G. K. Chesterton (Or, The Thread of the White Horse)

Who else has read any of his books?

...who else has read any of his books besides the Father Brown mysteries? :P I own the complete series, as well as The Man Who Was Thursday, The Ball and the Cross, and Orthodoxy... I'm not entirely sure how much of what he wrote I've read beyond that, though.

I'm also trying to start trope pages for The Club of Queer Trades, The Paradoxes of Mr. Pond, The Ball and the Cross, and Manalive, but it's been a while and I'm not sure I remember them well. <_<

I've only read the Father Brown books, and I think a handful of his essays.

Here you go. Please enjoy yourself. I esp. recommend his poem The Sword of Surprise, IMHO one of the most spiritual poems ever written.

Chesterton rocks.

...that is an amazing link. Bookmarked. Thank you!

The Sword of Surprise is very good - the prayer of 'let the familiar catch me by surprise' is very Chestertonian. XD Do you understand the second verse? I lost track of the analogy midway...

I haven't read much of his poetry, unfortunately, so I don't have much to compare to... of what I have read, though, my favourite is very mysteriously not listed at your link.

The Man Who Was Thursday is really excellent, and I need to reread once I whittle down my current backlog.

I've also read some Father Brown stuff which seemed fine but for whatever reason didn't leave much of an impression on me. :/

edited 30th May '13 3:41:49 PM by Benluke

@Noa. You mean this one?

"Sunder me from my blood that in the dark I hear that red ancestral river run, Like branching buried floods that find the sea But never see the sun."

He feels that he takes his own circulatory system for granted and wants some distance from it so that he can appreciate the miracle of his body more appropriately.

The site I linked to is still a work in progress, they havnt finished scanning every work of his yet. As for The Last Hero:

"...To see this fair earth as it stands, to me alone was given The blow that breaks my brow tonight shall break the dome of heaven"

Very nice. I think George RR Martin would appreciate it.

As for The Man Who Was Thursday, who else could write an engaging meta-philosophical mystery thriller?

I've only read The Man Who Was Thursday and some of the Father Brown stories. Really must read some more.

Martin probably would! I love this particular line: Rains like the fall of ruined seas from secret worlds above. It just stands out to me as magnificent imagery.

I've never read anything remotely like The Man Who Was Thursday, so that question is one I can't possibly answer. :P

Yes you must. :D

The Club of Queer Trades is up. :D

I have only read Manalive and The Napolean of Notting Hill, but I loved them both. I must search out the rest of his work.

I recommend The Man Who Was Thursday. :D

I'm actually reading through the Father Brown stuff that's available on Project Gutenburg. Great stuff!

I read The Man Who Was Thursday in Deus Ex. Does that count? I know it's not the complete book though...

'Counts'? Counts toward what? :P

I'm curious now though how much of it is quoted. In what ways is Deus Ex similar, and what themes are they comparing?

:D

Wow, I forgot how great Father Brown is. ^_^

Wherever you find men ruled merely by mystery, it is the mystery of iniquity. If the devil tells you something is too fearful to look at, look at it. If he says something is too terrible to hear, hear it. If you think some truth unbearable, bear it.

Yes, I really liked that. I like Father Brown's little forays into philosophy or theology.

Well, the game's a conspiracy kitchen sink. Of sorts. And from what I understand of Thursday, it's about a (massive?) conspiracy theory.

Also, in the game, you play an agent of a secret agency (sort of) and you're trying to bring down a massively powerful organisation.

Game?

Finished The Man Who Was Thursday. I managed to figure out nearly every plot twist after the mystery of the strangely athletic geezer, with the only exception being the mob against anarchists. But I still really enjoyed it.

And I think I get what Chesterton was driving at in that last chapter or so.

Father Brown, and a couple of his novels.

Elaborate? :D

Oh gosh, it's been so long since July. I think I've forgotten. But next time I re-read that chapter I'll post my thoughts here.

I do remember Chesterton drawing a parallel to the suffering of the fake anarchists and the life of Jesus Christ. Specifically, that a loving God would have to experience life as a mortal so that He could legitimately say "I've been there." I think. Like I said, it's been awhile and I may be blurring another Chesterton book in there.

edited 6th Dec '13 10:53:40 AM by CorrTerek

Ha, I'm sorry - I completely lost track of this thread. >_<

That's an interesting idea, and I'll have to go back and read through it with that in mind to see how it holds up. I'm not really sure what I think of that chapter myself (other than that I love it and it ends the book perfectly, of course); I think I took Sunday's last quote as something like the capstone of his similarity to God in the book of Job, actually.

I went back and read the chapter just now, and things are a bit clearer for me. The six men meet Sunday and ask him why they suffered so much, why he played the leader for both Law and Anarchy. Instead of answering, Sunday directs them to Gregory, who has just entered. Gregory accuses them of having never suffered, of being a Law that has never been broken. "Oh, I could forgive you everything, you that rule all mankind, if I could feel for once that you had suffered for one hour a real agony such as I—"

Syme responds to this by pointing out their own sufferings, and says "So that the real lie of Satan may be flung back in the face of this blasphemer, so that by tears and torture we may earn the right to say to this man, 'You lie!' No agonies can be too great to buy the right to say to this accuser, 'We also have suffered.'"

Given this dialogue, I believe that Chesterton is saying that Jesus/God the Son had to become mortal, not only to die and in so doing absolve mankind of its sins, but also to provide a rebuttal to anyone, human or demon, who would claim that the Creator of the Universe did not know on a personal level what it is like to be a frail mortal, with all the concerns and trials that mortals face on a daily basis.

I especially enjoy how this interpretation holds true for both the theological aspect and the Law vs Anarchy plot of the book — Syme and the others have experienced many hardships in their quest, which will hopefully be both a comfort to Gregory and a lesson to the men of the Law.

This is a really hard chapter to discuss while trying not to spoil it.

edited 8th Dec '13 9:28:12 PM by CorrTerek

I've read The Man Who Was Thursday, The Ball and the Cross, and Orthodoxy (although that last one was years ago).

Anyway, I'm working my way through The Innocence and Wisdom of Father Brown right now. And it occurs to me that... well, Chesterton uses the same twist that a certain Agatha Christie play (and short story) used. And not only did Chesterton use it first, but his use of it was an even more thorough subversion of the mystery genre formula than Christie's was.

I'm amused at just how committed Chesterton is to turning his characters' and readers' assumptions upside-down.

More than that: as a grand finale, he often turns them right-side up once more ... in a way that puts them into actual perspective. Suddenly, the reader can see why his early assumptions were right in a way, when he couldn't before.

To take a sequence often found in the Father Brown stories:

• A: A supernatural, terrifying monster is responsible for a horrible crime!
• B: (upside-down) Not so fast! Turns out a human being was responsible, using this-worldly methods.
• C: (right-side up again) Not so fast! Something supernatural, terrifying, and monstrous really was responsible, after all: the mysterious human heart and our fallen human nature. You were right to be frightened.

edited 17th Jul '14 9:41:47 AM by Jhimmibhob