Hercules performed a heroic battle. It's pretty obvious that he had almost zero experience. And all things considered, Nessus only really got two hits in; most of the problems Herc had were down to Rule of Funny.
The "pillars fall down and ruin everything" scene. Some kid throws a discus, Herc leaps hella high to catch it, its inertia is unchanged by the gangly 140-pounder catching it, and Herc collides with a pillar, dislodging it. This isn't exactly a cartoony movie, what the hell was going on with the physics there? Either "godly strength" includes being light enough to be carried by a discus and heavy enough to knock over a huge pillar, or that wasn't remotely his fault and that discus would've done just as much damage without him.
I just saw that scene, and it looks like Herc propelled himself forward with his own power. It definitely didn't look like he jumped straight up and was carried by the discus. So, if Herc was throwing himself forward, it makes sense that he'd dislodge the pillar.
Eh, it's not like he launched himself at high velocity. And again, he was skinny. If bumping into that column at that speed knocked it over, it must have been pretty precarious to begin with.
He wouldn't need to launch himself at high velocity - he's a demigod who can't control his strength.
What's the point in Meg selling her soul to Hades? It's shown she wants freedom, but she's also shown that she can disobey Hades any time she pleases. She clearly has her free will, so what's the big issue? And it's not like she's screwed in the afterlife either since everybody goes to Hades when they die.
No, she's just shown talking back to Hades, not disobeying him. So, he tied her up with smoke and apparently had it tightening. The Greek gods being rather less omnipotent than the Christian God, it's likely he couldn't have that done to just anybody. But he owned Meg. It's quite likely that whether she wanted to or not, in the end he would make her.
Remember when he says, "I say, 'I want Wonder Boy's head on a silver platter,' and you say..." And she finishes, "Medium or well done?" This when she was actively defying him. It seems obvious that he actually made her say it, just by willing it so. Which he could do because he literally owned her.
The Titans were doing a pretty good job of beating Zeus before Hercules showed up. But then Hercules just frees Zeus and they run away like little girls?
1.) The Titans don't start running away like little girls right away. First,, Hercules frees the other gods, including Hephaestus, who is then able to forge more thunderbolts for Zeus, who uses them to blast the face off of the giant Rock Titan. Cue the Titans running away like little girls since their main heavy is about to get incapacitated.
2.) Not all of them try running away, either - the Wind Titan tries to come up on Hercules, but Hercules manages to grab hold of him, uses him to vacuum up the other three Titans, and proceeds to throw them out across the cosmos and destroy them all.
So where did that bottle of "make a god mortal" potion comes from? Is the reason he can't use it against the Olympians as simple as "they're too smart to eat/drink anything Hades offers them?"
Maybe he was planning to poison Zeus, but when the Fates prophesised that Titans will suffice for the task, unless Hercules stops them, he chose to use it on him instead. Remember, the vial is only enough for one god.
Considering the potion causes gods to lose their glow from the bottom up, and the transformation is proportional to how much they've drunk, it'd be difficult for Zeus (or any of the others) not to notice and stop drinking.
Since Hades is a god, even if evil, shouldn't he have an aura?
I always assumed centuries of living underground dampened Hades' glow.
Maybe that's what his fire is.
I get the feeling that, at least within the film's realm of continuity, Hades isn't actually a god, and I mean that in the same way that the film portrays Hera as Hercules' loving mother instead of evil stepmother and the Titans as chaotic personifications of the elements instead of the forebearers of the Olympians. I don't recall whether Hades and Zeus are ever referred to as "brothers" like they are in mythology, but he does refer to the Titans themselves that way, so...
So does Zeus just have the power to take away the divinity of anyone he likes? How exactly did Hercules go back to being "Mortal with super strength (presumably)" after he decided to stay on earth and Zeus nodded? Do gods just have the ability to give up their immortality? Or if it was Zeus, why didn't he use this to stop Hades the second he found out he was initiating the coup?
I think maybe every god has the ability to give up their own immortality, should they so desire, and Zeus nodding was only a way of showing that he would respect his son's decision and support him no matter what he chose to do. Or maybe Zeus's approval and a god's own willingness to become mortal are both required for it to happen.
