Am I a Basement Dweller?

I've got goosebumps that I might be one, in spite of being 29 years old, so maybe I would need either a reassurement or encouragement or a wake up call. First let's go over with what's going on in my life:

• I'm 29 years old and by the end of the year will be 30. I currently have a job as a programmer/developer, but I'm usually being the subordinate, who studies and then help develop things. I don't lead. I'm not an Alpha Male.
• I don't have a girlfriend at all. I do like girls, but I have a hard time interacting with them or starting things up with any girls because I tend to get thrown to a male-dominated society and I'm always afraid to hit their sensitive spots insensitively, and this causes me to never make the first move.
• I live with my parents. Even as a developer, I thought my monthly salary is rather inadequate, and my parents kept telling me that I need to study harder... which led me to the next point.
• My parents, especially my mom, kept believing that all I do in free times are play play and play more, and saying that it ruins my brain. Well, that might be true, but I know I sometimes limit my stuffs. All I wanted is that if I play or have internet activities, I don't get disturbed. They often call me for housekeeping help. If I have time, I help, but if I'm in the middle of the game, it's not seldom that my parents scolded me for being such a kid and only have games in mind. This is exacerbated with the point below:
• At home, I am very often relaxing by hanging in my room, do computer stuffs for entertainment, like... youtube, watch episodic anime/tokusatsu, play games, make up videos or write scripts for it... and my parents like to say that my room is very messy. It's not that I don't give a flying fuck about my room, but I have a rather loose style and tolerance, whereas my parents, like my mom... is a rather neat freak.

All in all... well I'm afraid I might be showing symptoms of immaturity or being a Basement-Dweller, even if my room isn't located at the basement. My parents kept telling me that I needed to break out and stop thinking about games, even if it's my passion because they think my first and foremost priority is to 'mature up'. Well, I'd LOVE to spend some money and get into activities like going to gyms, but there also comes the tendencies that usually if my mother found out the deals I made, she'll ask in great details on how I made that deal, and if I did something that sounded to her like I was being... 'suckered' into a bad deal, she'll call me a fool and start chastising me that I did not know about the world enough (heck, that thought to attempt gym-ing is to first break away my 'always stay at home' stuff and learn more about the world!). Overall, just made me feel horrible for making such a bad deal.

I think I've spoken enough, but I have this nagging feeling that maybe my parents, especially mother, are right. From what you've read about my life, what do you think? Am I still being a Basement-Dweller, and do you think it's such a hopeless case? I still want to keep my passion on video games, but I don't want to look like a loser like that trope.

Oh and that's not even touching about my issues about starting a relationship or friendship, outside just office stuffs...

Short answer; yes, by the internet definition.

There is time to improve though.

edited 15th Oct '15 7:25:18 PM by Stolen_Moment

Try imagining how far the universe extends! Keep thinking about it until you go insane.

But by the real world definition he's not. First off, he's not even in a basement. Secondly he's got a full time job, that automatically disqualifies him from Basement-Dweller status.

"Allah may guide their bullets, but Jesus helps those who aim down the sights."

Well, sometimes the internet describe a Basement-Dweller CAN have a job, but it's usually the mundane ones. Like store clerk or salaryman. Well... I'm a developer who helps out project development. Sound like a salaryman level?

Sometimes when job was being dissatisfying and a chore instead of an enjoyable job for me, I resigned, but two times I did that, I committed the mistake that I did not prepare for the next job, just in case, so sometimes I have periods that I do not have any incomes, only spending time looking for jobs.

In that whole time, I keep getting reminded by my parents (especially mom) about that mistake (sorry, it's kind of ) and to rectify that I need to... well, stop playing. Try to look for other things. Watch some soap operas as they sometimes have daily life happenings (hey not all soap operas are cheap, senseless drama), but basically, she kept reminding me that I am so lacking in social graces and watching them would help me improve. Well, um, yes, but I still needed actual practices (instead of just learning from watching) to improve, and my social circles are... rather limited. Just online friends, old high school friends connected via Facebook... and hangout together are rather rare. Hangouts cost money, and at that moment I am quite poor with no incomes... so I couldn't risk things out.

