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That One Boss and That One Level cleanup.

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Karxrida The Unknown from Eureka, the Forbidden Land Since: May, 2012 Relationship Status: I LOVE THIS DOCTOR!
The Unknown
#901: May 31st 2023 at 6:16:11 PM

I've recently been playing Elden Ring and would like to contest the placement of the Draconic Tree Sentinel and the Leonine Misbegotten + Crucible Knight Dual Boss in ThatOneBoss.Elden Ring.

The Draconic Tree Sentinel's fight honestly seems pretty fair. Everything can be reasonably dodged (though the lightning strike admittedly has kind of strict timing) and nothing about its damage seemed that extreme to me. (I was told in a Discord server that my build was squishy and just accepted that most bosses would two shot me.) Hell, you can get a cheap shot in before the dude aggros you. Boss didn't stand out that much to me.

Maybe my build and level contributed to this, but I was able to semi-consistently take out Leonine Misbegotten before the Crucible Knight came in. The Crucible Knight was admittedly tough and killed me a bunch, but when playing a FromSoft game you're going to die a few times to a ton of bosses to learn their patterns.

Edited by Karxrida on May 31st 2023 at 6:22:25 AM

If a tree falls in the forest and nobody remembers it, who else will you have ice cream with?
Siegfried1337 Unofficial co-Wiki Curator for Magnificent Bastard from the Ashes Since: Sep, 2018 Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
AnoBakaDesu Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: What is this thing you call love?
#903: Jun 2nd 2023 at 3:40:25 PM

[up][up] The Leonine Misbegotten + Crucible Knight duo at Redmane Castle is only hard if you take too long to take down the former (the Leonine Misbegotten should ideally be below half health when the Crucible Knight shows up) and aren't familiar with the latter's moves (though the Crucible Knight is admittedly hard on its own). Spirit Ashes like the Lone Wolf can make the Leonine Misbegotten stagger nonstop, and make for a good distraction against the Crucible Knight if you spent some Gloveworts upgrading them so that they don't get oneshotted. That said, without tools to dispatch the Misbegotten fast, the fight is clearly lopsided against you, so I'll vote for keeping.

As for the Draconic Tree Sentinel, neither the one stationed in the Capital Outskirts or the one in Farum Azula before Maliketh stray far from the strategies used against a regular Tree Sentinel, and they're high level enemies in areas that are similarly late-game, so they don't stick out that much. It's an easy cut for me.

Edited by AnoBakaDesu on Jun 2nd 2023 at 8:33:28 AM

"They played us like a DAMN FIDDLE!" — Kazuhira Miller, Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain
Vilui Since: May, 2009
#904: Jul 4th 2023 at 11:33:28 AM

I've noticed that the standout difficulty spellcards from Touhou Bunkachou ~ Shoot the Bullet are listed both under That One Level and That One Attack. It would be good to consolidate the two lists into one, but which is the better location?

(For those who don't know: STB is different from most Touhou games in that there is no continuous play. You select one spellcard and play it until beaten. So, "level" and "attack" are pretty much the same thing in this game.)

Edited by Vilui on Jul 4th 2023 at 7:33:39 PM

Ayumi-chan Aramis from Calvard (Apprentice) Relationship Status: Serial head-patter
#905: Jul 15th 2023 at 2:24:13 AM

Found this on YMMV.Gagharv Trilogy, and I'm unsure if it's valid or "complaining about level you don't like" type of misuse.

  • That One Level: The last dungeon of Moonlight Witch is probably the worst designed level in the entire series. The level is an extremely long underground maze full of monsters where one can easily get lost and spend hours running in circles.

