Breaking the Animation Age Ghetto

This is something I have always wanted to do. I see such great potential in Western Animation (Anime is already past that preconception) and I would assume many of you would say the same. It's a shame to see it restrained by this juvenile and irrational prejudice.

So, if you were given a top-notch animation studio, a bottomless budget and complete creative control, what would you do to break this?

I have my own ideas on where I would take Western Animation, but I want to hear the good folk of the fora first. Smash away.

A very graphic Dante's Inferno animated film...all my other projects are more or less riské but this one wouldn't even try to give a sh*t about the ghetto

My MSN buddy has an idea for a CGI movie/series he'd like to make. He still has a lot to go through and it probably won't become real anytime soon as he is still learning 3D animation. However, his story is very interesting and I'd like to see it come to the big screen. Since it's very graphic, I would expect it getting a lot of bad rep from Moral Guardians, but he never intended making it for kids.

I would release a cartoon of a popular genre, sneak some deep and dark elements, and release a symbolic and semi-controversial ending.

Animated Arnie movie or something its likeness . Sadly, if this isn't just about personal wish fulfillment, you need something around the Lowest Common Denominator to get the interest of people who would normally dismiss it.

edited 3rd Jul '11 8:37:18 AM by Cider

I wouldnt make this deep and dark animation, i would probably just make cartoons that will be enjoyed by adults and children alike.

I would hire Greg Weisman to make more episodes of Gargoyles.

Me. I would do both. Produce something for the people already in the mindset that animation is for children, and something else that doesn't restrain itself from other subject matters.

Personally, I don't care too much about "breaking the ghetto." What I would try to do is simply make something I would like, and that I think others would like as well. If its fun and compelling enough, people will watch it no matter who its aimed at.

That being said, I'd probably go for true-to-the-source animated adaptations of the D'Artagnan cycle, Sherlock Holmes, or the Bible, that actually cover the entire book(s) from beginning to end.

To be honest, I'm not sure if the ghetto can be broken. If you make a cartoon which indulges in some manner of ultra-violence or something like that, there will inevitably be a segment of the audience which will become upset that a "childrens' medium" is being used for adult entertainment. It's a preconception that would be very tough to overcome.

That said, the effort has to be reciprocal. There is a certain type of animation fan that has to stop claiming that just about all animation is actually for adults because they're embarassed to be watching a childrens' cartoon. They're a pretty small minority but I think they're part of the problem; they seem to want strictly divided cartoons for adults and cartoons for children rather than cartoons that everyone can enjoy, which are really what are required if the ghetto is to be "broken".

To me. The way I see it is that you'd need a miracle(as well as the product of animation) in order to break the ghetto. So far, most people are trying to break the ghetto but however things get in the way of that. But the way that I think the ghetto should be broken is that animation should be taken seriously for the art and entertainment over big bags of cash.

As well as not following the cliched crap that we've seen NUMEROUS of times. But aside from this. I do have a script for an R rated animated feature(as well as short film which will be done in Storyboard script). Which I can hope can break the ghetto.

Well, all I'm expecting for now is a mature animated film that can probably be at least as didactic as the literary masterpieces that are typically read in high school English classes, even though some works aren't meant to be as such.

The ghetto influences everyone around me (as a result i've been called a pussy MANY times), so I've gotten used to it. I watch what I want and I respect that others don't. The ghetto is so ingrained into public conciousness, I actually think it might be impenetrable

I would create an R rated 2D animated movie, advertise it as such, and have it play in theaters. Then if the movie gets a lot of controversy from the Moral Guardians, I would volunteer to go onto a news channel or a talk show, and debate about the topic.

Of course during the debate, I would refrain from expressing my philosophy that children should be exposed to mature themes sooner then later, since that really wouldn't help.

edited 3rd Jul '11 4:52:29 PM by SorrowsNeptune

I would make an animated show depicting without pity or restraint the horrors of modern combat. Realism is rarely kid-friendly, and so the characters will swear often and severely and violence will not be censored in the least. I'm talking about more than just showing blood and gore and people getting shot. I want to show the sheer abject suffering and pain it can cause, the element of psychological and emotional trauma.