Once I got my job, I swore to keep it no matter what and in case I resign, I should find the next job before... But sometimes I had the feeling that my mother just won't shut up about me being something of a Basement-Dweller as long as I like to play. At all. She thought it's just a child's actions, that adults only concern in work work work and no fun times.

So yeah, does it show immaturity in me if I keep playing, even if I do have my job and prioritize well in my job (when it comes to jobs, if I have a task, I'm absolutely NOT touching any games or funs)? AFAIK, a Basement-Dweller isn't just about 'live in basement, don't have a job', it also comes with a feeling of being socially awkward/challenged and being immature. Do you feel like I'm the latter?

Also I don't collect any memorabilias like pillow sheets, action figures, etc. Because I'm too poor for such expensive hobby (I mean, sure, I have my PS 3 and one day maybe saving up for PS 4. But memorabilias that are just for shows? No thanks.)

edited 15th Oct '15 7:40:47 PM by ChrisX

Well you have skills/talent at something (programming) and earn money.... the internet is dumb, in the past the stereotype popped up of living in the parent's basement because you're lazy or whatever, but reality doesn't really match up with that anymore since there was a big global recession and stuff and a lot of ordinary people cant get their own houses for longer, but the stereotype is still there.

But basically don't define yourself by stereotypes or internet speak, you're fine, you're making progress

I dunno man. Up until now, I really think my social skills hasn't really gone up. Like, sure, I might get a job somewhere. But, like I said, I'm just a developer that helps out other projects. I don't spearhead projects (or making one on my own) or lead people. Doing so would require better social skills and as I found out... I think my social skill is kind of lacking.

I've made mention that even as a developer/programmer, the salary I got is quite lacking, so for many times, my parents kind of provided for me, even as I cut off stuffs for savings. This is why I thought even if I have a job, if it's at that level for years (4 maybe), I might be stuck on the levels of jobs that the so-called Basement-Dweller is like, something like a salaryman. And that's... not a good way to get ahead in life. Or I may be wrong... You think?

"When I was a child, I acted as a child and thought as a child. But when I became a man, I put away childish things, including the desire to appear very grown up." -C.S Lewis, paraphrased

There's absolutely nothing wrong with having hobbies. In fact, I'd say it's detrimental if you didn't. You just have to balance them with job stuff. Also, you don't have to go to a gym to get in shape. There are plenty of body-weight exercises you can do at home with no equipment.

Swordplay and writing blog. Purveyor of weeaboo fightin' magic.

Welcome to the wonderful world of "FUCK ME IM 30". I think I will be seeing you in about 2 more years.

Mainly I'm considering on gym because at least in gyms I can actually meet and interact with people. My weak spot is that I lack contact with other people and has a hard time in talking with strangers that might not be so bad at all, I think that would let me expand my friend network beyond the usual 'job circle'. I just picked gym because it coincidences that I'm usually being called overweight (in truth I'm about at 85 kilograms to 90 kilograms. I guess I am.), so it's both get in shape and getting to expand social circles via direct contact (not just Facebook).

Unless gym is pretty bad for expanding social circles.

Body exercises are nice and I can definitely do it at home, but that won't help in my lack of social skills, it doesn't offer me practices with interacting with people and being social.

edited 16th Oct '15 2:32:11 AM by ChrisX

Nope.

"Allah may guide their bullets, but Jesus helps those who aim down the sights."

"The internet" is probably not a Hive Mind, but if it were, it is hard to define whom they would NOT call a "Basement Dweller" for the sake of trolling

If you want an example of a real Basement Dweller, maybe Osama Bin laden would be a better example

It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes

If you're that uncomfortable about the level of your social skills, you should probably seek therapy to help you to identify ways you can improve your situation from an unbiased third party.

