History YMMV / GoldenSun

* OnceOriginalNowCommon: In the [=2000s=], these games stunned audiences for looking and playing more like something you would see on the UsefulNotes/SegaSaturn or the Sony Playstation rather than a ''handheld''. They're often seen as painfully generic [=JRPGs=] nowadays... which would be true, if it weren't for the fact that when they came out, there ''were'' very few (if at all) [=RPGs=] ''period'' on the UsefulNotes/GameBoyAdvance. There were very few original [=IPs=] on the Game Boy Advance ''period'' at the time - so people often associate it with the system. It still remains a CultClassic despite its flaws.

* SeinfeldIsUnfunny:
** The story was fun and the world was very interesting, but going back, a lot of people hit a brick wall where all the deep characterizations and personalities they remember will fail to appear. Put simply, characters are really more collections of traits and don't really show any consistent personality beyond a dislike of innocent people suffering, and if there is doubt look at all the character interpretations on this very page, that all stems from the actual story never really putting forth a set motivation on the characters for their actions throughout most of it.
** The game's world itself can fall into this trope. In the TurnOfTheMillennium, the fact that the game world was ''that big'' was actually quite impressive. Players who played ''The Lost Age'' were amazed at how, once the boat was obtained, the game world seemed to ''explode'' in size, with loads of places to explore in almost any order. On a ''handheld'' no less. Unfortunately, a modern audience will more likely see the game world and think it's full of empty space, very little hints telling them what they ''can'' do and the fact that there is no WarpWhistle until the ''very end of the game''.

* ShippingGoggles: As said before, Golden Sun had a huge shipping community back in the day to the point where, while everything was shipped anyway, the ones that receive the most attention are ships where two characters have literally ''any'' kind of direct interaction towards each other. Mudshipping [=(IsaacxMia)=] is a great example when considering that despite being one of the most popular ships, there isn't any sort of romantic dialogue or undertones between the two characters in either game.

* AccidentalAesop: While Sheba was mostly brought around as a hostage in the first game, Sheba has a secondary goal in ''The Lost Age'': To find out more about her MysteriousPast. This sadly never gets mentioned - while some cried TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot, others took this as another aesop of "You can't always find all the answers you seek". Or, [[TakeAThirdOption because Sheba does very little actual investigation]], "You won't find the answers you seek wandering around blindly.

** [[GodhoodSeeker Alex]] is the closest thing the series has to a BigBad, running the course of EnigmaticMinion to eventual mastermind in the span of three games. A Mercury Adept who betrayed his sister and his clan for the pursuit of personal power, Alex makes and breaks alliances with heroes and villains alike at his own convenience, always concealing his true intentions behind a stoic, cool-headed exterior. Alex rarely even personally dirties his hands, one of the few times he does resulting in him singlehandedly [[OneManArmy wiping out an entire battalion of elite soldiers]]. At the climax of ''The Lost Age'', Alex manipulates every party into a position where they have no choice but activate the Elemental Lighthouses and bestow Alex the godlike power of Alchemy. Even when Alex is OutGambitted and seemingly left for dead on the collapsing Mt. Aleph, Alex adopts the identity of Arcanus in ''[[VideoGame/GoldenSunDarkDawn Dark Dawn]]'' and resumes old habits, cheerfully manipulating entire nations to his advantage and activating the apocalyptic event known as the Grave Eclipse. At ''Dark Dawn'''s end, Alex appears to betray his allies once again to undo the apocalypse he himself wrought, and escapes to seemingly end the series as he started it: unharmed, unfazed, and a total mystery to everyone who knows him.

*** For the Sol Blade's Megiddo, it is possible to have a 99% Unleash Rate, meaning you would almost guarantee massive damage each turn without exhausting resources. The Sol Blade itself has a 35% unleash rate, but equipping the Valkyrie Mail (20%), Riot Gloves (20%), Mythril Helm (12%), Hyper Boots (12%). If a team member has the Kite Djinni, he/she can spam that to either Isaac or Felix and continuously do massive damage.

