Rick and Morty

Yeah, I'm not trying to argue that Jerry isn't pathetic and annoying. Just that people tend to let that could them and leads to them Draco in Leather Pants-ing Beth, and especially, Rick.

Who's worse, Jerry, or Bojack Horseman?

Uhhhhh in a moral sense or a literary sense?

Because Bojack has done much worse things on a personal level, but he's a much more interesting and compelling character than Jerry.

Morally, Bojack. But as with having a backbone, Jerry's the worse.

I don't know who that is so I can't say.

Back in The '90s, he was on this very famous TV show called Horsin' Around. Don't act like you don't know his famous TV show.

Pretty sure he never saw that too.

What little of it still exists is on Netflix!

I'm not the best with current pop culture, let alone the 90s.

edited 21st Oct '16 4:22:49 PM by LSBK

To explain: The premise of Bojack Horseman is that the eponymous main character was an actor in a saccharine Full House-esque sitcom in the 90's (a Show Within a Show) and presently he's a total wash up and a complete mess psychologically.

Handle was just reciting the ending song which basically explains the premise of the series.

Both it and Rick and Morty are frequently considered the best adult cartoons at present so you see a lot of people talking about the two although ostensibly they don't have that much in common.

edited 21st Oct '16 5:27:59 PM by Draghinazzo

Sung by Grouplove, too!

Rick is an interesting foil to Bojack as an interpretation of the Byronic Hero.

I can maybe empathise with the disposition that Jerry looks worse than Beth, because, while the show does intentionally portray Beth as Not So Above It All to some degree, it generally enjoys dragging her through the mud over it a lot less often than Jerry, so she seems to come out of it more dignified and as the 'winner' a lot of the time, thus almost like the show it taking her side at face value.

Even a revolutionary show like Rick and Morty can't shake off the "Male losers are funnier and less mean spirited than female losers" mindset.

edited 22nd Oct '16 4:19:48 AM by Psi001

The Beth/Jerry stuff always felt more traditional than the rest of the show to me. They tried salvaging that in some of the season 2 episodes, but I'm not so certain they succeeded.

I'm more annoyed by the fact that the show seems to continuously validate their relationship on some level. I get that not every relationship is perfect and there are gonna be problems along the way but I really get the impression that their marriage isn't healthy fullstop, but every single time the unhealthy nature of their relationship is brought up it just ends with something bringing them together getting them to "kiss and make up" while never actually working out their problems like Jerry's lack of self-worth and Beth's dismissive behavior towards him.

Speaking from personal experience that sort of strategy brings temporary relief but isn't sustainable, you can only push the issues to the background for so long.

The show actually seems to make it a point that however miserable they are together they'd be even more miserable apart, which is...

That's correct as far as what I've seen (the episode with Rick creating the infinite tv channels from alternate realities corroborates that pretty well), and it fits with the general ethos of the show but it's really fucked up.

This is a show where the main characters ruin their native planet and teleport to a parallel universe where their parallel universe-selves died in an accident and they take their dead selves' places. But yes, the parents do have a bit of an unhealthy relationship.

As the infinite TV episode notes, Beth and Jerry would be infinitely more successful without the other. But "successful" and "happy" are not synonyms.

Granted, what makes you happy isn't always what's best for you.

What makes you miserable is even worse for you.

I'd argue that Jerry and Beth are perhaps the rawest portrayal of the themes of the show. Unhappy, miserable people who drag down everyone else with them. Rick clouds it to an extent with his Sci-Fi adventures, but Jerry and Beth are usually rooted in family life.

... And you guys are making me want to check out Bojack Horseman.

edited 25th Oct '16 9:53:12 PM by SilentColossus

Ehhhh, they try for that with Beth and Jerry, but they don't quite give it the attention it deserves. It's there in a subtle way, but I'd argue it's too subtle most of the time and is completely put on the backburner at other times.

edited 26th Oct '16 1:14:49 AM by Odd1

.... either one of the creators went through a broken marriage, didn't they?

It's a great show IMO, albeit one pretty different from Rick and Morty.

Rick and Morty IMO is mostly about extremely unconventional and creative takes on sci-fi/fantasy plots leading to some really interesting situations and hilarious jokes, largely carried by Rick's incredible charisma, interspersed with some surprisingly good drama every now and then. The whole sci-fi spin to the show also ends up adding a strong element of nihilism and existentialism because of how vast everything is and the relative insignificance of anything that the characters do on a grand scale. When Rick and Morty ruin the world they live in, they just find another one dimension where their counterparts died and simply take their place, almost like it didn't even happen, for all accounts it didn't even matter.

Bojack Horseman is a bit more like a traditional character-driven dramedy (excluding the fact that a lot of the characters are Petting-Zoo People), but it stands out because it's an EXTREMELY dark one. It's oppressive and unflinching in a way few shows dare to be, and I think that while it drives a lot of people away it's very brave because it isn't just based on cheap shock value.

In terms of their appeal, I'd say Rick and Morty is more comedy-focused while BH is more drama-focused. BH has jokes and comedy but Rick and Morty's are much funnier, Rick and Morty has drama but it's more sparse while BH has it much more consistently.

edited 26th Oct '16 12:59:04 PM by Draghinazzo