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Fan Dumb & Hate Dumb are now part of Flame Bait. Only in-universe examples are allowed.


* FanDumb



* HateDumb: Lots of people couldn't seem to get past the concept that the ArtificialGravity aboard the ''Tiger Claw'' evidently affected the volume just beyond the end of the ship's flight deck, for whatever reason. At least it was consistently shown to be that way.
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--> '''Reinhart''': ''People don't change that much. Some are born wolf. Some are sheep. You might be wearing sheep's clothing, but Your fangs are shoing through.''

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--> '''Reinhart''': ''People don't change that much. Some are born wolf. Some are sheep. You might be wearing sheep's clothing, but Your your fangs are shoing showing through.''

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* BrokenBase. ''Privateer 2: The Darkening''. It was for many people a glitched-up mess, but the cutscenes were done really well.



* OneSceneWonder: Reinhart (Creator/DavidWarner) in ''Privateer 2''. A captured FauxAffablyEvil Kindred leader who give a spectacular ExpoSpeak concerning the game's amnesiac protgonist's identity. [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ET6UEXAmc68&list=HL1379098180 Behold one of the best performances in video game acting]].

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* OneSceneWonder: Reinhart (Creator/DavidWarner) in ''Privateer 2''. A captured FauxAffablyEvil Kindred leader who give a spectacular ExpoSpeak concerning the game's amnesiac protgonist's identity. [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ET6UEXAmc68&list=HL1379098180 Behold one of the best greatest performances in video game acting]]. acting]].
--> '''Lev''': ''Whoever I was, I've changed.''
--> '''Reinhart''': ''People don't change that much. Some are born wolf. Some are sheep. You might be wearing sheep's clothing, but Your fangs are shoing through.''
--> '''Lev''': ''Yeah, well. Maybe losing my memory was the best thing that could've happened to me. It's given me a chance to choose who I am.''
--> '''Reinhart''': ''My god, this is almost becoming like a religious experience. Forget it. As soon as your old memories returns, you will get back to what you used to be; Your father's son.''

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ABC order, fixing wick-y type stuff.


* GrowingTheBeard: While the main campaign of the first ''Wing Commander'' and the first ''Secret Missions'' expansion pack were miles ahead of anything else available in the early 90s in terms of graphics and game play, the storyline is little more than an ExcusePlot. In ''Secret Missions 2'' the characterization and plot both become much more engrossing. We first meet several recurring characters in [=SM2=], both heroes and villains.



* GrowingTheBeard: While the main campaign of WingCommander 1 and the first SecretMissions expansion pack were miles ahead of anything else available in the early 90s in terms of graphics and game play, the storyline is little more than an ExcusePlot. In the SecretMissions2 the characterization and plot both become much more engrossing. We first meet several recurring characters in SM2, both heroes and villains.

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* GrowingTheBeard: While the main campaign of WingCommander 1 and the first SecretMissions expansion pack were miles ahead of anything else available in the early 90s in terms of graphics and game play, the storyline is little more than an ExcusePlot. In the SecretMissions2 the characterization and plot both become much more engrossing. We first meet several recurring characters in SM2, both heroes and villains.
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Added the Growing the Beard moment in SM 2



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* GrowingTheBeard: While the main campaign of WingCommander 1 and the first SecretMissions expansion pack were miles ahead of anything else available in the early 90s in terms of graphics and game play, the storyline is little more than an ExcusePlot. In the SecretMissions2 the characterization and plot both become much more engrossing. We first meet several recurring characters in SM2, both heroes and villains.
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** Anything dealing with flying through a mine cluster in a ''Wing Commander'' game. You have to maneuver ''painfully slowly'' through these if you want to make it through. At least you can shoot [[TheAsteroidThicket asteroids]] out of your way. [[DontTryThisAtHome Try the same with a space mine]] and...''BOOM!'' [[FinalDeath Twenty-one gun salute city for you]].

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** Anything dealing with flying through a mine cluster in a ''Wing Commander'' game. You have to maneuver ''painfully slowly'' through these if you want to make it through. At least you can shoot [[TheAsteroidThicket asteroids]] {{Asteroid|Thicket}}s out of your way. [[DontTryThisAtHome Try the same with a space mine]] and...''BOOM!'' [[FinalDeath Twenty-one gun salute city for you]].
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None


* OneSceneWonder: Reinhart (DavidWarner) in ''Privateer 2''. A captured FauxAffablyEvil Kindred leader who give a spectacular ExpoSpeak concerning the game's amnesiac protgonist's identity. [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ET6UEXAmc68&list=HL1379098180 Behold one of the best performances in video game acting]].