* AccidentalAesop: While Sheba was mostly brought around as a hostage in the first game, Sheba has a secondary goal in ''The Lost Age'': To find out more about her MysteriousPast. This sadly never gets mentioned - while some cried TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot, others took this as another aesop of "You can't always find all the answers you seek". Or, [[TakeAThirdOption because Sheba does very little actual investigation]], "You won't find the answers you seek wandering around blindly]].

* ThatOneSidequest: Defeating Dullahan in ''The Lost Age''. He is so cheap (even by {{Superboss}} standards) that almost all of his attacks fall under ThatOneAttack.

** The 4-Koma makes quite a few characters less than heroic: Isaac is a [[http://golden-sun-the-lost-comics.tumblr.com/post/111086906137/now-i-aint-sayin-he-a-gold-digger-but-he-aint greedy bastard]] willing to [[http://golden-sun-the-lost-comics.tumblr.com/post/111639495962/friends-dont-let-friends-sell-creatures-with sell a djinni]] for some quick gold and [[http://golden-sun-the-lost-comics.tumblr.com/post/112273394862/i-didnt-do-it-nobody-saw-me-cant-prove uses his Psynergy to get]] a panty shot from Mia, Layana's reason for not using the military to bring back Hammet involves [[http://golden-sun-the-lost-comics.tumblr.com/post/112275302277/the-only-thing-better-than-footnotes-is-cited adultery]]...

** There are a lot of powerful, useful classes in the game, unlocked through special items and through different combinations of elemental djinni. You could experiment with this ClassAndLevelSystem to find them... or you could just give everyone djinni that match their starting elements they're already good at, play to their existing strengths as characters and Adepts, and call it a day, which works just as well most of the time.

* FanWank: Due to the numerous hints about [[spoiler:Anemos and its legends]], many people presume that Sheba [[spoiler: came from Anemos and fell from there into Lalivero]]. The game [[TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot avoids]] actually resolving this, however. Even so, some people liked the resulting character development, slight as it was.

** Jupiter in general. As an element, Jupiter clearly has the advantage in the ElementalRockPaperScissors system, being strong against the vast majority of enemies in the game. The classes offered by the Jupiter djinni are cleanly better than the alternatives. The Apprentice and Page class line is a MagicKnight that borders on being MasterOfAll, with powerful physical and magical psynergy, the Impact series, coupled with high stats in every area, has the notable advantages of a massive PP pool and extremely high agility stats. The symbiotic class lines available to the Mercury and Jupiter adepts are extremely useful, being buffers and healers who also get access to some of the strongest Mercury and Jupiter offensive psynergy available, essentially combining the best aspects of the Wind and Water Seer class series. The only disadvantage to the Jupiter classes is that their focus towards higher quality of offensive psynergy creates a massive gap between their psynergy progression, which is more than made up for by the higher base power of the spells, allowing them to be a strong option for a good chunk of the early game. Even the Ninja class series, commonly agreed to be the best overall class in the game, requires Jupiter Djinn. The Jupiter classes are so potent that its not an exaggeration to say that the game's overall progression is dictated by the amount of Jupiter djinni available at any given time, and the sheer advantages of the Jupiter element are already apparent in the first game, before [[SequelEscalation becoming even more dominant]] in ''The Lost Age'' and ''Dark Dawn''.
** The summons, especially on bosses due to summons additionally cutting a percentage of max HP on top of their usual power. You can very easily breeze through 90% of the first game just abusing summons, ending battles in around 2 turns or less, with the exception of the final boss due to the SequentialBoss system. The downside is that your stats are reduced until the djinn cools down (which costs many turns in battles) and the game is easy enough without them. Averted in ''The Lost Age'' onwards [[SequelEscalation since all enemies and bosses have more hitpoints and attack more often]], such that every other mode of attack sans weapon unleashes, [=EPAs=], and summons (but see the drawbacks above) only deal ScratchDamage to them, while they can dish out the hurt in return.

