History YMMV / Gor

* FridgeLogic: We are told that the majority of women are free and that only 3% of women are slaves. This would make them about as common as natural redheads, meaning that most people would probably only know one or two. Yet we run into huge casts of slavegirls. We are told that there are streets and streets of Paga Taverns, each equipped with dozens, to hundreds of slave girls, there are female slaves running on errands in every city, there are bazaars full of slavegirls, and independent caravans of slavegirls, and basically everyone knows the full slave etiquette - collars, positions, etc. This is completely incompatible. The fact is that while we are TOLD that there are lots of free women on Gor, we are shown that at least half the women on Gor are slaves.

* TakeThatScrappy: Even ''Outlaw'' seems to have been aware of just how annoying Watney was, as evidenced by the ending where [[spoiler:the ring ends up sending Watney back to Earth alone without Cabot, who finally gets to be with Talena, while Watney ends up having to explain to some cops why he's jaywalking in the middle of Los Angeles dressed in a ridiculous outfit]].

** Then again the values dissonanace between the message in the novels, and human society, where we insist that all humans deserve human rights.

* InternetBackdraft: In 90% of the internet, a mention of Gor is equivalent to trolling, unless followed up with scathing hatred and opening the floor to burn John Norman in effigy. It is a banned topic on the [=StarDestroyer.net=] forums.
* SnarkBait: One of the main reactions by most to the ideals behind the series, followed closely by horror and/or hatred, [[BerserkButton and considering the premise of the series]]...
** If [[http://www.rdrop.com/~wyvern/data/houseplants.html Houseplants of Gor]] is any indication, Gor is just [[StealthPun begging]] for an AbridgedSeries.
** Somewhere out there is a fan novel called ''Transvestites of Gor'' with a followup called ''Female Men of Gor''. Fans at conventions used to joke about ''Podkayne of Gor'', but it's uncertain whether that one actually exists.

%%* TheScrappy: WATNEY!

* FridgeLogic: We are told that the majority of women are free and that only 3% of women are slaves. This would mean that they would be about as rare as a left handed gay person with red hair, meaning most people would never have even met one. Yet we run into huge cast of slavegirls. We are told that there are streets and streets of Paga Taverns, each equipped with dozens, to hundreds of slave girls, there are female slaves running on errands in every city, there are bazaars full of slavegirls, and independent caravans of slavegirls. This is completely incompatible. The fact is that while we are TOLD that there are lots of free women on Gor, we are shown that at least half the women on Gor are slaves. There would be no way that everyone would know about collars, and positions or anything else if slavegirls were as rare as 3 percent of the female population. They would basically be non-existent as far as most people knew.

-->'''Queen:''' Get '''''OUT''''' of here, '''''you [=DISgusting=] WORM!'''''

* FridgeLogic: We are told that the majority of women are free and that only 3% of women are slaves. This would mean that they would be about as rare as a left handed gay person with red hair, meaning most people would never have even met one. Yet we run into huge cast of slavegirls. We are told that there are streets and streets of Paga Taverns, each equipped with dozens, to hundreds of slave girls, there are female slaves running on errands in every city, there are bazaars full of slavegirls, and independent caravans of slavegirls. This is completely incompatible. The fact is that while we are TOLD that there are lots of free women on Gor, we are shown that at least half the women on Gor are slaves. There would be no way that everyone would know about collars, and positions or anything else if slavegirls were as rare as 3 percent of the population. They would basically be non-existent as far as most people knew.

** Really? 3 percent would mean that about one in every thirty women you saw was a slave. It would make slave girls far more common than policemen or firemen or military, or even teachers or doctors, in our world, and there can be hardly anyone who doesn't know what one of those looks like.

%%* MarySuetopia

** [[http://books.adultfanfiction.net/story.php?no=544176437 Gay, Bejeweled, Nazi Bikers of Gor.]]

* MarySuetopia: The trope could be named "Lands of Gor" instead.

* TheScrappy: WATNEY!