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* OneSceneWonder: Reinhart (DavidWarner) (Creator/DavidWarner) in ''Privateer 2''. A captured FauxAffablyEvil Kindred leader who give a spectacular ExpoSpeak concerning the game's amnesiac protgonist's identity. [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ET6UEXAmc68&list=HL1379098180 Behold one of the best performances in video game acting]].



** Josh Lucas and [[{{Lost}} Francois Chau]] in ''Wing Commander III'' (and ''IV'' in Chau's case)

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** Josh Lucas and [[{{Lost}} [[Series/{{Lost}} Francois Chau]] in ''Wing Commander III'' (and ''IV'' in Chau's case)
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Added DiffLines:

* OneSceneWonder: Reinhart (DavidWarner) in ''Privateer 2''. A captured FauxAffablyEvil Kindred leader who give a spectacular ExpoSpeak concerning the game's amnesiac protgonist's identity. [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ET6UEXAmc68&list=HL1379098180 Behold one of the best performances in video game acting]].
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moved from character page


* StoicWoobie: Mariko "Spirit" Tanaka

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* StoicWoobie: Mariko "Spirit" TanakaTanaka and Michael "Iceman" Casey both have lost loved ones to the Kilrathi (fiance and family, respectively), but don't go wallowing in self-pity over it.
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* UnwinnableByInsanity: In ''Privateer'', if you manage to run out of jump drive fuel, you'd better hope you're in a system where there are stations and/or planets to land on. If that's not the case? You'll be forced to quit and restart the game from a previous save that you hopefully not have erased yet, especially if it's for an important mission.

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* UnwinnableByInsanity: In ''Privateer'', if you manage to run out of jump drive fuel, you'd better hope you're in a system where there are stations and/or planets to land on. If that's not the case? You'll be forced to quit and restart the game from a previous save that you hopefully not have not erased yet, especially if it's for an important mission.
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* UnwinnableByInsanity: In ''Privateer'', if you manage to run out of jump drive fuel, you'd better hope you're in a system where there are stations and/or planets to land on. If that's not the case? You'll be forced to quit and restart the game from a previous save that you hopefully not have erased yet, especially if it's for an important mission.
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This isn\'t YMMV. Moving.


* TitleConfusion: ''Prophecy'' is sometimes referred to by fans as "Wing Commander 5", as the fifth "main line" Wing Commander game, even though it's never been used outside the fandom using it as a working title, when almost nothing of the game was yet known to anyone not involved with production of the game.

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* TitleConfusion: ''Prophecy'' is sometimes referred to by fans as "Wing Commander 5", as the fifth "main line" Wing Commander game, even though it's never been used outside the fandom using it as a working title, when almost nothing of the game was yet known to anyone not involved with production of the game.
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Seether is more Well Intentioned Extremist, thus not CM material


* CompleteMonster: Even if Seether is just following orders, he clearly enjoy slaughtering thousands of innocent civilians [[SlasherSmile way]] [[EvilLaugh too]] [[LovesTheSoundOfScreaming much]], and has no problem violating UsefulNotes/TheLawsAndCustomsOfWar in outright executing a prisoner of war, in the ''Wing Commander IV'' {{novelization}}.
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The movie was set like 15 years before WC3. Even Dawson Casting only stretches things so far. Doesn\'t help the entry was complaining, either.


* WTHCastingAgency: With an all star cast that made up the games, you replace them ALL for the movie including ''MarkHamill'' with the main cast of She'sAllThat/ScoobyDoo?!

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* WTHCastingAgency: With an all star cast that made up the games, you replace them ALL for the movie including ''MarkHamill'' with the main cast of She'sAllThat/ScoobyDoo?!