*** For the Sol Blade's Megiddo, it is possible to have a 99% Unleash Rate, meaning you would almost guarantee massive damage each turn without exhausting resources. The Sol Blade itself has a 35% unleash rate, but equipping the Valkyrie Mail (20%), Riot Gloves (20%), Mythril Helm (12%), Hyper Boots (12%). If a team member has the Kite djinn, he/she can spam that to either Isaac or Felix and continuously do massive damage.

** The Petra+Ground lock strategy against individual enemies/bosses that can perform 1 action. Both djinn have priority and each one stops an enemy from moving. One user uses one of the djinns in Turn 1 and then sets djinn on Turn 2, and vice versa on the other user who has the other djinn. What this does is ensure that the enemy/boss cannot move at all while allowing the other 2 users to keep on attacking.

* HesJustHiding: Explicitly stated by the Wise One as a possibility regarding [[spoiler: Alex's fate]] in the ending credits. [[spoiler: Confirmed in ''VideoGame/GoldenSunDarkDawn''.]]

** While the battle system is heavily biased against mages Ivan and Sheba got it the worst since they are too frail and difficult to be used in the late game. Some players who have difficulty using them tend to permanently bench those two even though their element is strong against the majority of enemies and bosses. At least their class options boosts the stats they frequently use.
** For those who actually used Ivan and Sheba, Piers gets some flak due to his class options clashing horribly with his stats. He is supposed to be warrior-based, but being a Mercury Adept, most of his class options are mage-based causing his attack stat (which he mostly uses) to be rendered much lower than acceptable for a frontline tank if placed in most of the classes he has access to. The uneven djinn distribution (due to the unbalanced classes) can make him worse than he already is. While most Adepts can function perfectly fine just going with a monotyped Djinn build of their element, Piers ''really'' needs to branch out to compete with everyone else. His Mercury classes do give him Diamond Berg...but his PP is horrendous no matter what, and outside of Felix he has the most uses of psynergy in any given dungeon.

* MisaimedFandom: The second game reveals that [[spoiler: Saturos and Menardi were actually doing what was right for the world and their hometown]], which had prompted some fans to believe that Isaac and co beating the tar out of Saturos and Menardi in the first game to be a KickTheDog moment or make the crew look LawfulStupid. Except that, [[FourthWallMyopia when seen from]] ''their'' perspective, they had very good reason to assume Saturos&Menardi were evil and had ulterior motives. In the first game, Saturos and Menardi beat up two kids who had no way of fighting back, talked down to everyone who wasn't aligned with them, threatened people, killed/beat up people who got in their way, never ''once'' thought to explain ''why'' they were trying to light the beacons, kidnapped people, held them for ransom, held them for hostage, and attempted to kill Isaac & Co at least two times. Even taking their [[spoiler:true intentions]] into account, it's hard to ''really'' fault Isaac&Co (As well as the players!) for thinking them as evil. Even the Proxians are understanding of Isaac's situation when they're told he killed them. Of course, everyone was right with Alex.

** The first game is fairly straightforward despite having a vague goal of "Stop Saturos and Menardi". There's only a bit of freedom, but also little opportunity to get lost. The second game, however, sets you in the entire ''rest'' of the world - with even ''more'' vague goals and the only thing indicating that you should be exploring around being obstacles you cannot bypass without having specific psynergy at hand. It's highly likely for you to [[SequenceBreaking sequence break]] without even knowing it, the only indication that you probably shouldn't go that way being trash mobs and bosses who're [[BeefGate disproportionately powerful]] compared to how you are.
** There is a part in the second game in which you aren't told what you have to do other than "Go to Lemuria", and a "Get to the other side of the world" but it's blocked by an obstacle. While it is a little more non-linear and some people actually really like that; the game doesn't really keep track of the stuff you had done so the only way to figure out whether or not you completed certain dungeons was to go explore them and find that that was the trident piece you had in your inventory. The other half of the world is thankfully a lot less... vague about where to go since there isn't as much content. Not only that, but once you get the ship, there's very little telling you that you have to do certain things. For example, there's very little reason to go to Tundaria Tower to get that Trident Piece.

