[002]
DaibhidC
Current Version
Changed line(s) 2 from:
n
* {{Golem}}s in \'\'Literature/{{Discworld}}\'\', which are based on Jewish folktales. Some golems have stereotypically Hebrew-sounding names, and they all occasionally celebrate \
to:
* {{Golem}}s in \\\'\\\'Literature/{{Discworld}}\\\'\\\', which are based on Jewish folktales. Some golems have stereotypically Hebrew-sounding names, and they all occasionally celebrate \\\"holy days\\\" where they do no work. Their \\\"parent religion\\\", the last human beings with the ability to make Golems, are variably described as \\\"Cenotian\\\" or \\\"Cenobites\\\" and are described in a way suggesting Jewishness. Also, the nation of Istanzia, in the \\\'\\\'Compleat Discworld Atlas\\\'\\\', is written in a way that suggests something \\\'\\\'UsefulNotes/{{Israel}}-like is going on. The only Istanzian to appear in the canon so far, Sergeant Simony of the Omnian Army, is described in terms making him sound like a Haggunah sabra fighter seeking independence for his country.
*** [[OurDwarvesAreAllTheSame Dwarf culture]] is also very heavily inspired by Judaism with a few bits of Celtic and Scandanavian folklore mixed in: It started out as a low-key AffectionateParody of Tolkien\\\'s dwarves all speaking a ConLang based on Hebrew but then expanded into a lot of detailed worldbuilding, and a cultural schism that\\\'s explicitly based on the Orthodox/Reform Judaism divide drives a story arc that spans \\\'\\\'Literature/TheFifthElephant\\\'\\\' and \\\'\\\'Literature/{{Thud}}\\\'\\\'.
Firstly, everyone on the Disc is definitely \\\'\\\'not\\\'\\\' Jewish, any more than they\\\'re Christian, Hindu, or Pastafarian. Roundworld religions do not exist on Discworld. \\\"Judaism-like fictional religions\\\" aren\\\'t really this trope.
I\\\'m not sure what the claims about the Cenobites and Istanzia are based on. All we know about the Cenobites other than that they made golems (or at least that one golem uses their holy book as a chem) is that Constable Visit says \\\"Ceno was a rather liberal god, sir. Not big on commandments,\\\" which doesn\\\'t sound \\\'\\\'very\\\'\\\' much like the God of Genesis and Exodus.
The description of Istanzia in the \\\'\\\'Atlas\\\'\\\' is that it used to be its own nation before being conquered by a larger country, has regained its independence under a military junta, and is still agressively defending its border. There are \\\'\\\'some\\\'\\\' elements of this that \\\'\\\'could\\\'\\\' be Israel, or pretty much any other country in the Middle East. The bit about Sergeant Simony is particularly odd, given that he\\\'s explicitly described as a NayTheist.
The dwarfs come under \\\"If a character is non-human and displays stereotypical Jewish behavior, it\\\'s SpaceJews.\\\" And the claim that they\\\'re \\\'\\\'deliberately\\\'\\\' inspired by Judaism goes against Sir Terry\\\'s own words, which are that he was surprised when Jewish friends pointed the similarity out to him, with an undertone of being relieved they weren\\\'t offended by this. The Deep-Downers in \\\'\\\'Thud!\\\'\\\' are more like Islamic State than Orthodox Judaism.
*** [[OurDwarvesAreAllTheSame Dwarf culture]] is also very heavily inspired by Judaism with a few bits of Celtic and Scandanavian folklore mixed in: It started out as a low-key AffectionateParody of Tolkien\\\'s dwarves all speaking a ConLang based on Hebrew but then expanded into a lot of detailed worldbuilding, and a cultural schism that\\\'s explicitly based on the Orthodox/Reform Judaism divide drives a story arc that spans \\\'\\\'Literature/TheFifthElephant\\\'\\\' and \\\'\\\'Literature/{{Thud}}\\\'\\\'.
Firstly, everyone on the Disc is definitely \\\'\\\'not\\\'\\\' Jewish, any more than they\\\'re Christian, Hindu, or Pastafarian. Roundworld religions do not exist on Discworld. \\\"Judaism-like fictional religions\\\" aren\\\'t really this trope.
I\\\'m not sure what the claims about the Cenobites and Istanzia are based on. All we know about the Cenobites other than that they made golems (or at least that one golem uses their holy book as a chem) is that Constable Visit says \\\"Ceno was a rather liberal god, sir. Not big on commandments,\\\" which doesn\\\'t sound \\\'\\\'very\\\'\\\' much like the God of Genesis and Exodus.
The description of Istanzia in the \\\'\\\'Atlas\\\'\\\' is that it used to be its own nation before being conquered by a larger country, has regained its independence under a military junta, and is still agressively defending its border. There are \\\'\\\'some\\\'\\\' elements of this that \\\'\\\'could\\\'\\\' be Israel, or pretty much any other country in the Middle East. The bit about Sergeant Simony is particularly odd, given that he\\\'s explicitly described as a NayTheist.
The dwarfs come under \\\"If a character is non-human and displays stereotypical Jewish behavior, it\\\'s SpaceJews.\\\" And the claim that they\\\'re \\\'\\\'deliberately\\\'\\\' inspired by Judaism goes against Sir Terry\\\'s own words, which are that he was surprised when Jewish friends pointed the similarity out to him, with an undertone of being relieved they weren\\\'t offended by this. The Deep-Downers in \\\'\\\'Thud!\\\'\\\' are more like Islamic State than Orthodox Judaism.
