During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
The show never struck me as having a CM in it, but sure. Feel free to do an effortpost on the 7th if you want.
Also today's the 25th, so it's been more than two weeks since Uncharted 4 came out. Didn't someone mention before there was a villain who might be up for discussion?
I write stories and shiz. You can read them here.
There isn't.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Lord of Hell
Was catching up on what I've missed on this thread and found out that Captain America's a member of Hydra now. Joy. Next thing you know, Xavier's going to be a complete bigot towards non mutated humans.
Anyway, if I counted correctly, it looks like the tally for Momoshiki is over 20 ![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
's 1 ![[tdown]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_down_emoticon_3571.png "[thumb down]"){kind=small}
. Anyone wanna do the write-up?
edited 25th May '16 10:39:33 AM by Awesomekid42
I'll get to it sooner or later
Re: Cap
99.99% sure this is a Cosmic Cube thing from when Kobik de-aged him. It'll get un-done again soon enough.
Re: Zoom
Really, really skeptical he's gonna count, but I guess we can have that argument in two weeks.
edited 25th May '16 10:55:25 AM by Monessi
RIP Toriyama
Bah gawd that Captain America junk sounds stupid. I keep up with very few comics these days (Prefer the classics), but this is still a really dumb way to try to get readers. It's like revealing that Superman has been the lovechild of Brainiac and Darkseid all this time. Or that Batman is actually the Joker in disguise and has been play-fighting with 3 different Jokers over the decades to give himself amusement. Where is the sense???
I think statement regarding Kobik and such is the most likely explanation, but still, weird.
(Ahem) Moving on, Uncharted 4 probably doesn't have any candidates. The Big Bad is nowhere near heinous enough, along with (Depending on the person) able to draw some sympathy. Henry Avery (Greater-Scope Villain) was a huge prick, massacring dozens of people through increasingly vile ways, however he can't really count because he's never shown alive in the game. All of his crimes were committed centuries ago, and the only reason we know about them is because Nathan Drake (MC) finds dozens of corpses littered across Avery's island during his adventures.
Avery himself gets no character beyond "Man, this guy was a psychopath", which while not necessarily disqualifying in and of itself, the fact that he gets no scenes where he is alive, meaning no dialogue or even facial expressions (Ala that one kid from Battle Royale), leaves us with zero idea of his true personality.
edited 25th May '16 10:58:23 AM by Ravok
Tonight I dine on monkey soup.
I swear, I feel the last couple dozen pages of this thread have just been us bickering about anything we can bicker about and complaining about things that piss us off (which seems to be quite a bit, if all this comic talk has been any indication).
On another note, someone just wiped out half the quote page - including quotes approved here first - without bringing anything here. I've dropped them a PM, but there's no telling whether or not they'll act on it and it'll be a pain to bring everything that was deleted back up (and/or review them if any of us agree with the user's deletion summary).
edited 25th May '16 11:17:42 AM by Scraggle
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Goddammit, are we gonna have to lock the quote page? Anyway, I just requested the mods revert it back. As for the reasoning: "Reason: This page is unbearably bloated with quotes that are not demonstrative of the article, senseless outside of context, or just plain boring/generic "I'm evil!"/"you're evil!" declarations. I've trimmed it down a huge amount and it's still too big." Well **** you, who made you the quote god?
edited 25th May '16 11:24:20 AM by ACW
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
RIP Toriyama
CRAP! Whoever just deleted those quotes is testing us. Don't you see? He/she/it noticed how little we've been doing recently in regards to candidates (Very few have come up, in our defense), and as such, decided to give us a workload! Nuts. He/she/it must be some kind of disgruntled former troper who is seeking revenge on us for rejecting one of his/her/it's candidates! Oh the inhumanity! /s
Seriously though, what the crap was he/she/it thinking? Even IF the page needed trimming (Which I personally don't think it did), he/she/it should have consulted someone first before performing a freaking purge. Ugh.
edited 25th May '16 11:24:34 AM by Ravok
Tonight I dine on monkey soup.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
And that was the person's first edit in over a year 
. Maybe once it's reverted back, we should look over the quotes (I've been guilty of adding several w/o bringing them here first), see if any need to be cut, and lock the page.