** The story was fun and the world was very interesting, but going back a lot of people hit a brick wall where, basically put, all these deep characterizations and personalities people remember will fail to appear. Put simply, characters are really more collections of traits and don't really show any consistent personality beyond a dislike of innocent people suffering, and if there is doubt look at all the character interpretations on this very page, that all stems from the actual story never really putting forth a set motivation on the characters for their actions throughout most of it. See "MisaimedFandom" for a good example of this in action.
** The game's world itself can fall into this trope. In the TurnOfTheMillennium, the fact that the game world was ''that big'' was actually quite impressive. Players who played ''The Lost Age'' were amazed at how, once the boat was obtained, the game world seemed to ''explode'' in size, with loads of places to explore in almost any order. On a ''handheld'' no less. Unfortunately, a modern audience will more likely see the game world and think it's full of empty space, very little hints telling them what they ''can'' do (See QuicksandBox) and the fact that there is no WarpWhistle until the ''very end of the game''.

** [[BadassNormal Briggs]] from the second game also counts as an [[EarlyGameHell early game example]], as, due to Osenia's layout, he can be fought before encountering a number of dungeons and collecting their Djinni, summons, and items. What makes him more difficult than Saturos is that you only have three party members by the time you reach him while Mia already joins Isaac's group before Saturos' boss fight. Briggs can also summon his crew [[WeHaveReserves over and over again]] to assist him, as opposed to Saturos who fights alone. Needless to say, he's going to mop the floor with you.

* ThatOneLevel: [[PunnyName Air's Rock]]. The only saving grace this level has is a very low random encounter rate. To elaborate: The exterior mountain climb of Air's Rock is about as long as any given dungeon up to that point in the second game. Then, the interior exploration of Air's Rock is, in itself, [[MarathonLevel noticeably longer than any other dungeon in either game]], barring the Lighthouses and the other elemental rocks. It also relies extensively on a (relatively expensive, compared to other utility spells) Psynergy that requires [[FragileSpeedster one of the characters]] to be in her default class, which means repeatedly shutting down and turning on her Djinn for any player who places her in a more balanced class. This dungeon is early enough in the game that the player only has the first three characters, although it is possible to wait until you have the fourth party member to attempt it. If you want that fourth party member, however, you'll instead have to fight the WakeUpCallBoss massively underleveled, since he was intended to be fought after Air's Rock. That being said, one really needs to respect Master Maha after that one. How the hell did he ever finish that thing alone?

* TierInducedScrappy:
** While the battle system is heavily biased against mages Ivan and Sheba got it the worst since they are [[SquishyWizard too]] [[FragileSpeedster frail]] and difficult to be used in the late game. Some players who have difficulty using them tend to permanently bench those two even though their element is strong against the majority of enemies and bosses. At least their class options boosts the stats they frequently use.
** For those who actually used those two, Piers gets some of this due to his class options clashing horribly with his stats. He is supposed to be warrior-based, but being a Mercury Adept, most of his class options are mage-based causing his attack stat (which he mostly uses) to be rendered much lower than acceptable for a frontline tank if placed in most of the classes he has access to. The uneven djinn distribution (due to the unbalanced classes) can make him worse than he already is. While most Adepts can function perfectly fine just going with a monotyped Djinn build of their element, Piers ''really'' needs to branch out to compete with everyone else. His Mercury classes do give him Diamond Berg...but his PP is horrendous no matter what, and outside of Felix he has the most uses of psynergy in any given dungeon.
** On the other end of the spectrum are Jenna and Mia. Simply put, Jenna is a MasterOfAll who hits hard, has some actually damaging spells that tear apart random encounters in an instant, and in actual boss battles, rips foes apart with her speed and strength. Tellingly, given how many levels you get in the Lost Age that you don't get in the first game, by the time you get Isaac's party, Jenna is simply a much better alternative to Isaac. It helps that, due to her speed, she can also be an impromptu healer. She even gets defense debuffs for foes. As for Mia, she happens to be fairly tankish, and her healing spells are just too good not to use. While Jenna can serve as a faster healer if the party ''really'' needs healing at the start of a turn, Mia's Wish psynergy make it unlikely this will ever be the case. Essentially, if these two are in the same team, it's ''incredibly hard'' to die.