Insert witty 'n clever quip here.

First, it's hard to objectively answer the "Am I a Basement-Dweller" question. Supportive people will say "of course not", trolls will say "lol yes". The stereotype really means different things to different people.

You have some traits related to the stereotype, but so do a lot of people. It doesn't mean your life is doomed.

Personally, I don't think you qualify if you have a steady job which you can hold.

Also, please do not fixate on not leading / not being "alpha male". Many people are not leaders. Are they all Basement Dwellers too?

I feel it may be not my place to comment on your mother's behaviour, but my parents also say I should stop playing the stupid video games - whenever I'm doing anything on my computer, regardless if it has anything to do with games. Seems to be a generational thing to me. I would also say it's important that you make your mistakes and learn from them. Soap operas won't substitute for it.

As for interacting with people IRL, meeting people with similar interests worked for me. Can't comment on gyms.

edited 16th Oct '15 4:57:42 PM by StyxD

The state of TV Tropes.

Well, leading and being alpha male are often seen in internet and success stories IRL to be the key of success. And no, it's not on troll or meme sites. Legit advice sites cite that it's usually those who can lead that will succeed. Y'know, things like sometimes leaders are not that great in hard skills, but has tremendous soft skills that they could lead their companies well and causing successes here and there, overall getting the means to have a fulfilling life.

I know sometimes I met Alpha-male wannabes, it's there in the community of competitive games (like MOBA games) where they feel like they are the best they demand their commands are obeyed or else they blame others for defeat, and only concerning about conquering the game than having fun, because "It's what competition is, you have to be aggressive and conquering like an alpha male to be victorious." If I met something like that, I will disagree, because I believe that being an alpha-male isn't exclusive with being a nice guy (Rather than Alpha Male, I see them as "Stop Having Fun" Guys).

Um... your parents did that? How old are you? I think I can understand if maybe you're college age or mid 20's... but like I said, I'm nearing 30...

I might have gone too far in saying I'm something of a Basement-Dweller, but this is mostly out of fear that perhaps I do not have enough social graces like my parents kept telling me.

This constant use of the term "alpha males" is kinda concerning... I'm curious what exactly these "advice sites" you mentioned are.

Anyway, no comment on the therapy advice?

Insert witty 'n clever quip here.

Stop stop stop using the term "alpha male". Get it out of your frame of thinking. It's a bullshit category mostly used by the kind of guys who spend lots of time writing viciously misogynistic rants and then wonder why they can't get any girls. The sooner you stop measuring yourself along those people's yardstick, the happier you'll be.

edited 16th Oct '15 9:27:06 PM by MidnightRambler

Mache dich, mein Herze, rein...

that. there are a lot of bullshit and honestly pretty toxic ideas about which yardsticks men should use to measure their success (and you see this a lot on the internet in particular, primarily propagated by insecure and/or highly mysogynistic/homophobic/insert whatever adjective men), and you do not want to use them. it will not only make things worse for other people, but for yourself too. do not pay any attention to people who use that term this way.

the measure of a man's worth is not by how many women he sleeps with or how aggressive/dominant he is. purge such ideas out of your mind.

honestly dude, if you have a steady, reliable job, even if not in a leadership position, you're already ahead of the curve.

at this point this mostly comes down to

1. "if my parents die off can i provide for myself and be a functioning self-sufficient adult"

2. "is there anything about myself that i'm legitimately unhappy about that isn't simply a bullshit societal expectation i shouldn't pay any mind to"?

if the answer to the first is yes, you're golden. if not, you can start working on that sooner rather than later. ideally as an adult, your parents' opinion and advice is not the end-all be-all. you have to be secure enough to be able to make your own decisions.

if the answer to the second one is yes (and from your statements it definitely seems like it is), you can also work on that.

i.e if you're insecure about your social skills, i would second 0dd's recommendation to go see a therapist and try to get some help.

edited 16th Oct '15 9:55:45 PM by wehrmacht

Do you live in a basement?

