Person Of Interest

How do you do Person of Interest WITHOUT the Machine ? Maybe they mean that the Machine as a character in it's own right ?

I think Samaritan isn't bad as much as innocent. It has, literally, no morals.

No, apparently if the execs had there way how they got the numbers would never have been revealed or defined. Reason 218,953 why network executives should just fork over the money and keep their delusions of adequacy to themselves.

edited 15th May '14 8:03:05 PM by tricksterson

I really wish that they hadn't killed the Vigilance guy off. Unless they end up pulling one out of nowhere and say he was wearing a bullet-proof vest at the time, or something (because he was only shot in the chest), he was most likely Killed Off for Real, because as we've seen, the creators aren't exactly too squeamish about killing major characters off.

I just feel like they hadn't explored everything they could (or should) have with a character that basically just started developing for real, and I think they could have done a lot more with him after that point. I also really liked Vigilance, and what it brought to the show. If nothing else, it served as a good Well Intentioned Extremest/yin-yangish counterpart to the Decima types. And, I mean, come on, a Well Intentioned Extremest who never actually killed anybody we care about, had a sympathetic backstory, and was only the victim of a bit of misguided Patriotic Fervor? How could you hate somebody like that? It also helps that he was actually technically right, his methods were just a bit questionable to say the least, and he was almost like a good Anti-Hero who only took the "anti" part of it a bit too far.

I started thinking about this as soon as it was revealed that Vigilance was just a fraud, for lack of a better word: Maybe they will make it so he survived, escapes, begins recruiting, and then starts his own legit Vigilance organization, perhaps even under the same name, and ends up being the actual leader of it this time, while still going about doing the "dirty work" (for lack of a better term) alongside his comrades (which was a large part of his character appeal, at least to me), which would probably entail doing everything in his power to take Samaritan down, before turning his sight back to Northern Lights.

Nah, probably not.

edited 15th May '14 11:10:08 PM by Little_BIG_Head

I think he'd lose any "good" or "hero" status the moment it showed he was a hypocrite really who didn't just take the anti too far. He was LONG past that route. Such as when he killed one of people in his own group when they tried to handle things democratically. He long jumped into Knight Templar territory. Actually, my favorite moment with his hypocrisy, "Here is evidence I got from illegally reading your emails that you illegally read emails."

That said, I do find it a shame that he died even if it makes complete sense that he did. I did like him in a way & pitied him big time, though I cannot deny anything that he pulled.

edited 15th May '14 11:24:15 PM by Prime_of_Perfection

Which episode was it that he killed a member for trying to be democratic ? I remember he killed on for being FBI and the guy he killed in his first appearance but I can't place that.

I think Collier's death works becuase, yes, there is more they could do with him, but he had done enough that it doesn't feel like a wasted character. Besides, with Samaritan up and running, there's no way that Vigilance could keep in business.

One other thing that's pretty sweet (accident or no). On our Character page, for Greer we have:

Meaningful Name: "Greer" is a middle ages variant of "Gregory", which means "watchful, vigilant".

That means a little more now,

edited 16th May '14 2:34:34 AM by Anteres

This very episode, Deus Ex Machina. In the flashback when it showed him interacting with the group. One of them wanted to put things to a vote and so forth about how things would go. He shot the guy and asked everybody else what their opinion was on where they should lead.

edited 16th May '14 2:38:28 AM by Prime_of_Perfection

He was an agent provocateur - FBI, undercover, which is why he got shot, not because of the desire for a vote. That said, eh, he survived far longer than he had any right to as it was, and with vigilance in pieces....

Greer must have not cared much whether he lived or died as long as he was entertained, because that whole trial was just not a safe place to be, which is interesting - he is in many ways quite like Root. - Both true believers.

Ive been reading interviews with the creators and one of the things they are teasing is that season 4 will involve the gang having to maintain covers. That should be just awesome - will we see doctor Shaw again? ;) Because I figure she will probably be the one who finds that the most difficult.

edited 16th May '14 3:07:35 AM by izeintime

Out of curiosity, why do you guys think they named it Deus ex Machina? Even for tropers, labeling it as a Diabolus ex Machina episode would be a bit of a stretch, as there was plenty of establishing stuff for pretty much everything important that happened, and sure, there were surprises, but I can't think of a single thing that came out of nowhere that made things better or worse. Maybe they did it so that people who noticed the name of the episode would assume that everything would be solved out of nowhere at the last minute, and then have it turn out it would be anything but that? Or maybe I'm just overthinking it, and they just meant it as the latin translation for "god out of the machine", and didn't even intend for it to have a double meaning.

Also, this might belong more in the discussion section of the main page, but did anybody else find Greer's plan for Vigilance (especially considering it was started a few years in advance of its major importance) a little Batman Gambit-ish?

edited 17th May '14 3:55:26 PM by Little_BIG_Head

A bit but he could have used them in other ways. I'd say it started as an operation without a clear end-point until later.

As for the name, I think it's just literal. A new 'god' came from a computer. It was actually telling us the end; Samaritan would come online. Just they hid the literal in the metaphorical. Quite clever.

Agreed on the Ep name.

No, I don't think so. Decima was trying to get their hands on The Machine before, and they did, in a way. Finch, however, set up a Batman Gambit of his own, forcing Decima to seek an alternative.

Say, how many episodes do you think Season 4 will get? 22~23, or 10~13 like most 40-minute series?

I'd assume 23 episodes since that's how many they had in Season 1, 2, and 3.

Also, really need to re-watch Deus Ex Machina just because I'm blanking on everything that was going on in the flashback now.

Yes...but it's very, very, VERY, rare for 40-minute series to get more than 13 episodes per season. The number of episodes reminded me of LOST. It had 25, 24, 23 episodes for the first 4 seasons, it decreased to 14 episodes, and back to 18.

Sucks for them. Doesn't change my reasoning though. If it does change, that'll sucks, but that would have less to do what I think will happen and more to do what actually happens. I'm just placing confidence in the trend continuing, nothing more or less.

The thing I am way more curious on though is how they'll be able to return to the procedural elements.

edited 20th May '14 2:33:50 AM by Prime_of_Perfection

Po I has a really good viewership. I don't think they'd throw off a successful formula without good reason, especially if the showrunners are planning a max of five seasons.

Yeah, but Lost had an even bigger viewership and following by the time season 3 ended.

But there's no reason to think they'll change the number of episodes. They could make it six episodes. They could ask for thirty six. But there's no word of it yet, so why worry it might ?

I'm hoping they end up doing at least six seasons, and, you know, a movie, just for good measure. Six seasons and a movie.

Actually, hearing that they're planning on doing only 5 seasons kind of bummed me out, because I was hoping it was going to be a long runner, even at the possible risk of Seasonal Rot. There are about a million different directions that this show could take.

edited 21st May '14 12:56:15 AM by Little_BIG_Head

Just in case anyone haven't heard about it yet, according to Wikipedia, Season 4 will have 23 episodes. Nice.

I had assumed they would but still good news

Do we have a date for it's return ?

The season 4 premiere is at September 23, apparently.

Oorah.

And the first episode of season 4 is entitled Panopticon. I can't wait.

Random bit of trivia: Even with the schedule changes, not a single PoI episode has dropped below 10 million viewers. Nice to see a very intelligent show being this successful.

edited 19th Jul '14 10:06:35 PM by Little_BIG_Head

Sweet