Dragon Age

Well, she was Rite for the Wrong Reasons since the Kirkwall Circle by that point had become corrupt enough that her suspicions were entirely correct.

Like, the point that it had gotten to is exactly why you have the Rite in the first place.

(Though Meredith is blatantly using the actual bombing as an excuse to put the Rite into affect; it's almost like blowing up a church full of innocent people might have massive negative repercussions)

edited 16th Jan '18 4:56:37 AM by Sigilbreaker26

Yes, when the First Enchanter pulls shit like hiding the presence of a Blood Mage Serial Killer (and sharing notes with the bastard)...

Anders, Meredith, Orsino...to hell with all of them.

edited 16th Jan '18 4:55:45 AM by M84

Eh. I would argue that it's a case of both sides confirming their own worst fears about the other. The mages were willing to use blood magic because the templars were willing to use the Rite(s), and round and round it goes.

Anders and Meredith seem inevitable in hindsight, and they have demonic/singing rock-based excuses, but Orsino really should've known better.

edited 16th Jan '18 4:59:58 AM by Unsung

See, even ignoring that the depths which Orsino stooped to went well beyond self-defence (like helping a serial killer) I've never really bought the "use blood magic for self-defence" argument in the first place simply because it's so hugely unstable. It feels like even in a rebellion it would be counterproductive.

Yeah, but if they're that desperate and have nothing else... I'm not saying it's justified, but it's entirely predictable.

edited 16th Jan '18 5:10:03 AM by Unsung

If it's just the "using own blood as an alternate power source" thing, it's not so bad. Which is actually pretty damn easy for any mage. It's the more advanced Blood Magic that is a cause for concern. And the demon summoning, which Blood Magic makes easier.

And say what you will about the morality of it all, but Blood Magic in this setting is really powerful. Even a novice mage with little talent like Jowan from Origins could overpower and escape from a roomful of Templars and the First Enchanter using Blood Magic (granted that's Cutscene Power to the Max).

Small wonder then that a desperate mage might resort to this — it's one of their strongest potential tools.

And heck, in Origins I had absolutely no problem making all of my mages Blood Mages. Blood Wound is just too damn useful.

The funny thing is, even though the threat of Blood Magic is emphasized greatly in DA II, the actual Blood Magic specialization for a Mage Hawke isn't nearly as good as it was in Origins.

And it's not even available at all in DA: I. But that was fine since we got Knight Enchanter.

edited 16th Jan '18 5:07:42 AM by M84

Also just want to note that Orsino technically has an excuse, same as Meredith and Anders; Kirkwall being an evil place with a loose connection with the fade can't be good for any mage's sanity.

Really, they should just move the population down the coast and burn the old city to the ground, it's literally cursed.

Eh...it's still kind of a stretch. Yeah, the place is a fucked up Eldritch Location. But as much of a Wretched Hive that it is, it just makes all of that creepy Blood Magic and demon summoning easier. It doesn't actually force anyone to do anything.

Most of the mages in Kirkwall managed to remain sane (if not Blood Magic free). Orsino didn't do what he did because he was crazy. He did it because he cared more about protecting his own and their reputation than he did about Quentin's victims. Orsino was selfish, not crazy.

edited 16th Jan '18 5:17:13 AM by M84

Yeah, I don't think it was Kirkwall that got to him. Not in the same way, and no more than anyone else who had to live there. Mages were more sensitive to Kirkwall's ill effects from the corrupted Fade around the city, but no one's really immune.

I do think it might have saved everyone a lot of trouble if Kirkwall crumbled into the sea or fell into the Deep Roads, but I suppose the Fereldan refugees needed to go somewhere.

In Orsino's case, I think it was less Kirkwall's eldritch properties and more simply having to put up with Meredith for years. And possibly the psychological effects of living in a repurposed prison. Though the fact he shared notes with Quentin implies that he secretly did harbor some fascination with Blood Magic.

Really makes you appreciate the Ferelden Circle's drab tower and grumpy but relatively reasonable Knight Commander, huh?

edited 16th Jan '18 5:29:19 AM by M84

Yeah, Rowan didn't have it so bad in retrospect.

It felt annoying you couldn't follow up on the Orsino / murder connection. I wanted to just shank that idiot so much. Mind you, the fact his staff is a tangle of reptile heads should've been a tip off.

Frankly, we should nuke Kirkwall from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.