How were Pain and Panic able to kidnap Hercules from his crib on Olympus without being severely injured in the process, yet when they try to attack his adoptive parents later on as snakes he pretty much curb-stomps them. Even if he'd been caught by surprise the first time and wasn't able to properly fight against them, it's shown later that his strength extends to tasks as simple and nonchalant as opening a door. Wouldn't he have struggled even the slightest bit as they tried to take him?
Could just be that Hercules was asleep when they were kidnapping him, and Pain and Panic were careful enough on Olympus to not wake him up.
Why does Phil start laughing at the idea of Hercules being the son of Zeus when he mentioned earlier that one of the heroes he trained was Perseus, who was also a son of Zeus? Does he just laugh at the idea every time he meets one of them?
Perseus might not have been the son of Zeus in this verse. After all, here Zeus actually is a loving father and not the cheating jerk he was in the myths.
Why doesn't Herc keep his promise with Hades at the end of the film? He said that he'd stay as his prisoner if he was able to get Meg free - Hades assumed he'd die before he got to her and he ended up becoming a god instead, but even gods have to hold themselves to what they've promised others. Yet when Hades starts asking him for mercy, Hercules just punches him in the face. Twice. That doesn't seem like a very good message for kids.
It may not be completely moral, but I always assumed it was a Batman Gambit on Herc's part. He decided to play along with making a deal because he knows Hades making them (having already made one with him prior). It was just a way of getting Hades to let him rescue Meg legally.
If you notice, they never actually shook on the deal; Hades said, "She goes, you stay," but the deal was never finalized with a handshake like the "take Herc's strength" deal was. There was nothing, magical or legal, really binding either party to the deal.
But that's the point - he didn't rescue her legally. He said that he would stay in the Underworld if he managed get Meg out of the river. Instead, he punches Hades into the river and leaves. Had Herc said, "If I die, you can have us both, but if I live, then we both go free," then it would've been legal even if he escaped. It would have been done through a previously-unseen loophole, but it still would've been legal.
My guess? Herc didn't feel obligated to follow the deal once Hades revealed said deal was rigged.
Except Hades never revealed the deal was rigged. Hercules knew that he would age rapidly if he tried entering the river - Hades telling him after he'd gone in was just a teasing reminder. It doesn't give him an excuse not to fulfill his end of it.
Could Zeus and Hera have done nothing to try and reclaim their son while he was growing up, instead of just watching over him from afar? Why don't they just go visit his adoptive parents and tell them, "Hello, we're the king and queen of the gods, and that baby boy you found near Mt. Olympus just happens to be our son."
Hm, they might have been worried about what kind of attitude Hercules would develop if he knew his parents were Divine Royalty, at least when they're not around to influence him for good.
So Hades' driving motivation throughout this film is his job - he claims to be so busy down in the Underworld that he doesn't ever have a chance to spend time on Olympus with the other gods, and he despises Zeus for forcing his duties upon him. But what work is he really talking about that keeps him so preoccupied and hateful? He apparently doesn't really oversee the passage of the dead, as he didn't know Hercules hadn't been killed as a baby, and we never see him in the Underworld throughout the rest of the movie until the end, meaning there presumably wouldn't be much that he's neglecting to do down there.
Not liking his job may just have been an excuse to grab power, which is what he really wanted. Although, frankly, being Lord of the Dead seems like a more powerful job than Zeus', and IIRC, in Greek mythology this is considered to be true.
In Greek mythology, the Olympian gods hate the Underworld - it's dark, it's underground, and it's full of dead people. Maybe Disney!Hades just hates having to work and live there at all.
True, but in Greek mythology, their hatred of the Underworld seemed to extend to Hades himself, hence, he was generally ostracized. In the film, the other gods seem happy to have him on Olympus and are actually upset that he "prefers" to spend so much time in the Underworld. So even if his home is there, it stands to reason that he could at least spend most of his time on Olympus, if he wanted.
Um, where exactly does Meg think she's going? She's on OLYMPUS for gods' sake. Is she looking for the elevator?