She/Her | Currently cleaning N/A
TantaMonty Since: Aug, 2017
#906: Aug 7th 2023 at 4:37:58 PM

    Folderized for convenience 
  • For a boss so early in the game, World 2's Roy Koopa can be a bit of a nightmare to get used to. He ground pounds, stunning the player for several seconds so that when they recover, they only have a few frames (if any frames at all, depending on how close they are to him) to dodge his magic.
  • If you thought Wendy's fight in Super Mario Bros 3 was hard, her castle bout makes the aforementioned battle look very tame. Thanks to Kamek's magic, it's underwater. Obviously you'll have to fight with water physics hampering your ability to dodge her attacks, but there's also the fact that until the water temporarily recedes, there's no way to hurt her unless you have a Fire Flower with you.
  • Iggy's castle fight is also bit of a challenge. You're basically in an enclosed space, and unless you have a Propeller Mushroom, you'll have to rely on the spring blocks to get you to a higher platform while his pet chain-chomp is CHASING YOU. Oh, and Iggy will also shoot magic when you try to keep up with him for a stomp.
  • Morton of World 6 can also stun the player for a few seconds, but not for as long as Roy's. To make up for it however, his tower fight has lava, spikes, as well as his fast spinning shell and tight spaces that make it pretty hard to dodge.
  • Ludwig. He flutter jumps and gets a good aim at the player to land on them and hurt them. In his first fight (which is already a huge pain to even get to) his magic also chases you, and in his second fight, you have to constantly move between three tiny platforms.
  • The fight against Kamek in the World 8 Tower can also be bit of a pain in the butt. You'll have to go through a very complicated series of side-scrolling platforms to get to the Magikoopa, who will teleport to a random place and can only be stomped on right after he shoots magic from his wand. Also, the magic will turn the platform into either a power-up or a harmless object.
  • The final bout with Bowser Jr. is a lot to handle. The only way to defeat him is by ground-pounding the floor to get the bomb to hit the Koopa Clown Car, but the Clown Car is constantly moving from left to right. Oh, and he'll be breathing fire that homes onto you and stays on the ground for a period of time.
  • The final fight with Bowser ranks among the hardest final bosses in the entire Mario series. In the second phase, Bowser grows huge and starts chasing you down the hallway, while shooting incredibly big fireballs. Later on, lava waves start appearing as well, so you'll have to keep track of Bowser, his fireballs, the lava waves, and an already difficult platforming challenge, all at the same time. Beginners will probably need to use the Super Guide.

That's 8 out of the game's 10 bosses, so that's definitely too much. I propose the following:

  • Roy is an easy cut. All you need to do to avoid being stunned by his ground pound is to jump. That's it.
  • Keep Wendy. It's hard to find discussions about this game, but her name consistently popped up on this thread.
  • Cut Iggy. You don't need to use the spring blocks, you can just wall jump to the upper level. And the boss' attack pattern is ridiculously simple.
  • Keep Ludwig, for the same reason as Wendy.
  • Kamek is a joke. His attacks are slow and can actually create power-ups for you to use against him.
  • I never had any trouble with Bowser Jr., nor heard anyone complain about his boss battle being too difficult, so I'm inclined to cut this as well.
  • Keep Bowser. He is the final boss, but he is definitely harder than what would be expected from the franchise.

Any objections?

Edited by TantaMonty on Aug 7th 2023 at 4:38:41 AM

mr_allen Since: Apr, 2015
#907: Aug 12th 2023 at 11:16:27 PM

[up][up][up] Due to the ways days work in shoot the bullet I think it'd be best to move everything in That One Boss and That One Level to That One Attack. The best way I think to look at both Shoot the Bullet and Double Spoiler is to consider a whole day a level and then consider all the spell cards a single character has in a single day as a boss.

desdendelle (Avatar by Coffee) from Land of Milk and Honey (Ten years in the joint) Relationship Status: Writing a love letter
(Avatar by Coffee)
#908: Aug 21st 2023 at 2:00:37 PM

ThatOneLevel.Ace Combat 7 Skies Unknown exists. It lists half of the game's missions and a third of the DLC missions, which is obviously too much.