** Maces and axes are almost always hated since most of them are early-game weapons which quickly get outclassed by everything else. Even the high-tier ones are hard to find and their unleashes are not as strong as the end-game long sword and light blade ones. One notable exception is the Wicked Mace in the first game due to being easier to find and lethal against the [[EliteMook Tornado Lizard monster line]] and [[BonusBoss Deadbeard]].

* ThatOneSidequest: Defeating Dullahan in ''The Lost Age''. He is so cheap (even by BonusBoss standards) that almost all of his attacks fall under ThatOneAttack (see above).
* TierInducedScrappy:

* SpecialEffectsFailure: While the graphics are excellent for a [=GBA=] game, some of the pre-rendered sprites look obviously resized back and forth and as a result looks really overpixeled such as the Serpent, both final bosses and the Mad Demons.

** Maces and axes are almost always hated since most of them are early-game weapons which quickly gets outclassed by everything else. Even the high-tier ones are hard to find and their unleashes are not as strong as the end-game long sword and light blade ones. One notable exception is the Wicked Mace in the first game due to being easier to find and lethal against the [[EliteMook Tornado Lizard monster line]] and [[BonusBoss Deadbeard]].

* InferredHolocaust: The lack of presence of a Venus Clan is often speculated as they are overlooked by the characters in all three games. That being said, given that Felix, Jenna's brother (who is a Mars adept), and Isaac are Venus adepts, then the Venus Clan seems to be split between Vale and interbred with the Mars Clan. It is also mentioned that Venus/Mars are related and Mercury/Jupiter are related. Mercury and Jupiter are also similarly divided with Mercury being split between Imil and Lemuria and Jupiter being split between Contigo and possible '''''the moon'''''. If anything, the Mars Clan is the exception, not the rule.

** The summons. Oh so much, especially on bosses due to summons additionally cutting a percentage of max HP on top of their usual power. You can very easily breeze through 90% of the first game just abusing summons, ending battles in around 2 turns or less, with the exception of the final boss due to the SequentialBoss system. The downside is that your stats are reduced until the djinn cools down (which costs many turns in battles) and the game is easy enough without them. Averted in ''The Lost Age'' onwards [[SequelEscalation since all enemies and bosses have more hitpoints and attack more often]], such that every other mode of attack sans weapon unleashes, [=EPAs=], and summons (but see the drawbacks above) only deal ScratchDamage to them, while they can dish out the hurt in return.

** For those who actually used those two, Piers gets some of this due to his class options clashing horribly with his stats. He is supposed to be warrior-based, but being a Mercury Adept, most of his class options are mage-based causing his attack stat (which he mostly uses) to be rendered much lower than acceptable for a frontline tank if placed in most of the classes he has access to. The uneven djinn distribution (due to the FakeBalance of the classes) can make him worse than he already is. While most Adepts can function perfectly fine just going with a monotyped Djinn build of their element, Piers ''really'' needs to branch out to compete with everyone else. His Mercury classes do give him Diamond Berg...but his PP is horrendous no matter what, and outside of Felix he has the most uses of psynergy in any given dungeon.

* PlayerPunch: [[spoiler:The revelation that the final boss of ''Lost Age'', the Doom Dragon, is a BalefulPolymorph consisting of the heroes' parents comes only ''after'' you slay the beast. It's mitigated in that the parents do come back, but the impact of the reveal itself is one of the most devastating ever featured in a GBA game.]]