Ah, I was starting to think the quotes could just go up as long as they were from a previously approved character, but fortunately I never got around to editing the page. Hopefully as the last time I'll need to bring up Sol Seraph, any thoughts on the ones I provided below her writeup?
edited 25th May '16 11:39:43 AM by YamiVizziniX
There is no beginning. There is no end. There is only... Hooty.
Honestly, that quote page is miserable. It really is just bloated with quotes that essentially say the same thing over and over again, like the only purpose of including all of them was to qualify an arbitrary someone's favorite CM candidate by putting them on it.
Lord of Hell
Not going to lie. The fact that we might need to lock one of my favorite pages to read and edit on the website all because of one user really pisses me off.
So if we do lock the Complete Monster page, are we going to have to bring up potential quotes here as well?
edited 25th May '16 11:43:50 AM by Awesomekid42
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Yeah. I know 
AR, it DOES say they have to be approved first. That's the ONLY case where I'd support unilateral deletion, but that's IT.
Looks like they've restored it, but we DO need to decide what to do going forward.
edited 25th May '16 11:52:46 AM by ACW
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Lord of Hell
>Scraggle says how the last couple of pages have been posts from tropers complaining about things that piss them off
>Later in the same post, brings up something that causes me to get pissed off and complain
Looking back on it, that's pretty funny.
edited 25th May '16 11:59:05 AM by Awesomekid42
I thought the quotes page was already locked. Either way, I think it should be.
Quotes page should be locked. Should probably also be trimmed down but not unilaterally.
RE: Comics
Once again, everybody breathe. Remember, it could always be worse. It could the be 90s.
Lord of Hell
So should we propose quotes on this thread for approval from now on then?
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
What's wrong with the 90s? They brought us Sabbat and the origin of Deadpool.
I requested a lock, at least for now.
And speaking of quotes...
edited 25th May '16 12:23:03 PM by ACW
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Foreign Troper
Deadpool back then was nothing like the modern one though. Back in the 90's, everything was overly gritty and had generally horrible artwork.
edited 25th May '16 12:30:16 PM by Forenperser
Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
The 90's may not have been a great time for comics (X-Men notwithstanding) but it was a great decade for TV and movies. Also, I, my brother, and nearly all of my friends were born in the 90s, so I have a soft spot for the era.
@MiraiYuji I appreciate your enthusiasm, and I agree that Zoom's the worst Flash villain yet (he's even worse than Thawne, in my opinion), but Forenperser is right; I'm handling the write-up, which is going up on June 7 (Savage's is next Thursday, for the curious).
Come to think of it, comparing Zoom and Thawne makes me wonder: what kind of monster is worse, the self-righteous ones who commits atrocities for a purpose, no matter how evil, or the ones who just lunatics who do a ton of evil crap for no good reason (okay, no CM does things for a "good" reason, but that's just semantics)?
edited 25th May '16 1:19:16 PM by DeCarta
It is better to write for yourself and have no public than to write for the public and have no self.
So, er, I have a potential CM that could be brought up on Thursday, per the two week rule.
Without being too specific, have we spoken on Steven Universe yet?
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
So, like, the Lawful Evil of Palpatine (or the Nazis in Real Life) vs. the Chaotic Evil of Joker? Both equally bad, in different ways (though the latter are more unpredictable). I don't think so, at least not in detail. Make sure the character's arc is over though.
edited 25th May '16 1:19:54 PM by ACW
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
So The Night Manager aired its final episode in North America last night, and I was keeping watch for any Monsters but I don't think anyone made it after watching the last episode. If anyone disagrees I guess we'll discuss it in two weeks?
Oissu!