In my opinion - this is honestly a tad subjective - none of those missions are harder than the norm (what with half of the missions in the game being in there already...). Missions 7, 8, 9 and 13 have annoying gimmicks, but they're not harder than the rest.

If anything, the DLC missions are noticeably harder than the normal campaign, but that's Difficulty Spike, not That One Level. I think the page should be Cut Listed, but I don't know whether one guy's say so is enough for that.

The voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground
ChillyBeanBAM KIRBY CAR from Ontario, Canada Since: Jan, 2020
KIRBY CAR
#909: Aug 21st 2023 at 3:21:12 PM

This was recently added under Sillydillo's entry in ThatOneBoss.Kirby:

  • In a June 2022 interview with Nintendo Dream, Shinya Kumazaki admitted that members of the development team often raised complaints about Sillydillo's difficulty... including Kumazaki himself. You know a boss deserves to be on this list when the people who made the game wound up finding him too tough!

Seems like natter to me, but should I remove it?

Edited by ChillyBeanBAM on Aug 21st 2023 at 6:21:27 AM

he/him
Siegfried1337 Unofficial co-Wiki Curator for Magnificent Bastard from the Ashes Since: Sep, 2018 Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
#910: Nov 17th 2023 at 1:00:54 AM

So I managed to play through the entirety of Like a Dragon Gaiden: The Man Who Erased His Name, and I have one specific question regarding this entry:

Admittedly, I did grind the Coliseum beforehand and managing to max out most of Kiryu's stats beforehand, but I feel like Nishitani isn't that hard since I managed to easily defeat him multiple times on Professional difficulty (the hardest difficulty setting). Any opinions?

MB Pending | MB Drafts | MB Dates
desdendelle (Avatar by Coffee) from Land of Milk and Honey (Ten years in the joint) Relationship Status: Writing a love letter
(Avatar by Coffee)
#911: Nov 17th 2023 at 2:37:42 AM

[up] I haven't played the game, but since That One Boss is YMMV and grinding can significantly change how difficult some bosses are, I think the example can stay.

(My point of comparison here is Armored Core VI: Fires of Rubicon: the fact that you can still trivialise the Balteus fight — even after the Zimmerman and Stun Needle Launcher nerfs — doesn't make it any less That One Boss for someone doing their first or third playthrough of the game.)

The voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground
ChillyBeanBAM KIRBY CAR from Ontario, Canada Since: Jan, 2020
KIRBY CAR
#912: Nov 21st 2023 at 8:39:15 AM

YMMV.Brawl Stars' That One Level entries are quite whiny, going as far as to insert gratuitous profanity in several of the examples:

