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RangerJackWalker
topic
01:21:59 PM Dec 10th 2013
Fire Emblem

It should be noted that the fandom no longer thinks of Jagen and his ilk as bad characters. In fact, they're often cited as some of the best units in the game.

Also, the term Oifeys/Oifayes is discouraged because the distinction doesn't really exist anymore. In fact, Jagen in the original Fire Emblem is a better character than Oifey ever was and it was only misconceptions within the community that led them to make that distinction.

I'll let someone more versed in TV Tropes do the editing instead.
efsfsefsdf
topic
02:03:29 PM Jul 13th 2011
Can someone please fix the folder system for this page, I'm not an expert, so I don't know how to do that.
Pjwned
topic
03:30:13 PM May 13th 2011
How do EITHER of the examples for Guild Wars make any sense for this trope? I'm not going to just remove it immediately but I don't see how Rurik or heroes fit in this category at all.
Boksha
topic
11:14:10 AM Feb 21st 2011
Removing the Survivalist thing about Etrian Odyssey. There's just too many factual errors in it and Survivalists don't seem to fit the trope at all: they're great throughout the game in EO 1 due to having both the #1 and #2 most destructive attack skills in the entire game, and pretty bad throughout the game in EO 2 because of a lack of, well, everything except their signature move, which lets another character act first in a turn. In neither game are they really good at the beginning and really bad later.

For the errors: "boasting skills that can fool around with an enemy's status" -> They get one skill that lowers enemy accuracy (equally useful throughout the game) and a (terrible) leg bind skill, which isn't more than any other attack class. "or manipulate a F.O.E.'s movement pattern" -> These skills don't exist in EO 1. "and Item Synthesis becomes less a form of making money and more of a form of just getting some spare items for new weapons at the shop" -> ...Item Synthesis? Farming is the only sane way to get enough money for the END-GAME weapons and equipment. (of course, in practice you won't be using a character in your main team for farming, so this is kind of a moot point) "This is made even worse in Etrian Odyssey II [...] and Hexers, who are even better at inflicting status ailments." -> Hexers are available in EO 1. Dark Hunters, which are even available from the start, are always better at inflicting status ailments as well.
Camacan
moderator
topic
07:04:36 PM Apr 4th 2010
Discussion prior rename.

Kimiko Muffin: So where exactly did this trope get its name? It's not mentioned in the introduction, which treats it as if it was Exactly What It Says On The Tin ...

Tanto: It's from the first Fire Emblem, as explained in the first example.

Gloating Swine: Cut

  • Drachma in Skies Of Arcadia is overleveled when he first joins the party, and is capable of defeating most minor foes in a single hit. He leaves, however, for the latter part of the Escape From Valua arc and the entire Temple of Pyrynn, allowing the other characters to catch up. He's an unremarkable character once his level advantage is gone.

Drachma is still a competent match damage-wise for Vyse at equivalent levels right to the end of the game and has high HP and Defence, and only Enrique's Justice Shield keeps him out of the endgame lineup. He's certainly a better choice than Gilder, no matter how cool the latter may look.

  • Although not quite as early in the game as most examples, Talos from Dragon Quest VIII may qualify. He starts out with absurdly high stats and 800 HP, plus he's an extremely reliable attacker, but unlike most recruitable monsters his stats don't improve as you gain levels.

(NOTE: I'm reasonably sure this is a good example since Talos starts really strong and doesn't improve at all, aside from how you aren't able to recruit him until a little while into the game.)

Can this trope just be renamed to Jeigan? Or at least The Jeigan?

Jeigan Character is a tad redundant.

Ogre Prodigy: I'd suggest removing Thursday, because in my experience, he's actually Magikarp Power - Thursday has the highest potential attack of any character in the game (Including the Game Breaker Divine Majins and the Bonus Boss Priere), but due to a low starting level, low move and counterattacks, and the aforesaid Monster type, he's practically useless when you get him compared to Laharl, Ninjas, or Samurai.

Also, you don't get him until more than halfway through the game.

Camacan
moderator
08:43:17 PM Apr 4th 2010
edited by Camacan
Removed this section. Either examples are Crutch Characters or they aren't. If they aren't they don't belong in the article. Additionally, this reads like a new trope description in-line with the article. A new trope needs a new article. In any case it's all a matter of degree: if a chracter is a "Crutch Character but not as clearly an example as usual" that's not a very good trope definition: The Same But Less. Finally it's fine to describe fan terminology but the place to do it would be the Fire Emblem article.

  • Crutch Characters who don't completely suck after the first few chapters of the game (this consists of the Crutches from Sacred Stones onward) are called "Oifayes" in the fandom, after the less-sucky-than-average Crutch from Fire Emblem: Geneaology of the Holy War. Seth, Titania, and Sothe would fall in this catagory.
    • Subverted for Titania as Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn has Titania return in the Crutch Character role but instead of sucking, she turns out to be the MOST VIABLE CHOICE for your mounted paladin due to her having absolutely godlike growths putting her among the top tier characters to use in the final battle.
    • Titania barely qualifies as either a Crutch Character or an Oifayes. Even in Path of Radience she still has very good stats and she's quite good even in the end game. She's not the best paladin (That would be generally be considered to be Oscar), but given how well Paladins perform in the game in general, she's still very good.
    • Other characters who are pre-promoted are often considered Crutch Characters, but there are also some who are Oifayes who are actually viable both ways. Some of the "Stop Having Fun" Guys will criticize you for using a prepromoted character at all, even though some characters such as Pent and Hawkeye from 7 are given a pass. (Wolf from the DS remake is often encouraged to be used)
      • That would be because Wolf has the best stat gains in the game (tied with the other pre-promote who comes with him). Incidentally, Hawkeye is fairly low on the tier list whilst Pent is possibly the best mage.
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