* FamilyUnfriendlyAesop: Women are nasty, bitchy feminists when given any respect whatsoever. Only when raped and forced into slavery can they become loving, gentle and kind.
** There are several cases in the books where a woman is raped, bound, stripped, or otherwise undergoes some sort of sex-related humiliation. [[RapePortrayedAsRedemption This invariably makes her more gentle, more feminine, and overall more pleasant to be around.]] To hammer the point home, she's often shown as being ''happier'' once she's been properly raped and put in her place.
** [[CreatorInJoke This may be based on the traditional portrayal of Black slaves vs. White upper class females in the Old South]], given how the book series started in the politically-turbulent [[TheSixties 1960s]]. [[http://www.pbs.org/wnet/slavery/experience/gender/history2.html The traditional view was Black women were either sexually promiscuous]], [[http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/aia/part4/4p2956.html or sexually exploited by owners and overseers]], or both, [[http://www.studentpulse.com/articles/747/sexual-relations-between-elite-white-women-and-enslaved-men-in-the-antebellum-south-a-socio-historical-analysis while the White elite had to maintain proper standards in their personal life]], avenging their frustrations and jealousy on helpless slaves.
*** Considering that the lives of free women of Gor are EVEN WORSE then that of slave girls, as they have to wear uncomfortable clothing at all times, never go anywhere without a armed escort, if they show any kind of evidence of feeling desire they are told that they are "acting like slaves" and are subject to being enslaved at anytime should any man find them attractive, I would say that idea makes absolutely no sense. The lives of women in the South was not bad, and not all that restricted. they could and would have affairs( just not with slaves) read books, climb treees, teach school, and do all kinds of fun and intellectually rewarding things. Of course, it could still be true.
* FridgeLogic We are told that the majority of women are free, That on ly 3percent of women are slaves. Meaning that they would be about as rare as a left handed gay person with red hair. Meanikng most people would never have even MET ONE. Yet we run into huge cast of slavegirls. We are told that there are streets and streets of Paga Taverns, each equipped with dozens, to hundreds of slave girls. There are female slaves running on errands in every city. There are bazars full of slavegirls, and independent caravans of slavegirls. This is completely in compatible. The fact is that while we are TOLD that there are lots of free women on Gor, we are shown that at least half the women onGor are slaves. There would be no way that everyone would know aboput colars, and positions or anything else if slavegirls were as rare as 3 percent of the population. thjey would basically be non existant as far as most people knew.

*** Considering that the lives of free women of Gor is EVEN WORSE then that of slave girls, as they have to wear uncomfortable clothing at all times, never go anywhere without a armed escort, if they show any kind of evidence of feeling desire they are told that they are "acting like slaves" and are subject to being enslaved at anytime should any man find them attractive, I would say that idea makes absolutely no sense. The lives of women in the South was not bad, and not all that restricted. they could and would have affairs( just not with slaves) read books, climb treees, teach school, and do all kinds of fun and intellectually rewarding things. Of course, it could still be true.

*** Considering that the lives of free women of Gor is EVEN WORSE then that of slave girls, as they have to wear uncomfortable clothing at all times, never go anywhere without a armed escort, if they show any kind of evidence of feeling desire they are told that they are "acting like slaves" and are subject to being enslaved at anytime should any man find them attractive, I would say that idea makes absolutely no sense. Of course, it could still be true.

** Watney is SUPPOSED to be the scrappy. Its the writer's way of showing us how stupid and silyy men who do not want to do micate women are.

** If you can't figure out that Watyney is supposed to basically be "Earth men" in general, then you are not reading the books very carefully. In Norman's eyes Watney is all men who actually don't want women licking their boots.

* FridgeLogic We are told that the majority of women are free, but we seldom encounter any in the series, and everyone we do encounter is enslaved by the end of the novel. Also, we run into huge cast of slavegirls. We are told that there are streets and streets of Paga Taverns, each equipped with dozens, to hundreds of slave girls. There are female slaves running on errands in every city. There are bazars full of slavegirls, and independent caravans of slavegirls. Also, wre are told that in most ways free women are less free then slaves, because if they exhibit any kind of sexual desire, they are considered natural slaves, and enslaved. If they do the "slave dance" or in other words orgasm, they are considered natural slaves and enslaved. If they slip up and show their face under the veil they are considered to do it on purpose, and are enslaved. If any warrior wants to capture them, they are enslaved. If any city looses a war, all the women are enslaved. So, how can this add up to the majority of women being free? And considering that to be "free" a woman has to hide her face and stay at home in fear of being enslaved, how free is free?

** There are several cases in the books where a woman is raped, bound, stripped, or otherwise undergoes some sort of sex-related humiliation. [[RapePortrayedAsRedemption This invariably makes her more gentle, more feminine, and overall more pleasant to be around]]. To hammer the point home, she's often shown as being ''happier'' once she's been properly raped and put in her place.

*** Considering that the lives of free women of Gor is EVEN WORSE then that of slave girls, as they have to wear uncomfortable clothing at all times, never go anywhere without a armed escort, if they show any kind of evidennce of feeling desire they are told that they are "acting like slaves" and are subject to being enslaved at anytime should any man find them attractive, I would say that idea makes absolutely no sense. Of course, it could still be true.

* HoYayShipping: Some readers find men embracing men automatically homosexual, so they get a lot out of the books.