    Foldered because it's rather long 
  • That One Level:
    • Snake Prairie doesn't have too many fun times to be had. The map is 90% tall grass, meaning that you can be ambushed from anywhere, meaning you need to bait enemies out using your own hide. However, once everyone gets warmed up and start to destroy cover, it gets somewhat easier. It is considered an oddball Bounty map for its odd design. Funny thing is that it was even included as a championship map until it was booted.
    • Earlier versions of the special gimmicks (Meteor Shower, Energy Drink, Healing Mushrooms) could appear outside of Showdown, in cramped maps where they are a little too effective. It was bad with the Energy Drinks, because there was little room to evade Brawlers boosted to three times the attack power. This has been subverted as energy drink buffs have been nerfed to just two times. But still, it is simply demoralizing to have amassed 10 cubes, only for someone to pick up an energy drink and bring you to death's hands in two or three shots.
    • Forsaken Falls is also pretty infamous for being the only Showdown map to have no power crates at all. Meaning that the only way to get more powerful is to snuff out and kill players. Though, it has been praised for being a fairer version of a showdown map, not being influenced by boxes but rather the skill of the players.
    • Certain maps have been criticised for favouring certain brawlers, like Stormy Plains' walls favouring throwers and Cavern Churn's thick chunk of bush at the center favouring vision-based brawlers and tanks.
    • GG Mortuary [originally called GG Coral] has an awkward design featuring no lanes at all. Instead, the only direct path without tricks seems to be a lengthy reversed S-shaped path. Though, this issue can just be solved with a Colt's Silver bullet or Brock's Rocket Fuel. Mind you, nerfing a gadget doesn't render it total shit.
    • The late 2020 Brawl Ball maps were also that. They featured just pure odd design that would look like they were made in the Map Maker. However, they have since been removed and replaced with newer, fresher maps.
    • The competition winner maps are often met with disdain due to their repetitive, fucking boring ass design and shitty titles.
    • The map for the Knockout game mode have a near universal poor design, almost as bad as the drivel in Map Maker. The one most agree is the worst is Crimewater, a map with a significant amount of bushes similar to Snake Praire, so strats that rely on bushes work extremely well (Nani-Bo is at its worst because of the single lane). The deal breaker is that there is just one single lane that connects both sides of the map, resulting in a very easy chokepoint to defend. Knockout makes it worse since Brawlers stay dead after dying. Thankfully, the first set of KO maps were just for the mode to be tested, and since then the maps have gotten a much better design.
    • Minecart Madness is by far one of the most hated Gem Grab maps because of that stupid Minecart that blocks every movement you do and constantly forces bad positions of the players on both sides. There's even a running joke that the minecart in the map is the true MVP for KILLING EVERY SINGLE THING IN ITS PATH!
    • Not going to lie, Power League's map rotation has some god awful shit maps that make you wonder how they even are considered competitive. Examples include: Split (a huge wall splits the two zones, with narrow passages leading up to the zones that favors Rico and throwers.), Spring Onions (lane bushes that spans basically the entire map, easily allowing tanks to sneak up on your safe), Turnaround (an oddball heist map with narrow passages filled with grass leading up to the safe just like Splits, making Rico and tanks overpowered), Minecart Madness (see above) and more.

I don't know how to deal with these considering that I've never played the game.

he/him
Libraryseraph Showtime! from Canada (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: Raising My Lily Rank With You
Showtime!
#913: Nov 21st 2023 at 8:48:34 AM

I have played this game, and keeping Minecart Madness is fine. Leaving aside the cursing, everything else seems too general? "Bad level gimmicks" and "bad levels in the ranked rotation" don't count as That One Level

Absolute destiny... apeachalypse?
JustNormalMusicLover Hello Since: Jun, 2022 Relationship Status: Abstaining
Hello
#914: Nov 27th 2023 at 12:50:45 AM

Fire Emblem: Three Houses

  • Edelgard in chapter 17 of the Azure Moon and Verdant Wind routes can be this. She has high defense and resistance, and she's surprisingly fast and hard to double. She has Counterattack, so nobody can attack her without retaliation. And she has 68 attack on the easiest difficulty, meaning she can potentially take out your squishier units in a single hit. Furthermore, she can use her Raging Storm combat art, which not only boosts her attack, but will likely give her another action, meaning she can potentially take out multiple units in a single turn.

To be honest, this is in a game where the Impregnable Wall exists and turns that into just merely 1 damage per attack. And to say, this applies even for Maddening. If not without Impregnable Wall, she would normally qualify under this extent, but even then, Edelgard have low movement so she might just end up attacking the same unit over and over if they somehow didn't die in the first attack, so I was considering to completely cut this, but... I might likely end up invoking someone readding it with an argument to justify her being a "very difficult" boss battle just because she can easily one-shot player units.

Last but not least, Raging Storm itself is already mentioned in That One Attack, and the boss here would've been threatening if moves unprovoked... but she doesn't. She just stays on the same place, as long as you're not leaving a unit within her regular move and attack range on the Empire's "Enemy Phase". It doesn't help she only has 5 movement, which means her threat range only effectively reaches 6 squares from where she starts from, and the player can just chip from beyond that range with certain methods (for example, Deadeye, combined with the Bow range +2 from Bow Knight, or more simply, certain characters can learn Meteor/Bolting which has up to 10 range).

