Black And White Morality

Is this considering fiction, or reality?

If it's fiction, Black-and-White Morality is ok, if you like to see squeaky-clean heroes against unequivocally unsympathetic villains across the board, but personally, it isn't for me. The more flawed the heroes are, the better the story, and the more realistic they tend to be, in my opinion. I might lean towards Black-and-Grey Morality, but Grey-and-Grey Morality can be equally enjoyable for different reasons, as it keeps the suspense a lot better, since it's not always clear who the winner is going to be, and characters can switch sides much more easily in such conflicts. Black-and-White Morality just seems childish, and you can get a lot more range out of your characters with Black-and-Grey Morality, or Grey-and-Grey Morality.

If it's real life, there are many arguments supporting moral absolutism which have been made by philosophers throughout history, but it's not something which I personally subscribe to. If you're going to go by the traditional greyscale model, every action has its place and purpose, and your reaction to it should depend on how you are affected by it. Recognize that what benefits one group is not necessarily good for the other, and that what the "good" action entails is dependent to a degree on where one's responsibility ultimately lies.

Basically, the discussion here is a matter of responsibility, and whose well being you are ultimately responsible for. The problem with Black-and-White Morality is that is overextends your responsibility to others to include everyone to the same degree, and it precludes a certain amount of self-interest which drives all of us. The truth is that, like it or not, there is a hierarchy of those who people need to take responsiblity for, and that is what we would need to figure out before assigning an objective view to the situation.

edited 12th Oct '11 4:03:52 AM by tropetown

What about White and Grey morality?

More range than Black-and-White Morality, as it at least allows for some complexity among the villains, but not quite realistic (read: cynical) enough for my tastes.

edited 12th Oct '11 4:02:43 AM by tropetown

Anti-Hero and Anti-Villain; Hero Antagonist and Villain Protagonist are some tropes which tend to complicate things.

This one is very fond of White and Gray Morality! Then again, this one is quite idealistic. She thinks that Humans Are Bastards in real life and has no need for it in fiction

edited 12th Oct '11 11:28:52 AM by Beholderess

Humanity in Real Life is a Morality Kitchen Sink. Such is the notion for one is born a blank canvas, let to make their own characture which morality be link to. A person can be a staint, a sinner or (most common) something in between. Such is the notion of humanity.

I believe most of humanity is Humans Are Good, with exceptions so The Same But Less mixed with Lawful Stupid.

I believe Humans Are Good but power is corrupting, and desperation justifies many things that are otherwise considered evil.

This one would rather not explain why she believes that Humans Are Bastards, as it never leads to anything but pointless arguments, and is a bit offtopic anyway.

Speaking on topic, whether this one acknowledges shades of gray or not depends on what sort of gray we are talking about. If it is "some actions are better than others" and "some wrong actions are worse than others" - certainly yes. If it is "some actions are both wrong and not, in different proportions" - then not. Hmm, not sure if it makes sense, but to this one, less wrong is less wrong, but less wrong is not more right

There is Black and White. And an infinite shades of gray in between. We're pretty much some shade of gray, in one way, shape or form. Some are lighter than others, some are darker.

^^ Good points. Desperate parents may stoop to things they would normally abhor in order to feed their children. I don't view the thief who stels food to survive the same way I view the thief who steals a plasma-screen TV so they can watch the playoffs in style.

edited 12th Oct '11 12:00:14 PM by pvtnum11

There really is no "absolute" anything on a Universal scale, be it evil or good, because the absolute value is dependent upon an individual. Morality is not found in the Universe; we have no evidence of the Creation as a whole giving a shit about what we individually perceive as right and wrong. And even those values are reliant upon the observer.

That said, mankind recognizes flaws far easier than it recognizes virtues; therefore, it's not unreasonable to posit that the most realistic morality to apply to mankind is Black and Grey. If you are more cynically disposed, it's probably easy to see it as just Darker Than Black.

edited 12th Oct '11 1:35:22 PM by Korochun

I think that humans are good in relation to other species; we're the only ones with moral codes and that try to live by said moral codes. All other animals are always raping and killing and raping each other without stopping, but we can see that killing and raping and killing are bad.

When people deliberately discard the notions of morality, they can theoretically be considered more evil than animals because they have the consciousness to choose. But even then said people are the minority; even sociopaths acknowledge morality, so people with absolutely no standards are not as common than one thinks. And even then, there's no guanrantee that they'd be evil.

I believe in Black-and-Grey Morality.

edited 12th Oct '11 6:02:20 PM by SavageHeathen

I consider evil highly unusual, so I don't like stories that portray large masses of people as evil. Then again, my definition of evil is relatively narrow—I consider Neutral Selfish people genuinely neutral, even though most of the people I talk to classify them as evil.

edited 12th Oct '11 9:28:49 PM by feotakahari

Mostly this.

If you ask me how I think the world is, I'll say it's Black-and-Gray Morality. If you ask me how it objectively works, I'll say it's Gray-and-Gray Morality, because what is objective about morality is that it's subjective...

@MRDA; sorry for the late reply. I didn't really expect anyone to respond to me. Anyway, I could have explained that more clearly; I believe that there are situation where right and wrong are absolutely clear. But those situations happen far less than a typical black and white thinker would perceive. And being unable to think in any terms but black and white makes you too rigid to judge when a lighter punishment is needed, or even judge correctly whether it's needed at all. Or how praise someone deserves.

im in a similar boat with the OP.

my mom says i see everything in black and white yet thats complete bs.

it just seems like i see it like that because i vocalize my hate and love in a very polarized way, and I tend to group "less evil and more evil" when portraying two sides. because if everything is gray, one side has to be a lighter shade of gray, right? I believe that in most conflicts one side is more guilty than the other, but that doesnt make it black and white. it just means one has more to answer for. I never got how that translates into black and white but waht the hell