Type-Moon: Fate/stay night, Tsukihime, and Kara no Kyoukai discussion

Can you still view it through history?

You can view the history normally, as long as the cache hasn't been cleared out during Eddie's somewhat regular cache-clearing every few months. It will only show you the edits though, so unless someone had manually deleted the entire article text at some point in the edit history, you would be hard pressed to piece the code together.

So there I was, editing Fire Emblem sprites.

And then I unfortunately thought, "hey, wouldn't a Fate/ franchise Fire Emblem be totally awesome? it would totally have enough character slots for like every servant officially created so far"

Unfortunate because I know it'll probably never actually happen. And I don't know how Gilgamesh's hubris would be emulated in such a format.

I guess i'll just have to cope with Battle Moon Wars for now...

Of man that would be really cool.

Man Shirou could have a million support conversations.

You wouldn't be able to field him with other characters. He only raises XP by one point at a time. He moves where he wants, he never attacks who you want. He uses his shittiest weapons, and never takes anything seriously.

And then you win.

Oh lord Hercules would have like 80 hit points and you'd have to kill him 12 times with only certain weapons being able to hurt him.

On the other hand he just mysteriously drops dead if he's beating you.

Are there AOE attacks in Fire Emblem? If so, I'd say Gilgamesh probably has stats that are relative to the opponents he's fighting, low defenses and won't use Ea against anyone except the actual boss or characters of similar stature. The AOE attacks come in because they're all he has and they're pretty much guaranteed to hit your own units because kings don't give a shit about friendly fire!

Eh, I think Battle Moon Wars made the right call in basing its battle system on SRW rather than Fire Emblem. The vast majority of Fate characters have signature weapons and moves that completely define their fighting style. That doesn't suit FE's system of breakable weapons, inventory management, and limited/largely passive skills at all; whereas an SRW-style attack list lets you fit in pretty much every important attack associated with a character.

Having, say, Saber resort to hitting grunts with an Iron Sword because she's got to conserve 20 uses of Excalibur before it's gone (or 20 users before a really damned big repair bill, if you go by FE 4's weapon system) just goes completely against the spirit of Nasuverse, to me. It's more fitting to have her selecting her attack from a menu along the lines of Melee (range 1, P), Invisible Air (range 1-3, P), and Excalibur (range 1-8, MAP version available) feels much more fitting.

There's not any AOE attacks in FE. At least in any of the ones I have played.

There are some used by endgame bosses in FE 10, at least.

There's also unlimited weapons in Fire Emblem (they're always specific though) and for Excalibur I was kinda thinking of Invisible Air being the normal attack and Excalijetpackblast being her critical/super skill(like Eclipse of the Black Knight or Astra of Sword Saints).

And also as far as limited uses go, well, they could always just be "Use only this amount of times per battle, "mana transfer" later to recharge lol" or something.

edited 16th Apr '12 7:20:53 PM by Edmania

I'm quite aware that infinite use stuff like Ragnell and Amiti exist, but they're really damned rare in-game for a good reason. Conversely, the vast majority of Heroic Spirits start with the equivalent of an FE legendary weapon (quite literally, in cases like Gae Bolg), which they rely on exclusively for combat. You have to either completely break the spirit of FE and just give them all infinite-use starting weapons that are so good that they'll never use anything else, thereby greatly diminishing the game's tactical options, or you completely break the spirit of Fate by creating non-canonical reasons why their N Ps will break after x uses so they have to rely on storebought weaponry. It's jamming a square peg in a round hole, no matter how you tackle it.

Your idea of turning Excalibur into a skill% activation is another example of this. From a strictly mechanical POV, it fits with established FE gameplay, but it completely goes against the spirit of Fate canon. Excalibur is something that Saber has to consciously use at the cost of large amounts of prana, not something that just randomly activates as a bonus when she attacks. It doesn't acknowledge the big difference in range and Ao E between the two moves either, though admittedly both are hard to represented within FE mechanics anyways.

Fire Emblem gameplay is built around leveraging a fairly simplistic set of mechanics along with finite resources (breakable weapons, permadeath) to yield more meaningful tactical decision trees in-battle than more SRP Gs with broader arrays of unit mechanics like Final Fantasy Tactics or Super Robot Wars, which tend to have crazy gamebreaker options that even the easiest FE games can't compare against. Meanwhile, Fate (and Nasuverse in general, for that matter), not being confined by actual gameplay for the mechanics to work within, is full of extremely elaborate rules and abilities and exceptions to the aforementioned rules that aren't easily modelled by a relatively simplistic gameplay system like FE's. You can try to squeeze it into the framework of an FE game if you really wanted to, but you'll end up with either characters who barely even resemble their canonical Fate versions or game mechanics that are modified so heavily they're closer to a more conventional SRPG than they are to Fire Emblem. Personally, it just makes more sense to start with a set of gameplay mechanics that are closer to the spirit of Nasuverse to start with than to try and hack FE into something suitable.

edited 16th Apr '12 7:53:38 PM by RandomDude

So basically it will come out when Fate/Hollow Ataraxia is translated?

FHA is waiting on an image translator last I checked. I think they're actually far beyond their original third release in terms of translated content.

Yes! Only eighteen more years!

... "Dead End Catharsis"? "Neverland Overdrive"? Let me guess: This is a joke on those two writers' parts, isn't it?

edited 19th Apr '12 9:03:11 AM by MarqFJA

Rumor has it that Gilgamesh may be a playable servant in Fate/Extra CCC. A link

Needs to get a PSP.

Speaking of CCC, here are the new designs.

Archer has so much swag.

>Implying Archer's standard costume doesn't have swag.

I hope that rumor is true, I'd really like that even though the only reason would be because i'd have a gold-armored servant blasting red spirals at stuff.

Or if they decide to nerf him the same way they did with the player servants before, to see amusing dialogue of him bitching about how he's been downgraded.

Also this is the sprite I was making that I was talking about earlier (the only reason why it turned out anywhere near that good is because of how convenient the reference◊ and pre-made official face◊ I used was though)

I can never get over how weird it feels to me seeing Nero Claudius Caesar Augustus Germanicus to be in a form-fitting wedding-dress-sorta-thing.

edited 19th Apr '12 9:47:11 AM by Edmania

Yep, Gilgamesh in CCC is all but confirmed. He's even on the website's "Characters" section, in the exact same group as the other playable Servants.

So, yes: in Fate/Extra you will be able to ONORE your way to victory! Unless something changes quite a bit.

Speaking of changes, the gameplay is also going to be improved; that's one reason for the delay to Winter 2012. Overall, it seems like CCC is actually going to be really good.

I saw the Gilgamesh thing yesterday. Are we sure he is a permanent Servant and not just a partner for a time?

Not sure, but having him as a temporary Servant would be the world's most uproarious cockblock.

With CCC and its massive development time, I doubt there's not going to be a new, fully implemented Servant. That'd be a bit lazy... plus, I believe the developers hinted that there would be not only the old characters, but at least one new one. Something about "choosing one of the F/E Servants" and implying that there were Servants other than those from which to choose.

Hmm, with regards to the discussion about Sakura, she's definitely 15 (unless it's going to get the page blanked, in which case she's totally 18). Her birthday is in March, the game is set in February and the Japanese school year ends in April.