...Was that a Percy Jackson reference you were going for? Well, anyway, the girl was pretty much heartbroken at that point. Chances are she was just going to go sit somewhere out of sight from the gods and wait for one of them to use their powers to send her back to earth. She may also have been somewhat afraid of them, as well, as she served, albeit unwillingly, under someone who had only recently tried to overthrow them all, and it was thanks to her involvement that he nearly succeeded.
Yes that was a "Percy Jackson" reference. Maybe Meg's frightened and heartbroken enough to be planning to throw herself off the edge
Why doesn't Hades just kill Hercules himself? He seems capable enough, given that Hercules can't directly challenge him until he attains godhood. And if he's worried about Zeus or the other gods finding out then it'd seem ill-advised to personally meet with Hercules at all. He could have waited until moments before the titans were due to be released, offed the demigod, then continued on with his plan unmolested.
The Greek gods were pictured as being flawed, imperfect, and most of all, not all-powerful. As mighty as they were, they still couldn't do whatever they wanted to whoever they wanted, hence why Hades made that deal with Hercules in the end. As for confronting him in person, the Titans were to be released soon at that point, meaning Hades didn't have time to think up another way of exploiting Hercules' weakness, and that the gods would be done away with soon enough once he succeeded in taking over.
It's also implied that even as a baby, Hercules was already stronger than Hades, mangling his finger. Hades might not have been able to take adult Hercules in a real fight.
Not really. He grabbed at Hades's finger, which Hades wasn't prepared for. Doesn't automatically mean he was stronger than him.
How did Hades know that Meg was dying after the battle with the Titans? The deal only said that Herc's strength would return if she got hurt, not if she outright suffered a fatal blow, so that couldn't have tipped him off. And if he can just sense when someone dies, he shouldn't done the same thing when Hercules was a baby.
Did Hercules really have to give up his godhood to stay with Meg? He could have just asked his parents if he could stay with Meg while retaining his godhood and Herc could just come up to Mt. Olympus to visit his family and the rest of the gods whenever he felt like doing so. Heck, he could have told his parents that he could stay with the rest of the mortals and keep them safe with his godhood just in case anyone would be stupid enough to threaten Greece.
Because if he remains a god, Meg will eventually grow old and die, while he won't have aged a day. By the end of the film, immortal life has come to mean nothing to him if she isn't in it. Principle could play into it, as well - if the people were to have one of the immortal gods of Olympus living among them like a mortal, it might take away from the dignified image the gods are trying to impose.
Meta: Is there any reason why Disney hasn't tried to do some sort of reboot or remake of Hercules? I don't mean just a retelling of this same story with the same anachronisms and the goofy tone, but just a new take on depicting one of the stories of Ancient Greece. They've had two movies about life on the Polynesian islands and two of them concerning Pre-Columbian natives, so why would making another movie about the myths of Ancient Greece be that much of a stretch? I've seen this movie so many times, and the narrator's first few words before the Muses cut in have always given me such an epic image of how such a movie could play out, if done right.
Keep in mind that not all Disney films are made by the same people. There are different directors, script writers, producers, etc. that want to touch on different subjects/stories and wouldn't want to seem to repeat themselves. I figure something like Moana and Lilo and Stitch can get away with it since they only share in common the Polynesian setting, but instead a film with the same setting and mythology/story origin like Hercules could seem repetitive to some audiences. I also think maybe Disney doesn't care much about Hercules (the film) itself and would rather focus on different movies, or maybe they just feel greek mythology has been touched a lot in outside media so they don't need to add their "touch" to it (sorta like how they avoided for years superhero films until the Marvel buyout, or how they don't tend to touch classic novels/plays outside of Hunchback).
Minor issue here, but when Hercules is born, his hair is blonde, and he has what appears to be a pretty nice tan. As he's losing his glow due to the potion Pain and Panic feed him, his hair turns red and his skin a rather fair complexion. Thus, it's clearly not like his hair and skin changed color like that as he grew older - he got them right away - so why, when he regains his godhood in the end, doesn't he return to his original appearance?
So Zeus could just take Hercules Godliness, at least at the end... Why couldn't he just give Hercules back his Godliness at the beginning? He can take it, but not give it without a ridiculous "You've gotta become a true hero" requirement? And technically, that is one of Zeus's powers; he did give one of his illegitimate Sons full Godliness.