Gay adoption

[This post was edited out; it was about something since deemed irrelevant.]

edited 12th Jan '12 10:05:14 PM by HiddenFacedMatt

But... my post about breastfeeding was how you couldn't use it as an argument against gay adoption... o_o

Breastfeeding's actually relevant considering that the effects of natural breastmilk for a child is one of the few things that could be argued against male-male couples adopting that could at least have some sort of logic backing it.

Then make that argument. That's not what the thumped posts were about.

Well, I suppose the breast milk issue depends on how old the child being adopted is. No all babies that get adopted are newborns.

I while back I started a thread that was fairly critical of the notation of gay adoption], and was quickly shouted down for it.

I have reversed my position on the issue of late. It's not to say that the long term effects of same sex parenting shouldn't be questioned, but looking back I was being a dolt.

edited 13th Jan '12 5:30:23 AM by joeyjojo

Are there any good reasons why gay people shouldn't be able to adopt?

I'm really glad to hear it. Not just that you've changed your position but that the arguments convinced you and you were open to it.

It should also be noted that it takes giving birth for a woman to be able to breast-feed. An adoptive mother of an infant, probably won't be able to breast feed the infant any more effectively than any man, so whether there is a female parent in an adoptive family is somewhat moot when it comes to breast-feeding. Not to mention that there are plenty of lesbian couples who would want to adopt if they could as well.

edited 13th Jan '12 6:03:11 AM by TheGirlWithPointyEars

Except that's what we were discussing when it got thumped.

Basically it is possible for certain women to breast feed without having given birth or taking hormones.

Gay adoption should be allowed, but maybe check up on the kid a few years down the line to see if there was any damage.

Actually, I just went and checked this out, and while pregnancy certainly makes it far easier to breastfeed, a woman who hasn't been pregnant can also induce breast-milk, though it requires a lot more work (and sometimes medication).

The really interesting thing I found out is that some men are capable of producing milk and breastfeeding, too.

I shouldn't really be surprised by that; milk production is a possible side effect on some medications used to treat other things for both genders.

edited 13th Jan '12 7:52:41 AM by Drakyndra

Yeah, I did actually know about that male lactation thing, but I thought it too unlikely it was going to become something most men would consider in these types of situations. Likewise, even if it was possible I wouldn't expect most adoptive mothers to try lactation rather than bottle feeding given the difficulties. Which kinda makes the point moot and I will stop talking about it before I get thumped for being off-topic.

edited 13th Jan '12 8:22:41 AM by TheGirlWithPointyEars

As been mentioned before, whatever arguments can be made about same-sex adoption can be made against single parents too.

And anyway, one thing to keep in mind is that, as far as effects on children are concerned, adoption by gay parents should be compared not to being adopted by straight parents, but to not being adopted at all. It's not the choice of being raised by straight or gay parents, but between being raised by gay parents or in orphanage.

This also pokes another hole in the religious aspect of it (not that I think religion should be relied on for subjects like these anyway) in that these people act like a kid being raised by a couple whose love is condemned by a few bible verses is more of an assault on their religion than the same kid growing up in a country like China, where IIRC even calling attention to bible verses in public could probably get you arrested.

edited 13th Jan '12 8:51:01 AM by HiddenFacedMatt

I would like to point out that this same argument could be used against nearly any minority adopting a kid, also it ultemately validates the homophobic point of view, I understand the protection of the kid, but is not the parents fault and shouldn't be them that should be punished.

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Well homophobic aside they is clearly something the idea that children should have a gender balance in their upbringing. But it's safe to say that having two dads beats having none.

There is nothing at all to say that a lack of gender balance among parents causes any problems whatsoever. It's not as if the children will have no contact with adults of the other gender.

Have there been any studies done on the subject of adoptees of gay couples, out of curiosity?

[1] Plenty. Now try finding a study that can't be accused of being politically bias.

edited 13th Jan '12 1:22:58 PM by joeyjojo

That's a problem, true.

re: the breastfeeding problem for gay male couples, is it impossible to get a wet nurse these days?

This video focusing on homosexual parents as talked about by the child of a lesbian couple might add to the discussion:

That was a pretty awesome speech.

I should point out that he was't adopted but created through the black magic of IVF. That's a different barrel of monkeys.

edited 13th Jan '12 5:19:50 PM by joeyjojo

True, but I figured A) since that's one of the first things mentioned in the video I wouldn't have to point that out, and B) it's still about a homosexual couple raising children, thus, it's still very relevant.

Any discussion about gay adoption is completely connected to the same sex parents thing, as you can see from the discussions we've had in this thread.