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None



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* WTHCastingAgency: With an all star cast that made up the games, you replace them ALL for the movie including ''MarkHamill'' with the main cast of She'sAllThat/ScoobyDoo?!
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moved from the main WCA(tv) page

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[[AC:Wing Commander Academy]]
* FoeYay: An occasional element of Maniac and Archer's UST.
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The Scrappy moved from Characters.Wing Commander, quote formatting tweaked

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* [[TheScrappy/VideoGames The Scrappy]]:
** Everybody seems to hate Maniac (both in real life and in-universe)... [[CreatorsPet Except for the writing staff]], since of all of the cast members who get KilledOffForReal, Maniac -- the most likely candidate given his rank, status, and reckless behavior -- isn't one of them.
** But then, it seems like his [[TheScrappy Scrappiness]] is deliberate. After all, he's played by [[HeyItsThatGuy Biff Tannen]].
** Tom Wilson's interpretation of Maniac (in ''VideoGame/WingCommander III'', ''VideoGame/WingCommander IV'', and ''Prophecy''), actually did a lot to [[RescuedFromTheScrappyHeap redeem]] him, at least within the context of the FMV footage. He [[EnsembleDarkhorse steals all his scenes]] and is a lot of fun to watch.
** He's even something of a [[TheChewToy Chew Toy]] in ''The Price of Freedom,'' where Maniac's constant snipes fail to get a rise out of Blair--but Marshall falls for Blair's prods ''every time.''
--->''[Blair and Maniac have just defected from Confed and Blair is trying to cheer Maniac up]''\\
'''Maniac:''' At least when I go, I'll be in a cockpit.\\
'''Blair:''' Come on, cheer up! I still say it'll be friendly fire that gets you.\\
'''Maniac:''' I don't know. The side we picked to be on has a long, hard road ahead.\\
'''Blair:''' Will you look on the bright side? At least now you won't have to deal with that Confed promotion that finally came through.\\
'''Maniac:''' My promotion came?! MY PROMOTION--! <claps> ... Confed, that's--that's not right ...

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*** Probably because it is either so distantly related to not have any impact on canon at all, or because attempts to put it into the canon were so [[DolledUpInstallment transparent]] that nobody bothers to address it.



* RetroactiveRecognition: Josh Lucas and [[{{Lost}} Francois Chau]] in ''Wing Commander III'' (and ''IV'' in Chau's case); [[IronChefAmerica Mark Dacascos]] in ''Wing Commander IV''.

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* RetroactiveRecognition: RetroactiveRecognition:
**
Josh Lucas and [[{{Lost}} Francois Chau]] in ''Wing Commander III'' (and ''IV'' in Chau's case); case)
**
[[IronChefAmerica Mark Dacascos]] in ''Wing Commander IV''.



* [[ThatOneLevel/SpaceSimulator That One Level]]: Anything dealing with flying through a mine cluster in a ''Wing Commander'' game. You have to maneuver ''painfully slowly'' through these if you want to make it through. At least you can shoot [[TheAsteroidThicket asteroids]] out of your way. [[DontTryThisAtHome Try the same with a space mine]] and...''BOOM!'' [[FinalDeath Twenty-one gun salute city for you]].

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* [[ThatOneLevel/SpaceSimulator That One Level]]: Level]]:
**
Anything dealing with flying through a mine cluster in a ''Wing Commander'' game. You have to maneuver ''painfully slowly'' through these if you want to make it through. At least you can shoot [[TheAsteroidThicket asteroids]] out of your way. [[DontTryThisAtHome Try the same with a space mine]] and...''BOOM!'' [[FinalDeath Twenty-one gun salute city for you]].



** The mine clusters? Sheesh! They are NOTHING compared to infamous Kurasawa-2 mission in ''Wing Commander''. Yes, the one with Ralari defense (you have about ten seconds to destroy 4 heavy cat fighters, or else the craft you're supposed to be protecting goes boom).
*** Interestingly enough, the level was designed to discourage players from only going on the winning path.
*** If you do manage to protect the captured enemy cruiser, you are sent straight to the victorious ending mission sequence. [[RammingAlwaysWorks Ramming the enemy fighters works wonders, it turns out.]]

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** The mine clusters? Sheesh! They are NOTHING compared to infamous Kurasawa-2 mission in ''Wing Commander''. Yes, the one with Ralari defense (you have about ten seconds to destroy 4 heavy cat fighters, or else the craft you're supposed to be protecting goes boom).
*** Interestingly enough, the level was designed to discourage players from only going on the winning path.
***
boom). If you do manage to protect the captured enemy cruiser, you are sent straight to the victorious ending mission sequence. [[RammingAlwaysWorks Ramming the enemy fighters works wonders, it turns out.]]