* MartyStu: Tarl is one of the most obvious ones ever.
* MarySueTopia: The trope could be named "Lands of Gor" instead.
* SnarkBait: One of the main reactions by most to the ideals behind the series, followed closely by horror and/or hatred, [[BerserkButton and considering the premise of the series...]]

** [[http://books.adultfanfiction.net/story.php?no=544176437 Gay, Bejeweled, Nazi Bikers of Gor]].

* FridgeHorror: Some points about the slave girls:
** We never see an old slave girl. They supposedly have anti-aging treatments that prolong human life for centuries if not indefinitely. So, their looks might not fade for a long time. Of course, they're instead stuck in a life where they're used as human sex toys for multiple human lifetimes with little chance for freedom and the ever present fear of death by capricious jerks and likely conditioned to enjoy that sort of life, which is probably even more horrifying.
** Curiosity and emotional control are stamped out of slaves, and they're also forcibly given birth control. So in essence, being a slavegirl is a form of physical and mental CreativeSterility.
*** Against all of this, there is the Gorean concept that when the right master and slave girl end up together, they will both be fully satisfied with the relationship - and have many centuries to enjoy it. This is the denouement of ''Captive of Gor'', ''Slave Girl of Gor'', and the other girl-protagonist stories, and a number of other master/slave relationships seem to be heading that way in other books too. Essentially, true can only be found by putting the right master with the right brainwashed sex-slave, [[SarcasmMode who's clearly in a position to decide what she finds "fulfilling."]]
** A meta example, but many people are disturbed to learn that John Norman's day job is as an ethics professor.

** [[CreatorInJoke This may be based on traditional portrayal of Black slaves vs. White upper class females in the Old South]], given how the book series started in politically-turbulent [[TheSixties 1960s]]. [[http://www.pbs.org/wnet/slavery/experience/gender/history2.html Traditional view was Black women were either sexually promiscuous]], [[http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/aia/part4/4p2956.html or sexually exploited by owners and overseers]], or both, [[http://www.studentpulse.com/articles/747/sexual-relations-between-elite-white-women-and-enslaved-men-in-the-antebellum-south-a-socio-historical-analysis while the White elite had to maintain proper standards in their personal life]], avenging their frustrations and jealousy on helpless slaves.
* FridgeHorror: Some points about the slavegirls:
** We never see an old slavegirl. They supposedly have anti-aging treatments that prolong human life for centuries if not indefinitely. So, their looks might not fade for a long time. Of course, they're instead stuck in a life where they're used as human sex toys for multiple human lifetimes with little chance for freedom and the ever present fear of death by capricious jerks and likely conditioned to enjoy that sort of life, which is probably even more horrifying.

*** Against all of this, there is the Gorean concept that when the right Master and slave-girl end up together, they will both be fully satisfied with the relationship - and have many centuries to enjoy it. This is the denouement of ''Captive of Gor'', ''Slave Girl of Gor'', and the other girl-protagonist stories, and a number of other Master/slave relationships seem to be heading that way in other books too. Essentially, true can only be found by putting the right Master with the right brainwashed sex-slave, [[SarcasmMode who's clearly in a position to decide what she finds "fulfilling."]]
** A meta example but many people are disturbed to learn that John Norman's day job is as an ethics professor.

** There are several cases in the books where a woman is raped, bound, stripped, or otherwise undergoes some sort of sex-related humiliation. This invariably makes her more gentle, more feminine, and overall more pleasant to be around. To hammer the point home, she's often shown as being ''happier'' once she's been properly raped and put in her place.

** [[CreatorInJoke This may be based on traditional portrayal of Black slaves vs. White upper class females in the Old South]], given how the book series started in politically-turbulent [[TheSixties 1960s]]. [[http://www.pbs.org/wnet/slavery/experience/gender/history2.html Traditional view was Black women were either sexually promiscuous]], [[http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/aia/part4/4p2956.html or sexually exploited by owners and overseers]], or both, while the White elite had to maintain proper standards in their personal life, avenging their frustrations and jealousy on helpless slaves.

** [[CreatorInJoke This may be based on traditional portrayal of Black slaves vs. White upper class females in the Old South]], given how the book series started in politically-turbulent [[TheSixties 1960s]]. Traditional view was Black women were either sexually promiscuous, [[http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/aia/part4/4p2956.html or sexually exploited by owners and overseers]], or both, while the White elite had to maintain proper standards in their personal life, avenging their frustrations and jealousy on helpless slaves.

* TakeThatScrappy: Even the film seems to have been aware of just how annoying Watney was, as evidenced by the ending where [[spoiler:the ring ends up sending Watney back to Earth alone without Cabot, who finally gets to be with Talena, while Watney ends up having to explain to some cops why he's jaywalking in the middle of Los Angeles dressed in a ridiculous outfit]].