Changed line(s) 2 from:
n
* {{Golem}}s in \'\'Literature/{{Discworld}}\'\', which are based on Jewish folktales. Some golems have stereotypically Hebrew-sounding names, and they all occasionally celebrate \
to:
* {{Golem}}s in \\\'\\\'Literature/{{Discworld}}\\\'\\\', which are based on Jewish folktales. Some golems have stereotypically Hebrew-sounding names, and they all occasionally celebrate \\\"holy days\\\" where they do no work. Their \\\"parent religion\\\", the last human beings with the ability to make Golems, are variably described as \\\"Cenotian\\\" or \\\"Cenobites\\\" and are described in a way suggesting Jewishness. Also, the nation of Istanzia, in the \\\'\\\'Compleat Discworld Atlas\\\'\\\', is written in a way that suggests something \\\'\\\'UsefulNotes/{{Israel}}-like is going on. The only Istanzian to appear in the canon so far, Sergeant Simony of the Omnian Army, is described in terms making him sound like a Haggunah sabra fighter seeking independence for his country.
*** [[OurDwarvesAreAllTheSame Dwarf culture]] is also very heavily inspired by Judaism with a few bits of Celtic and Scandanavian folklore mixed in: It started out as a low-key AffectionateParody of Tolkien\\\'s dwarves all speaking a ConLang based on Hebrew but then expanded into a lot of detailed worldbuilding, and a cultural schism that\\\'s explicitly based on the Orthodox/Reform Judaism divide drives a story arc that spans \\\'\\\'Literature/TheFifthElephant\\\'\\\' and \\\'\\\'Literature/{{Thud}}\\\'\\\'.
Firstly, everyone on the Disc is definitely \\\'\\\'not\\\'\\\' Jewish, any more than they\\\'re Christian, Hindu, or Pastafarian. Roundworld religions do not exist on Discworld. \\\"Judaism-like fictional religions\\\" aren\\\'t really this trope.
I\\\'m not sure what the claims about the Cenobites and Istanzia are based on. All we know about the Cenobites other than that they made golems (or at least that one golem uses their holy book as a chem) is that Constable Visit says \\\"Ceno was a rather liberal god, sir. Not big on commandments,\\\" which doesn\\\'t sound \\\'\\\'very\\\'\\\' much like the God of Genesis and Exodus.
The description of Istanzia in the \\\'\\\'Atlas\\\'\\\' is that it used to be its own nation before being conquered by a larger country, has regained its independence under a military junta, and is still agressively defending its border. There are \\\'\\\'some\\\'\\\' elements of this that \\\'\\\'could\\\'\\\' be Israel, or pretty much any other country in the Middle East. The bit about Sergeant Simony is particularly odd, given that he\\\'s explicitly described as a NayTheist.
The dwarfs come under \\\"If a character is non-human and displays stereotypical Jewish behavior, it\\\'s SpaceJews.\\\" And the claim that it\\\'s \\\'\\\'deliberately\\\'\\\' inspired by Judaism goes against Sir Terry\\\'s own words, which are that he was surprised when Jewish friends pointed the similarity out to him, with an undertone of being relieved they weren\\\'t offended by this. The Deep-Downers in \\\'\\\'Thud!\\\'\\\' are more like Islamic State than Orthodox Judaism.
*** [[OurDwarvesAreAllTheSame Dwarf culture]] is also very heavily inspired by Judaism with a few bits of Celtic and Scandanavian folklore mixed in: It started out as a low-key AffectionateParody of Tolkien\\\'s dwarves all speaking a ConLang based on Hebrew but then expanded into a lot of detailed worldbuilding, and a cultural schism that\\\'s explicitly based on the Orthodox/Reform Judaism divide drives a story arc that spans \\\'\\\'Literature/TheFifthElephant\\\'\\\' and \\\'\\\'Literature/{{Thud}}\\\'\\\'.
Firstly, everyone on the Disc is definitely \\\'\\\'not\\\'\\\' Jewish, any more than they\\\'re Christian, Hindu, or Pastafarian. Roundworld religions do not exist on Discworld. \\\"Judaism-like fictional religions\\\" aren\\\'t really this trope.
I\\\'m not sure what the claims about the Cenobites and Istanzia are based on. All we know about the Cenobites other than that they made golems (or at least that one golem uses their holy book as a chem) is that Constable Visit says \\\"Ceno was a rather liberal god, sir. Not big on commandments,\\\" which doesn\\\'t sound \\\'\\\'very\\\'\\\' much like the God of Genesis and Exodus.
The description of Istanzia in the \\\'\\\'Atlas\\\'\\\' is that it used to be its own nation before being conquered by a larger country, has regained its independence under a military junta, and is still agressively defending its border. There are \\\'\\\'some\\\'\\\' elements of this that \\\'\\\'could\\\'\\\' be Israel, or pretty much any other country in the Middle East. The bit about Sergeant Simony is particularly odd, given that he\\\'s explicitly described as a NayTheist.
The dwarfs come under \\\"If a character is non-human and displays stereotypical Jewish behavior, it\\\'s SpaceJews.\\\" And the claim that it\\\'s \\\'\\\'deliberately\\\'\\\' inspired by Judaism goes against Sir Terry\\\'s own words, which are that he was surprised when Jewish friends pointed the similarity out to him, with an undertone of being relieved they weren\\\'t offended by this. The Deep-Downers in \\\'\\\'Thud!\\\'\\\' are more like Islamic State than Orthodox Judaism.