If Yes, then yes, you are a basement dweller
If No, then no, you aren't

edited 16th Oct '15 10:08:27 PM by PadurKaril

I'd rather the world betray me, but I won't betray the world.

OK lemme try my best to answer those...

1. I definitely think I could manage on my own in case my parents die, but at the moment with my job development... well I'm not sure if I would be able to climb up to the point that I have enough money to... well, provide a family. Not sure if staying single all the time would be a good idea. However I am a firm believer that I just want ONE soulmate, so I don't want to sleep with many women. Those 'advice' stuffs that I read in the internet also don't mention that I need to be a complete Chick Magnet, so yeah, just find one woman that truly is a good wife material, and then stick to her till the end. But even if that is the case, in the end I need to provide for my future family, and at this moment, I dunno if the salary of a non-leader would be enough to provide well (maybe wife will help, but what if she can't). So my mindset at this point is that "I need to be self-sufficient not for myself, but for other people that would be my family", and while I think if left alone with a job, I could fend for myself, I'm not sure about the future in case I get a family.

2. Something about myself I'm legitimately unhappy? Huh, that's a hard question. Right now I think I'm pretty content with myself, except maybe getting bigger income, or... the kind of job I truly want. See, as a gamer and having knowledge in programming, I think I would be better off in making games as a career. It's just that my talents are very narrow, I'm just able to program basics, when I once tried a game developer career using Unity somewhere... it blew to my face and I didn't pass (in which my parents thought because it blew in my face, I didn't have talent in it and should forget it). Likewise, even if I can program, I couldn't provide arts or other extras myself. This led to another thing I'm kind of unhappy: I feel like I don't have an artistic soul and overall lacking creativity. And probably my regret is that right now, it's too late to cultivate those: Have an artistic soul, be creative or program a game. People say 'start early' and I thought it's too late for a near 30 dude like me.

@therapy advice: .... Um... well it sure will cost money, and again, my parents will convince me that it's useless and a waste of money... I think I'm an easily convinced guy when it comes to my parents.

edited 17th Oct '15 2:08:32 AM by ChrisX

i think that for now, it might be a better to idea to focus on providing for yourself. it is not a bad or unnatural desire to want to get married and start a family, but atm i think you have other concerns like being unsatisfied with your profession.

it is never too late to learn how to code a game, create art, or do anything. some people switch careers very late. it's harder sure, but if you want it you can make the time for it.

and honestly, i think one of the biggest problems is you are putting too much weight into what your parents are telling you. like i said, you are 29. you are an adult. you can make your own decisions. you might be under their roof, but you still have a job and can spend the money from that job as you see fit. therapy is most certainly NOT a waste of money and is something more people should be in.

it doesn't seem to me that your parents are very supportive and that they have very narrow ideas of what success or talent are, so you should probably move out and be free from their sphere of influence as soon as possible. i understand that with housing being what it is now this might not be the easiest thing in the world, but i think it would do you good if you weren't under their roof anymore. if they were more understanding/supportive that wouldn't be an issue, but that isn't the case so far as i can see.

edited 17th Oct '15 2:14:44 AM by wehrmacht

This... gets a little too awkward, I have to admit. On one hand, what you say make a big sense. On the other hand, I... I can't seem to bring myself to call out my parents, mostly my mom, that their way currently aren't exactly supporting me. My mom can be a bit too much of a worrywart, but that's the way she is. Above all, they all worked hard to provide me and make sure I end up not as a complete failure, so I think I cannot be ungrateful for that. I want to believe that they are supporting me.