Not simply subject matter that is unsuitable for kids, but themes and complexity. Politics, arms trading, genocide. And morality. This work would very much transcend the worn good-guy-bad-guy dichotomy. And unlike a lot of modern adult animation, it would take itself seriously. Or rather just be serious, as opposed to comedic or raunchy or satirical.

"So, if you were given a top-notch animation studio, a bottomless budget and complete creative control, what would you do to break this?"

I wouldn't try to break anything. I'd just give the money and studio to John Kricfalusi and tell him to make some cartoons.

I think part of the problem with the ghetto is that people conflate it too much with a different trope entirely.

I'd make a Transformers show for adults.

And by that I don't mean the stupid "mature" stuff that adult Transformers fans often clamour for, like a ridiculous amount of gore, or weird robot-porn. (Somewhat of a tautology, that phrase.) I mean I'd make a twenty-six episode series with very strong continuity and awesome action, but also a decent amount of quiet drama scenes that you basically never see in any Transformers media.

Characters would die sometimes, have more-than-one-episode arguments, philosophical rambles on the nature of war, etc etc. Basically I'd take everything I know about real-world history and mythology, and apply it in the writing of a cartoon intended to sell small plastic toy robots.

That probably says something about me, really.

For me, the ideal standards for a genuinely "mature" cartoon have always been Gargoyles and the DCAU programmes.

That said, I think that animation could provide interesting new prospects for depictions of ultra-violence and the like. Nevertheless, I don't think there's much sense in making such a cartoon purely to spite the people who believe that all cartoons are for kids. I'd avoid doing that in this hypoethetical situation.

@Air of Mystery - So you'd basically make an American version of Takara's Transformers, then?

@rest of thread

Personally, I don't think the problem is our culture. I think the problem is animation fans themselves. They keep wanting things that would, in all honesty, be counterproductive. Case in point everyone wants every cartoon to have tons of violence, some hints of sex, and a continuing storyline, but there are a lot of cartoons out there where—by the sheer virtue of the premise alone—this isn't a good idea. Fans tend to think that what they want is what everyone else wants, and more often than not this simply isn't the case.

It would also help if fans weren't as ignorant of animation history and were more aware of what has and hasn't been done before, and with what results. Again, fans tend to revise history so that it fits their preconceptions. I see a lot, for example, that conflates the 70s with the 80s and pretends the 90s was when cartoons first started getting mainstream acceptance and started dealing with more mature themes. I'll admit I sometimes indulge in revisionist history too, but no matter who does it, you can prove any story wrong using actual documented data (up to and including the cartoons themselves).

I think ultimately though, what fans need to do is admit that cartoons really are for kids, and that any that are adult are a novelty more than they're a step in any sort of direction, and forcing cartoons away from their biggest audience is not only selfish, its destructive. Like how comic books hit the skids when they stopped being for kids and became an adult-readers-and-collectors-only market. I see the same pattern playing out in animation right now, and its sad.

I agree with this, but I'm not so sure about the point that animation is going the same way as comic books.

That said, I'm not really up on mainstream comics at the moment (or animation for that matter).

I like Moe Dantes' idea of adapting The Bible, entire, without Bowdlerization, one story at a time.

Except I'd make the first installment Paradise Lost, because there's absolutely no way for an Adaptation Expansion of Genesis 1-3 to top that. Then after Cain and Abel, the next installment would be The Book Of Enoch.

"I think ultimately though, what fans need to do is admit that cartoons really are for kids, and that any that are adult are a novelty more than they're a step in any sort of direction, and forcing cartoons away from their biggest audience is not only selfish, its destructive."

Artists would disagree with you, animation is an art form regardless of its target demographic.

"Like how comic books hit the skids when they stopped being for kids and became an adult-readers-and-collectors-only market."

I blame this on two things, trying to make comics "darker and edgier" even when it serves no purpose then trying to conform to the fads AND greed in targeting the expanded media and merchandise group for bigger profit margins.