Edited by JustNormalMusicLover on Nov 27th 2023 at 5:28:59 PM

Everyone's got their unique qualities.
ChillyBeanBAM KIRBY CAR from Ontario, Canada Since: Jan, 2020
KIRBY CAR
#915: Nov 27th 2023 at 10:46:23 AM

[up][up][up]Since nobody objected, I've cut the Brawl Stars examples and fixed the remaining Minecart Madness entry.

he/him
TheLivingDrawing Lucas the Dreamer from The Town of Clayton Since: Apr, 2019 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Lucas the Dreamer
#916: Feb 24th 2024 at 4:59:39 PM

ThatOneBoss.Sekiro Shadows Die Twice lists most bosses in the game.

    Page examples 
  • The Chained Ogre is encountered early on in the game, has a lot of health and can deplete almost your entire vitality bar in a single hit. The ogre has several grab attacks with a deceptively big hitbox range and can instantly land if you happen to be in front of it, may potentially hurl you off a cliff (which will kill you due to the combined damage) and can even drop-kick you. Up to this point you've mostly learned to deal with foes by attacking and parrying/deflecting, but this beast will require you to be on-point with your dodges to make it out alive. Fortunately, it possesses a weakness to fire. Using a Shinobi Tool like the Flame Vent will cause it cower in fear at the sight of flames for considerable amounts of time, making the fight a lot easier. This fight exists in part to teach you to eavesdrop, as the Chained Ogre's guards will tell you about its weakness to fire if you listen to them. Go in without knowing this, and... Mini-Boss. A mini boss that has a glaring weakness to fire and is easy to learn. Cut.
  • The Blazing Bull just outside Ashina Castle continuously charges around, giving you very little breathing room. It hits incredibly hard with very generous hitboxes, all the while inflicting burn status. Sticking close to the Bull avoids having to dodge its charge all the time, but this can be difficult as the Bull has very tight tracking and can make surprisingly sharp turns. At this point in the game, you are unlikely to be in the possession of a lot of Healing Gourd charges, so your healing options are limited. This guy actually got patched to be slightly easier and he's still That One Boss for many. The fact it got patched to be easier does lend credibility to it staying. Its still only a mini boss though.
  • The Snake Eyes mini-bosses are hated for a variety of reasons. Take the shotgun users mentioned in the Demonic Spiders entry and crank them all the way, and also give them a very nasty Perilous Grab Attack for an awful concoction. Special mention goes to Shirahagi, who is fought in a poison swamp and surrounded by snipers who will all fire on you at once if you don't take them out first or you're not careful sneaking up on her. These guys are a serious pain but hardly That One Boss. Also mini bosses. Cut
  • O'Rin of the Water seems predictable enough, but she has a few tricks up her sleeve that can make her deceptively hard to kill. She can decide to extend her most common combo attack if you get too close or attempt to abuse the short version for an opening, has a dodge where she turns invisible and thus can escape your own combos, and will relentlessly press Sekiro if he runs away to try to heal. Mini Boss. It also isn't particularly hard compared to the rest of this game up to this point. Cut.
  • The Corrupted Monk Illusion can be this, especially for the ill-prepared. Despite requiring just one death blow, it has a gargantuan amount of vitality, takes little posture damage, and recovers quickly. Its weapon gives it a generous reach, a heavy punch towards your posture, and a number of deadly combos. Using any Snap Seeds on hand will stun the Corrupted Monk for a few seconds, but it only works 3 times, and the third time is really just a fake-out where it seems to work but she immediately attacks you and backs away after you use it. She's also hard to read because her thick, flowing robes obscure her movements. Cut. Fight is hard but standard by this point in the game.
    • The True Corrupted Monk can also be a big stumbling block. Unlike the illusion, she has less vitality, and her posture bar is very slow to drain - but she has three deathblow markers, meaning it's still going to be a long fight. Like the illusion, she's still hard to read due to her robes, has great reach, does huge damage, and has long, powerful combos that will fill your posture bar even if you deflect them flawlessly. She also has a very cheap swipe that you would almost never react to on time outside of knowing it in advance. She's also got some new tricks up her sleeves. After you land the first deathblow, she gains the ability to summon illusory copies of herself, and after the second one, she starts mixing up her combos with lightning-fast swipes and can spray you with centipedes and goop to inflict terror. This is a late game boss, but she is a very long and difficult fight even compared to Owl before her. Keep
  • If you decide to tackle Hirata Estate as soon as or not too long after you gain access to it (which happens very early on in the very first level outside of the tutorial), Lady Butterfly is this. The two mini-bosses you encounter in the level serve as exams on your ability to perform the useful Mikiri Counter (meant to counter Perilous Thrust Attacks) and dealing with a miniboss + surrounding mooks (for which the game provides you with a friendly NPC that will assist you). Even the single Lone Swordman mook in the level is harder than them. You then face Lady Butterfly. She moves and attacks swiftly, combines melee and ranged attacks seamlessly, and actively encourages you to keep up the pressure and aggression, which requires the player to have a good understanding of the basic attack and parry/deflect mechanics. She's only a required boss fight if pursuing one ending path, but a requirement nonetheless. Killing her also gives you an extra life, heavily encouraging you to face her as early as possible—most likely well before you have all the resources you need to face her on an even keel. One of the easiest bosses in the game and she is very vulnerable to various cheese tactics. Even without being cheesed she is one of the easiest bosses. Cut