Regarding returning characters, there's so many ways you can kill off party members across the games, it'd be hard to hang roles onto older party members (Not that it stopped them with Leiliana) so they'd likely be cameos at best. Sadly. We could get a return by some DA: I non killable members.

Amusingly enough, the Staff of Violation's Codex Entry is a letter from Orsino saying that people who think keeping a creepy looking staff like that around is kind of disturbing are missing the point of the staff. It's apparently tradition for the First Enchanter of the Kirkwall Circle to wield the Staff.

edited 16th Jan '18 6:03:03 AM by M84

There's been some demand for Scout Harding as a companion in the next game, but without a dark and troubled past, deep-seated psychological issues, or something else along those lines, I'm not sure she qualifies as companion material

edited 16th Jan '18 6:03:16 AM by Tarlonniel

Yes, the only companion in the franchise who doesn't have most of that was Dog from Origins. And even that's a bit of a stretch.

Barely knew his father! Torn from his mother at an early age! Forced into the front lines of battle against the armies of darkness and corruption! His friends and family lost, he's saved at the eleventh hour by the hand of a stranger - can he overcome? Can he find a meaning in it all? Play the saga of Dog!

IMHO, the most traumatic thing about Dog was having to put up with an idiot (Alistair) who kept forgetting he's a sentient warhound and not just a dog, having to avoid Wynne's attempts to bathe him and tie a ribbon on his tail, and Oghren's drunken attempts to make him drag him around in a chariot.

...Honestly it's kind of amazing Dog didn't just ditch this band of misfits at the first opportunity.

edited 16th Jan '18 6:20:37 AM by M84

Aside from "being a widow" I would say Aveline is pretty normal.

edited 16th Jan '18 7:19:39 AM by Kiefen

If you do the Human Noble Origin then the Dog has to deal with most people he knew dying. Although I doubt it affects him as much as the Warden and at least he still has the Warden. And the Mabari from DA 2 is a quasi-partymember who has definitely the least traumatic past. Hawke just adopts him one day and that's it.

edited 16th Jan '18 7:16:47 AM by TommyFresh

He still almost died from Darkspawn blood.

The games are Pro-Mage but one thing I wish they'd brought up was something from the novel where a mage has an encounter with a village which basically contextualizes the Mages as "First World Problems" outside of Kirkwall. They are locked up and have no freedom.

No one else in Thedas has freedom to do whatever they want except a narrow subset of nobles who are still trapped in social roles.

Mages have the freedom from starvation, ignorance, being casually murdered by nobles, and living lives of luxury versus starving in the mud like 90% of the world is an interesting contrast to make which isn't normally done.

edited 16th Jan '18 8:55:41 AM by CharlesPhipps

And according to one former Orlesian lady in Origins who works as a merchant in Denerim, it's even worse in Orlais. The entire reason she's in Ferelden is because an Orlesian Chevalier tried to rape her and her brother hit him with a pot to stop him. Because he was a Chevalier, they became the fugitives from Orlesian "justice".

In Tevinter you get a side order of being brainwashed into a slave with Blood Magic! Even if (especially if) you are a mage! Magisters don't hesitate to collar their own kind.

In Par Vollen you will be okay as long as you stick to your role. Step out of it and you're hunted as Tal'Vashoth. And if you don't easily fit into any role or refuse to conform, that problem is solved with a whiff of nerve gas!

edited 16th Jan '18 8:42:28 AM by M84

The world of Dragon Age is very much Middle Age drudgery which is basically the other reason I didn't think too highly of the problems of Circle mages in the average circle; they live in what is, effectively, a combo-monastery/nunnery. Yes, it's massively boring, but the only real danger (aside from the odd unsavoury Templar) come from magical powers, and wouldn't really be any safer outside of the circle.

Compare that to the Casteless Backstory, or even worse, the City Elf backstory...

edited 16th Jan '18 8:43:17 AM by Sigilbreaker26

One ends up getting the impression that the Ferelden Circle actually had it pretty damn good as far as Circles go. Probably helps that the First Enchanter and the Knight Commander are friends.

edited 16th Jan '18 8:43:48 AM by M84

Well, that's possible but it also isn't expressly stated anywhere, whereas the Kirkwall Circle having gone off the rails in a huge huge way is expressly stated, so I'd bet my left buttcheek on the average circle being a damn sight closer to the Ferelden Circle than the Kirkwall Circle.

edited 16th Jan '18 8:45:08 AM by Sigilbreaker26

That said, there's what happened to Cole the original human one in the White Spire Circle. One gets the impression that Kirkwall was actually closer to the average Circle.