Zynga profits drop like a rock.

But... too much oxygen is toxic...

Video games are a bit of a 'waste of time' in the grand scheme of things but one might prefer them to offer a more rewarding experience than being virtual crack. Besides, World Of Warcraft is also evil.

Except [condescending response follows]. Because [sarcasm here]. You do understand [snark], right? POTHOLE TO SARCASM MODE

World Of Warcraft as bad as Farmville? Really? (Sure, advertisements can be as bad as Farmville, but that's not even the same medium. Usually.)

edited 9th Nov '11 1:50:44 AM by feotakahari

That's Feo . . . He's a disgusting, mysoginistic, paedophilic asshat who moonlights as a shitty writer—Something Awful

^I didn't say it was as bad. Just that it does the same bad thing.

Someone who slaps you in the face and someone who stabs you have both committed acts of violence, but they aren't equally bad.

Infinite Tree: an experimental story

World of Warcraft, and most others, don't build their business model around exploiting people who will ruin themselves for the game. That constitutes a big, qualitative, difference in my mind. They may use some of the same conditioned-response elements, but the only thing they really want you to do is keep playing ( and paying the monthly subscription ). I'm pretty sure if some kid spent 10K of their parents' money on World Of Warcraft, Blizzard would eventually refund it.

Home of CBR Rumbles-in-Exile: rumbles.fr.yuku.com

I severely doubt that, unless there were potential lawsuits (that would go nowhere) or a chance for some good "aren't we a cuddly wuddly corporation?" type PR.

They're a business. Businesses are in it to make money. They attract customers by marketing. Marketing relies on psychology - i.e. creating/taking advantage of an emotional response to the product. Particularly evident in media (see the explosion filled trailers of action films that cater to people's visceral interests), but true anywhere.

My name is Addy. Please call me that instead of my username.

Dude, World of Warcraft has had far more addicts spending far more money than Farmville ever did.

The emotions of others can seem like such well guarded mysteries, people 8egin to 8elieve that's how their own emotions should 8e treated.

World Of Warcraft is a subscription model, where I voluntarily pay money every month to continue playing the game. There are additional services I can pay for, like moving characters between servers or buying cosmetic items, but none of it directly impacts my ability to play the game. The addictive behavior is more related to time spent than money spent, except as Real Money Trade is concerned (which Blizzard condemns).

Zynga and related casual games, on the other hand, deliberately entice players to open their wallets and cough up cash in order to make in-game progress. Sure, there are ways to make the same progress without spending money, but they all involve getting lots of "friends" to join your team and constantly click on all the updates and requests they send each other. Your choices boil down to: (a) Spend money; (b) Recruit friends and flood their walls with requests; (c) Accept that you'll be unable to make significant progress.

I'll be honest, though, I found Farm Ville, Mafia Wars, and even Frontier Ville to be entertaining in a mindless kind of way, and played them for quite a while, even though I eventually found myself heartily bored. What finally broke the camel's back, though, was the constant desyncs and other bugs in Frontier Ville, after which it came to a head and I just blocked all the apps. I never spent any significant amount of money on the games, at least.

I have nothing against Zynga, but the formula of offering artificial roadblocks to progress that can only be overcome by spending money or pestering your friends (or by friending literally hundreds of people that you don't know just to get free clicks) just gets really annoying after a while. And why in the hell do all the games have to post to the wall anyway? Once someone's your neighbor/mafia member/whatever, why can't all the message-passing be done internally to the game so I don't have to click on eighty freaking wall posts every day? Requests aren't a useful tool either because it's one per person per app per day.

Sorry, got carried away. Sort of on topic, I don't rejoice that Zynga is losing profits, but I do feel that they need to offer a more compelling product for people who don't like mindless clicking.

Oh, and before I go, I'll leave you with a few more doses of epicosity: [1] [2] [3].

edited 9th Nov '11 12:47:41 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

The thing is, I don't see what's so morally reprehensible with using friends as a resource in something that likes to call itself "social gaming" (which is has overlap with, but isn't the same as, "casual gaming")

"Never let the truth get in the way of a good story." Twitter

It's probably negative feelings of a bunch of other companies attempting to hop onto a new ship that Zynga sailed with mixed with the fact that Farmsville is a relatively new innovation as far as "social" games go and needs some refinement that will only come from a variety of developers taking their hand with such an idea.

The emotions of others can seem like such well guarded mysteries, people 8egin to 8elieve that's how their own emotions should 8e treated.

well, there's friends, and then there's tons of random people you've added purely to progress in the game.

XP granted for befriending a giant magical spider!

Fighteer: That's a big reason why I never got into any of the Zynga games myself, despite plenty of people I know on Facebook playing them; I get enough spam from them as it is, I wouldn't want to return the favor. :D That and I hear Harvest Moon and even SimFarm are better than freaking Farm Ville.

edited 9th Nov '11 4:17:51 PM by lee4hmz

online since 1993 | huge retrocomputing and TV nerd | lee4hmz.info (under construction) | heapershangout.com

Is it bad that I don't feel one way or the other about this? I mean, Mafia Wars is fun after a few good knocks to the head. With a golf club.

Sounds like forming a raid party in an MMO.

"Never let the truth get in the way of a good story." Twitter

Hardly.

A raid team thats going to be worth a damn is usually formed from one or a few closely allied guilds. And spends week after week practicing together to get their strategies and teamwork down. Pug Raids arent raids, theyre me-toos running old, outdated, nerfed content for free loot .

It doesn't change the fact that you probably never met a bunch of those cats before y'all started practicing. The only difference is that after you make the agreement, as you just said, one requires an overabundance of commitment and man hours while the other requires none.

"Never let the truth get in the way of a good story." Twitter

The reason Zynga wants you to invite friends to progress is so that they have more people to spend money on the game when they realize that invited friends doesn't cut it and after a certain point paying money is the only decent way to progress.

That's not really like raiding in World Of Warcraft.

I'm sorry, but getting fifty people you don't know to friend you so you can mindlessly click on each other's wall posts is not quite the same thing as World Of Warcraft raiding.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

If anything, its more like a 5-man Pug. You dont care about any of them, you'll likely never check how their life is. You just want to profit off them.

Generally, you don't want to raid with people who you don't trust to some extent. Because otherwise it's just a waste of everyone's time.

Also you don't get epic loot nor get to kill big-ass dragons.

I've never heard of this so called "World of Warcraft" but I am sure it is utter heresy.

That being said, theres nothing quite like a night of running a premade scenario group with your favorite guildies in Warhammer Online and melting some Destruction face.

It also beats the hell out of whatever sort of game "Farmville" is (Heresy simulator?)

edited 9th Nov '11 10:51:52 PM by anathame

I suppose the upcoming 40k MMO is heresy of an even higher order then, as it may mislead the faithful.

I'm not terribly impressed with what I've seen, and have recommended that the devs be burned at the stake.

I have yet to get a reply from GW.

Edit- Grammar fix

edited 9th Nov '11 10:57:30 PM by anathame

Aren't they the root of all heresy, though?

Like I said, the execution and follow through is entirely different due to hours spent and skills needed, but I still don't know what's so morally reprehensible about getting together with some people you don't know to waste some time in a way that causes a dopamine release.

Or are you you guys trying to tell me that you've personally met with all the members of a particular guild before accepting membership?

And before someone brings up the drug comparison to answer my "what's wrong with this" question, if a drug user*

is not hurting anyone and has a net positive contribution to society, why do you care about what they do in their free time?

"Never let the truth get in the way of a good story." Twitter