    • Making Lady Butterfly even worse is that her fight is a lot harder without Snap Seeds. While they can be bought from a vendor, Said Vendor is unavailable until VERY late into the game. Natter
  • Genichiro Ashina atop Ashina Castle serves as the point where the game stops pussyfooting around and expects the player to have mastered the combat system in order to progress. Part of what makes him such a challenging encounter is that most bosses up to this point have a notable weakness to certain prosthetic tools, abilities, or strategies. Genichiro doesn't. He's fast, precise, and relentless. He has few holes in his defenses and will punish you if you are reckless. He attacks with a variety of sword and bow moves in various combinations (meaning he's an all-range character), uses all kinds of perilous attacks, has dirty tricks up his sleeve, and is the first boss you encounter that has a total of three deathblows, with one not even being revealed until you take out the first two. To defeat him, you must rely on all your experience to read his movements, find and exploit every tiny opening he gives you, learn how to properly defend yourself from his onslaught, and endure a long and grueling battle. By the time you defeat him, you should be well-trained to take on the other tough bosses that follow in the second half of the game. Keep. Genichiro is an enormous Difficulty Spike who will rip you apart until you've gotten an extremely solid grip on the game. He also cannot be cheesed and is the first boss with three health bars.
  • The Guardian Ape is infamous for having a truly wild and schizophrenic moveset that can really take new players off-guard, with both of its grabs dealing tremendous amounts of damage complete with Hitbox Dissonance. Even if you do manage to memorize its attack patterns, its incredible speed means that parrying its various attacks can be a challenge in itself. Luckily, it's weak to the Mortal Blade and can easily be stunned by the Shinobi Firecrackers, which helps make the fight much easier. However, beheading the creature doesn't even put it down. Its second phase forces the player to approach it in a vastly different way from the first, encouraging them to be slow and methodical in a fight that had previously been frenetic and chaotic. Cut. While quite difficult, it is quite standard in terms of boss difficult by this point in the game
    • If you haven't reached an idol past the Poison Pool in Ashina Depths before killing the Guardian Ape, then you're in for a nasty surprise, as the rematch with the Ape becomes mandatory. Not only do you have to perform two deathblows on the headless ape, but once you pull the first off, it summons its mate, who fights like the first form of the Guardian Ape (although thankfully without the grabs or poison attacks and with more susceptibility to being staggered). More of a Goddamned Boss.
  • Owl is also a pain in the ass both times you fight him. Whereas the other duel bosses use vaguely Ashina-style attacks of the sort you've been fighting the whole game, this fight uses an advanced form of your own moveset that you have no frame of reference for countering. Not only is he tough as nails, one wrong step will have you being hit by a mikiri counter, something no other boss uses. He also uses numerous other shinobi tricks, such as smoke that blinds you so he can catch you off guard, firecrackers that stun you and do hellish amounts of damage, puddles of poison, and a debuff that completely stops you from healing for about a minute. If you wish to get the Purification Ending, you will have to fight him again in the Hirata Estate reached using Father's Bell Charm. He boasts an even more powerful moveset that ratchets up all of the aforementioned elements, along with a Guardian Spirit in his second phase that allows him to teleport and throw out extremely powerful ranged attacks. Defeating him in either instance will prove you have truly Surpassed the Teacher. Owl's first fight is a keep and way harder than both the Guardian Ape and the Corrupted Monk, who were fought in the proceeding two areas. The second fight is an optional Super Boss and should be cut as a result.
  • Regardless of the ending you choose, you must face Isshin and prove your mastery. In the Shura ending you face him literally on death's door, though he proves to be no less of a threat, with lightning-quick swordplay and the ability to channel fire into his strikes. In all other endings, you must battle a desperate Genichiro, and after him, Isshin in his prime. He retains the highly skilled and quick swordplay from before, but has three phases and adds in a spear and a ''gun'' in his second phase, able to leap across the battlefield in an instant. He hits hard and one wrong move can kill you in a flash. The one saving grace is lightning in the third phase, allowing you to devastate his posture and health. Regardless, this is a duel that will require all of your skill to emerge victorious. After all, hesitation is defeat. Final Boss. This is tricky since he is the final boss, but he is quite difficult. However I personally think he pales in comparison to the Demon of Hatred and he isn't that hard since the entire game trains you to fight him. I'd say to cut him for being the Final Boss, despite his infamous difficulty.
Also if any miniboss from this game should be here, it's the Headless, who have several cheap tricks that make fighting them harder than some bosses.