* TheyChangedItNowItSucks: A ''very'' common complaint.
** Particularly the name of the carrier changing from TCS ''Tiger''''s''' Claw'' to TCS ''Tiger Claw'', although the change was an accidental one due to script editing confusion between editors for the film.

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* TheyChangedItNowItSucks: A ''very'' common complaint.
** Particularly
complaint, particularly the name of the carrier changing from TCS ''Tiger''''s''' Claw'' to TCS ''Tiger Claw'', although the change was an accidental one Claw'' due to script editing confusion between editors for the film.
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None

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** In a blink-and-you'll-miss-it minor scene, you can see that the pilot who offers to carry Blair's bag when he first arrives aboard the ''Lexington'' is none other than [[Film/StarshipTroopers Casper Van Dien]].
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\"former secret plot twist\" rather
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not this trope. IWHS is \"former secret that everyone now knows\"


** There is a very noticeable change in the music when his name appears in the intro credits, just as the squadron of Dragons turns up.
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** There is a very noticeable change in the music when his name appears in the intro credits, just as the squadron of Dragons turns up.
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doesn\'t apply


[[AC:Series]]
* TooGoodToLast: Plans for a second season were ruined by USA Network terminating their entire Saturday morning cartoon lineup thanks to a horrendously bad mass-show-crossover.
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* TooGoodToLast: Plans for a second season were ruined by USA Network terminating their entire Saturday morning cartoon lineup.

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* TooGoodToLast: Plans for a second season were ruined by USA Network terminating their entire Saturday morning cartoon lineup.lineup thanks to a horrendously bad mass-show-crossover.
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The characters page (as well as ACI here), already let the Kilrathi out of the bag.


** A lot of people like to pretend the FaceHeelTurn by [[spoiler:"Hobbes"]] never happened.

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** A lot of people like to pretend the FaceHeelTurn by [[spoiler:"Hobbes"]] Hobbes never happened.

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It was the \'\'Gratha\'\' that made Kurasawa 2 Unwinnable By Design; the Jalthi at least had [[Attack Its Weak Point unshielded engines].


* DemonicSpiders: The Jalthis in ''Wing Commander'' may be slow, but their six-gun attacks are deadly, making escort missions very difficult (especially [[ScrappyLevel Kurasawa 2]], which was designed to be [[NintendoHard quite difficult]]).

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* DemonicSpiders: The Jalthis in ''Wing Commander'' may be slow, but their six-gun attacks are deadly, making escort missions very difficult (especially [[ScrappyLevel Kurasawa 2]], which was designed difficult.
* FanDislikedExplanation: The whole "sleeper agent" business re: Hobbes is unnecessary, except as an attempt
to make him unsympathetic. Think about it: What would ''your'' reaction be [[NintendoHard quite difficult]]).if the leaders of the nation you befriended a decade ago decide that the best way to stop a war with your people is [[ApocalypseHow to utterly destroy the birthplace of your people]]?
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None


* CompleteMonster: Even if Seether is just following orders, he clearly enjoy slaughtering thousands of innocent civilians [[SlasherSmile way]] [[EvilLaugh too]] [[LovesTheSoundOfScreaming much]], and has no problem violating the LawsAndCustomsOfWarfare in outright executing a prisoner of war, in the ''Wing Commander IV'' {{novelization}}.

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* CompleteMonster: Even if Seether is just following orders, he clearly enjoy slaughtering thousands of innocent civilians [[SlasherSmile way]] [[EvilLaugh too]] [[LovesTheSoundOfScreaming much]], and has no problem violating the LawsAndCustomsOfWarfare UsefulNotes/TheLawsAndCustomsOfWar in outright executing a prisoner of war, in the ''Wing Commander IV'' {{novelization}}.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* CompleteMonster: Even if Seether is just following orders, he clearly enjoy slaughtering thousands of innocent civilians [[SlasherSmile way]] [[EvilLaugh too]] [[LovesTheSoundOfScreaming much]], and has no problem violating the LawsAndCustomsOfWarfare in outright executing a prisoner of war, in the ''Wing Commander IV'' {{novelization}}.
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Love It Or Hate It only permits in-universe examples


* FanDumb: Due to the LoveItOrHateIt extremes.

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* FanDumb: Due to the LoveItOrHateIt extremes.FanDumb

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[[AC:WesternAnimation series]]

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[[AC:WesternAnimation series]][[AC:Series]]

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