** As far as optional bosses go, the Star Magician is considered to be one of the best battles - primarily because it is a PuzzleBoss. It summons various orbs that use different effects that vary between healing, buffing, and attacking. This results in players being forced to make an odd decision in which orb(s) to keep alive since the Star Magician will always summon more.

* BestBossEver: The two non-adept battles in ''The Lost Age''. Briggs because he can turn out to be ThatOneBoss (see below) depending on which order and even then, could be ThatOneBoss. Moapa and his knights are much more straightforward, but they follow this game's version of the "Colisseum" and this time you do a team battle.

* IdiotPlot:
** The ''entire plot'' of ''The Broken Seal'' '''retroactively''' becomes this once you learn of Saturos and Menardi's [[spoiler: true goals.]] Yes, they're out to [[spoiler: save the world]], but the way they choose to go about it is just ''incredibly'' stupid and extreme. They attempt to accomplish their mission in the most ruthless, violent and underhanded manner possible, they beat up and/or kill every innocent bystander who gets in their way, they repeatedly go out of their way to KickTheDog, and hurt people who aren't even connected to their mission, they kidnap Jenna, Kraden, and Sheba instead of just asking for their help, they keep trying to ''kill'' Isaac and his team instead of trying to reason with them or talk things over, and they never bother trying to explain to ''anybody'' why they're trying to restore Alchemy in the first place. Practically almost the entire game might not have happened if they'd been more open about their motives and not resorted to drastic behavior and pointless cruelty. It's no wonder Isaac's party thinks they're the bad guys the whole time they're chasing them.
** Piers being held captive in ''The Lost Age''. Lampshaded by a NPC in Osenia Cliffs.
---> '''NPC:''' [[LampshadeHanging Wait, if this is the Champa ship, then that must mean Piers isn't a Champa! So...why does the elder still need Briggs to clear his name?]]

* MisaimedFandom: The second game reveals that [[spoiler: Saturos and Menardi were actually doing what was right for the world and their hometown]], which had prompted some fans to believe that Isaac and co beating the tar out of Saturos and Menardi in the first game to be a KickTheDog moment or make the crew look LawfulStupid. Except that, when seen from ''their'' perspective, they had very good reason to assume they were evil and had ulterior motives. In the first game, Saturos and Menardi beat up two kids who had no way of fighting back, talked down to everyone who wasn't aligned with them, threatened people, killed/beat up people who got in their way, never ''once'' thought to explain ''why'' they were trying to light the beacons, kidnapped people, held them for ransom, held them for hostage, and attempted to kill Isaac & Co at least two times. Even taking their [[spoiler:true intentions]] into account, it's hard to ''really'' fault Isaac&Co (As well as the players!) for thinking them as evil. Even the Proxians are understanding of Isaac's situation when they're told he killed them. Of course, everyone was right with Alex.

** The game's world itself can fall into this trope. In the TurnOfTheMillennium, the fact that the game world was ''that big'' was actually quite impressive. Players who played ''The Lost Age'' were amazd at how, once the boat was obtained, the game world seemed to ''explode'' in size, with loads of places to explore in almost any order. Unfortunately, a modern audience will more likely see the game world and think it's full of empty space, very little hints telling them what they ''can'' do (See QuicksandBox) and the fact that there is no WarpWhistle until the ''very end of the game''.

* SeinfeldIsUnfunny: The story was fun and the world was very interesting, but going back a lot of people hit a brick wall where, basically put, all these deep characterizations and personalities people remember will fail to appear. Put simply, characters are really more collections of traits and don't really show any consistent personality beyond a dislike of innocent people suffering, and if there is doubt look at all the character interpretations on this very page, that all stems from the actual story never really putting forth a set motivation on the characters for their actions throughout most of it. See "MisaimedFandom" for a good example of this in action.