Edited by TheLivingDrawing on Feb 25th 2024 at 11:22:44 AM

Why waste time when you can see the last sunset last?
ReginaldOgron5 Biggest ZeroLenny Stan from Two blocks down from the Undead Burg Since: Mar, 2022 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Biggest ZeroLenny Stan
#917: Feb 25th 2024 at 8:39:02 AM

[up] I would say get rid of everything except Genichiro and the Guardian Ape. The Ape isn't considered That One Boss for how especially difficult at the point in the game that it is, but that its first phase runs wildly counterintuitively to how you've been taught to play so far, encouraging dodging and baiting attacks like in the Dark Souls trilogy instead of parrying and being relentless, before going right back to Sekiro's normal style in its second phase, which is both disorienting and frustrating for a lot of players because they have to clear the unconventional first phase before being able to attempt the second every time they try the fight. As such, I think it fits fine as an example of That One Boss.

Also, the Ape rematch example is natter and should under Goddamned Boss, as its difficulty stems more from the classic "Two enemies attacking you with few damage opportunities" problem.

Edited by ReginaldOgron5 on Feb 25th 2024 at 8:42:00 AM

It's not about the gold; it's about the glory.
TheLivingDrawing Lucas the Dreamer from The Town of Clayton Since: Apr, 2019 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Lucas the Dreamer
#918: Feb 25th 2024 at 8:48:49 AM

[up] I think Owl 1 and True Corrupted Monk can stay. Guardian Ape is a boss I don't have much trouble with but maybe.

