The United States....as fuel exporter?:

Total posts: [20]
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1 MajorTom5th Dec 2011 06:30:19 PM , Relationship Status: Barbecuing
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2 johnnyfog5th Dec 2011 06:32:40 PM from the Zocalo , Relationship Status: They can't hide forever. We've got satellites.
It's logic like this that decreed Ireland didn't deserve potatoes.
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Wait really?

....man, if the states can cut down and stop importing from Saudi Arabia and Alberta...righteous. As long as we're not repeating clusterfucks like BP's, of course.
4 USAF7135th Dec 2011 06:35:10 PM from the United States
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This is why I say we aggressively invest in green energy development: so we can make a killing on the oil market while the gettin's good.
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scratching at .8, just hopin'
One way or another sustainability is going to be the cornerstone of the future economy. We're gonna have to go green if we want to stay in the green. So it's quite encouraging to see that oil consumption is dropping; let's keep it up, and get off the coal too while we're at it.
6 johnnyfog5th Dec 2011 06:45:36 PM from the Zocalo , Relationship Status: They can't hide forever. We've got satellites.
Yeah, but you know policymakers are just going to keep us burdened with oil, then break out the alternative energy once people simply can't pay the inflated prices. That could take a decade.
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8 RocketDude5th Dec 2011 08:41:55 PM from AZ, United States
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Can we export the Ethanol while we're at it? Barely anybody's using the damn stuff.

More seriously, how do we plan to get the oil to export? Unless I'm mistaken, we haven't found many new sources in the US after the 70's.

edited 5th Dec '11 8:42:56 PM by RocketDude

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9 Anthony_H5th Dec 2011 08:46:39 PM from monterrey, mex
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10 EarlOfSandvich5th Dec 2011 08:52:02 PM from the Palouse , Relationship Status: I LOVE THIS DOCTOR!
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[up][up] Isn't ethanol rather intensive and inefficient in its present state? I know Brazil can pull it off with sugarcane, but I'm not so sure about here at its present state.
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the article in OP is false

http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2011/11/is-the-usreally-a-net-petroleum-exporter-no/249269/

What the numbers mean is that we have more refining capacity than we need to supply our domestic needs. So, we import the crude oil, refine it, use almost all of it, and sell a percentage of it to the rest of the world.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2011/11/30/america_is_still_a_giant_oil_importer.html

The WSJ writes that "the U.S. sent abroad 753.4 million barrels of everything from gasoline to jet fuel in the first nine months of this year, while it imported 689.4 million barrels." But at the same time, we're importing about 9 million barrels of crude oil every single day.

edited 5th Dec '11 8:58:31 PM by PhilippeO

12 RocketDude5th Dec 2011 09:08:36 PM from AZ, United States
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@Earl: Yeah, and we apparently have a bit of a stockpile of it. Lobbyists have been pushing the govt. to put more of it into the regular pump gas.

edited 5th Dec '11 9:09:02 PM by RocketDude

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13 ohsointocats5th Dec 2011 09:09:31 PM from The Sand Wastes , Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Where's that fuel that MIT was working on that was made from genetically engineered algae that only requires brackish water?

Anyway, we can't export ethanol. 1) Ethanol doesn't transport well (which is why you only really see ethanol fueling stations in like the middle of Iowa) and 2) considering you get less MPG with ethanol and you only get 20% new energy when you make it, it's probably not even worth manufacturing at all.
14 USAF7135th Dec 2011 09:13:36 PM from the United States
I changed accounts.
Er... considering that my parents' company competed for a contract to load tanker ships bound for Europe full to the brim with ethanol, I think we do export it...
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15 Deboss5th Dec 2011 09:18:36 PM from Awesomeville Texas
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The U.S. is on track to be a net exporter of petroleum products

Weasel Words bolded for you.
16 ohsointocats5th Dec 2011 09:19:25 PM from The Sand Wastes , Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
[up][up] It doesn't transport well — it has to do with the water solubility. Oil is comparatively easy to export. I have no idea why Europe wants it.

Either way, if we're going to insist on ethanol, it might be better to distill it from something that's, you know, not a food source.

edited 5th Dec '11 9:24:14 PM by ohsointocats

17 RocketDude5th Dec 2011 09:37:56 PM from AZ, United States
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@Oh So Into Cats:

1. There is algae fuel on the way, it's just that it has a couple of hurdles (reliability of the production or something, for starters) and there's not much news on it.

2. There is cellulose ethanol (made from the plant stalks or something, which won't cut into food prices), but it's not much better.
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18 ohsointocats5th Dec 2011 09:49:12 PM from The Sand Wastes , Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The plant material left behind is still used depending on the farming method, so while it wouldn't cut into the actual food supply it would cut into production costs. It probably wouldn't be as bad, though.
scratching at .8, just hopin'
Ah. Disappointing. Thank you, Phillipe and Deboss.

Yeah, but you know policymakers are just going to keep us burdened with oil, then break out the alternative energy once people simply can't pay the inflated prices. That could take a decade.
Of course. It would be nice to think we'll keep our atmospheric carbon ratio under 500 ppm, but I'm an optimist.
20 Deboss6th Dec 2011 09:31:03 PM from Awesomeville Texas
I see the Awesomeness.
The refinery thing is one of the big parts. To put it simply, there are no new refineries. Nobody builds them, they just revamp old ones with new tech and replace broken down parts. So it's fairly cheap to send the stuff to the US for refining and cracking* and then ship it back out. It's similar to claiming that Japan is a car importer because it imports all the raw metals* .
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Total posts: 20
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