The problem is I think my mother is completely unconvinced that I am already an adult, thinking that adults don't play games majorly, adults majorly study (and by this, I don't mean education, but learning about the world, socialize, etc). She also has a tendency to tell bad news about the world. I mean, I know the world is not exactly a very sunny place, but she tends to think that telling good news are usually useless, and telling bad news are good for increasing self-awareness. But in the end, it all boils down to 'Keep your job by working harder and achieving more, not playing around.' Goes without saying that I like to keep my job. After two periods of not working (yes I experienced that), I know that it sucks when I have no income and I won't repeat the same mistake.

Okay, regardless... I still have no idea how to convince her that I am an adult, and I think I'm getting desperate to prove myself. I think it could be a bad idea.

Also... the need to socialize. I'm just saying, this is NOT something I need because my parents demanded so. From the way I see it, successful products are usually NOT one-man works. For instance, creating a game. I'm going to need MORE than 1 person, I need a team. No man is an island, right? This is where I feel the need to increase my social skills, if I have it high, I'll have an easier time to find talents to help me on my goal.

Wow, now this goes to talk from about Basement-Dweller into parental issues. I feel awkward...

It's not awkward. In fact, it's best to talk about these issues, in order to avoid feelings of defeatism and to abandon concepts such as 'alpha male' (whatever that is supposed to mean in these post-modern times).

I am just a few years younger than you, admittedly. But does it change much? All I wanted to say is that at least some people from the older generation seem to consider all "computer stuffs" (that are not work) as immature, trivial, and should at best cease completely. But in the world out there, it's not unusual for people around 30 to play video games, and the like. So don't sweat that point too much.

Does that imply that people in non-managerial positions don't have families? Because I'm pretty sure that's not how it is.

It's perfectly valid if you want a better earning job to better support a family, but the society at large seems enamored with leaders, extroverts, "soft skills" and so on. The important question is, do you want to be a leader and would feel happy being one?

That doesn't mean you don't have to work on your social skills, but it's not "a leader or a nobody" dichotomy.

But do you need to call them out? You earn your own money, right? That means you can spend it to try things you want to try, even if your parents don't approve. Even if you can't convince them that you're an adult - and I know it can be hard with some parents.

The state of TV Tropes.

My mother actually don't consider computers trivial, she DOES use them. There are some things that she doesn't touch like Facebook (And I don't either) and my dad LIKES to use Youtube or news sites. In other words, they don't see computer as immature (but using it as a way to relax too much when you should be working or studying to provide yourself and for your future... that's seen as immature). It's just that some of them can get very old fashioned. Like for instance, my mother still uses VERY OLD printers and sheet apps like Lotus, instead of moving on to Microsoft Excel. When I asked why not, older hardwares and softwares are bound to not get supported and hard to manage by, she said that she spent her years with those oldie stuffs and because she's old, she can't afford to learn new things.

Now I know that I'll get old one day, but I always thought that even if you're old, if you have the will to it, you can learn and master new things, saying that 'You're old' is just an excuse. But... I could be wrong, because I haven't experienced what it means to be old...

We kinda live in constant consideration that we are middle-low citizens, so we shouldn't be very spendy. This tends to seep into how I buy things.

Non-managerial positions will more likely struggle harder to provide for their family. They CAN provide, but it'll be a real hard task to manage. I guess I could find happiness if things like that went smoothly. So if I want some richness or leadership stuff, I guess it's to make my life and the prospect of raising a family easier, not all the glory or being enamored (Of course I'd do good deeds for others instead of hoarding it for myself, but still!). The less headache I get, the better.

Yes I did earn my money, but they seem to be convinced that if I cannot provide for them (I can provide for me though), I am still considered living under their providing and it's not wise or ethical to rebel and be overly spendy. This is also why they kept working their old ass off even when it's nigh time to retire: For my sake. This is also another reason why I want big income (with being leader position as a way to go), I want them to STOP tiring themselves for my sake and go have leisure time with retirement.

edited 17th Oct '15 4:32:34 PM by ChrisX

I wonder how Chris is doing now that he is approaching "fuck me, I'm 40" territory.

Optimism is a duty.