Why waste time when you can see the last sunset last?
ReginaldOgron5 Biggest ZeroLenny Stan from Two blocks down from the Undead Burg Since: Mar, 2022 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Biggest ZeroLenny Stan
#919: Feb 25th 2024 at 9:39:08 AM

[up]

Keep in mind the experience of a new player in regards to That One Boss. Guardian Ape is infamous among Sekiro fans for throwing them for a loop and being a huge roadblock, and not in a Wake-Up Call Boss way like Genichiro is for the reasons specified above. Obviously you can cheese the Ape with Firecrackers and he isn't terribly hard once you have some experience under your belt, but these aren't necessarily readily available solutions to someone playing the game for the first time.

I'd also concur with owl 1 and True Corrupted Monk. The only real difficulty with Corrupted Monk 1 is that she requires Divine Confetti to do meaningful damage to, making her more of a Goddamned Boss since every attempt against her is a potential waste of resources.

Edited by ReginaldOgron5 on Feb 25th 2024 at 9:41:25 AM

It's not about the gold; it's about the glory.
desdendelle (Avatar by Coffee) from Land of Milk and Honey (Ten years in the joint) Relationship Status: Writing a love letter
(Avatar by Coffee)
#920: Feb 25th 2024 at 11:58:15 AM

IMO Lady Butterfly, Owl and Guardian Ape should stay, but the rest can go. Especially the minibosses.

The voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground
TheLivingDrawing Lucas the Dreamer from The Town of Clayton Since: Apr, 2019 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Lucas the Dreamer
#921: Feb 25th 2024 at 1:58:16 PM

[up] Lady Butterfly should be cut as she is way too easy to cheese.

Why waste time when you can see the last sunset last?
ReginaldOgron5 Biggest ZeroLenny Stan from Two blocks down from the Undead Burg Since: Mar, 2022 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Biggest ZeroLenny Stan
#922: Feb 25th 2024 at 2:17:31 PM

[up] A Cheese Strategy doesn't negate something being That One Boss. Everything I know about Lady Butterfly suggests that she's the game's first huge Difficulty Spike, as everything prior to her is minibosses with similar movesets who can be stealth attacked. A veteran player removing a That One Boss example with the reasoning of "you can easily kill this boss by exploiting X" is just an inverse version of Walkthrough Mode. Don't assume that everyone knows how to effortlessly cheese every boss, and especially not on their first playthrough.

Altogether, I'd say Lady Butterfly, Genichiro, Guardian Ape, Owl, and True Corrupted Monk are legit examples. Isshin the Sword Saint sounds like an edge case but it is my understanding that Final Bosses cannot be That One Boss on principle.

It's not about the gold; it's about the glory.
desdendelle (Avatar by Coffee) from Land of Milk and Honey (Ten years in the joint) Relationship Status: Writing a love letter
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#923: Feb 25th 2024 at 11:47:18 PM

[up][up] With this reasoning you should also remove most humanoid bosses (up to and including the final bosses) because they can be dead angled.

The voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground
TheLivingDrawing Lucas the Dreamer from The Town of Clayton Since: Apr, 2019 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Lucas the Dreamer
#924: Feb 26th 2024 at 12:59:17 AM

By "cheesed" I meant has many exploitable weaknesses such as shurikans and the Nightjar Slash. Granted that doesn't help new players much, but she is still one of the easiest bosses in the game so I don't think she should be on since I think most of her difficulty comes from her being early in the game, before you're adapted to the combat.

Why waste time when you can see the last sunset last?
desdendelle (Avatar by Coffee) from Land of Milk and Honey (Ten years in the joint) Relationship Status: Writing a love letter
(Avatar by Coffee)
#925: Feb 26th 2024 at 3:34:32 AM

[up] Take a look at this. It basically trivialises Geni. It doesn't help a new player much either (it's not very probable that a new player will be familiar with this glitch) but it makes him (and Owl, and any other dead angle-able bosses and mini-bosses) trivial.

The voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground

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