General Sonic The Hedgehog thread

Some people happen to like extra content in their games.

Extra content is fine if it actually adds some depth to the gameplay. The Chao Gardens add zilch.

Apparently not, given the amount of use of the content others got out of the feature and it's various aspects.

Remember that there's a difference between content having no relevance to you, and that content not actually having relevance inherently.

edited 22nd Feb '13 5:01:17 PM by KnownUnknown

I did say "to each his own" earlier.

Except it does add depth to gameplay. Collecting all the Emblems and collecting the Animals(getting them all nets a free life) help improve the Chao. It also is necessary for 100% completion, and not really "extra content" at all. Padding, sure, but every level also requires you to find a Chao. They're heavily integrated in Sonic Adventure 2, and one of the best parts of Sonic Adventure 1. Also, both Adventure games have some fairly awful level designs here and there, so the Chao Garden helps to alleviate that.

Okay, well, in the case you're saying, it's the main gameplay that affects the extra stuff. I'm talking vice versa here.

Chao don't really scream Extra Stuff to me at all. Just a second part of the overall gameplay. Chao have been part of the Sonic plot before in general, so I see them as usually important characters(not in the current story, but as is) as long as the main gameplay affects them in general. Also, in the first Adventure, Chao are a major part of the story. Not as much in Sonic Adventure 2.

But still, I don't see how they're Extra stuff in general. Just a natural part of the gameplay as is, and designed that way.

Fore me, Sonic Adventure 2 was fun, but the C Hao gave me an incentive to come back to it. Heck, most of the cheats on early web sites were about chao customization than the actual gameplay. The glitch through the rock in the neutral garden still makes me laugh when I recall it.

The Chao aren't coming back. They were a glorified tech demo for Dreamcast's VMU. Best case scenario, maybe they throw us a freemium iOS garden if they realize there's demand. But they really don't belong in a Sonic game.

No one's forcing you to play the Chao Gardens, you know. In fact, they're pretty out of the way in both games.

You know what didn't belong in a Sonic game? Hoverboards. If we can have three of those games (the first of which was just okay and the third doomed from the start by being Kinect-exclusive), why not give the Chao some love?

edited 22nd Feb '13 8:08:33 PM by PhysicalStamina

That's different, that's a side-series. It is to the mainline Sonic games what Mario Kart is to Super Mario Galaxy.

Then what's Sonic and Sega All-Stars Racing?

Good question. The thing is that's still not a 'main series' game the way the console platformers are intended. I would have no issues with the Chao garden as a sideseries or in a side-series- hell, it would have vastly improved replayability on the Sonic Storybook Series- but it doesn't have a place in the main series that's intended to have sprung from the original Genesis games.

Like I said earlier, the Chao stages were never mandatory, so why not put them in for the people that want them? It's like complaining about hotels that have mints on the front desk. You don't have to take one, but the people that want one will.

I'm normally not one to post links in lieu of making an argument of my own, but really, this SSMB forum member not only sums up my main problem with the Chao "gameplay," but also provides an idea that would actually give me cause to care for the Chao.

Wasting developer time that could be better spent on more actual Sonic gameplay?

edited 22nd Feb '13 8:37:46 PM by Ronnie

That's not a bad idea.

I could say the same for Sonic Free Riders. All that money wasted on a game that was dead on arrival could've gone to making Sonic 4 better. OH WELL.

I never said I liked Riders series or SASASR. (...Alright, I do like the latter, but for non-Sonic reasons- namely, giving Ralph a non-crappy game.)

@Komodin: *slow clap* Agreed completely.

I never said I didn't like SASASR. I haven't even played it or its sequel yet (besides, I'm more focused getting Transformed, which is apparently an Even Better Sequel).

lol, nerd fights.

People like the Chao gardens. It's not something you have to indulge in. It's simply there in case you like that sort of thing, and has no bearing on the rest of the game. Oh, it eats up time to develop the "actual" game? I hate to break it to you, but the Chao garden is a part of the actual game. It's not mandatory, but I imagine it was always factored into the development. The time could have gone into Sonic's gameplay? Maybe they could have fixed one or 2 things up, sure, but I doubt the complete eradication of the Chao garden would have fixed up the more underlying flaws of Sonic Adventure.

Yeah, it's a silly escape from the main game. That's probably why so many people like it. I mean, I'm sure Adventure was fun and all that, but you know what? Playing the same thing over and over is dumb. The Chao garden adds in some replay value once you've gotten all the S ranks and found all the secrets.

edited 22nd Feb '13 9:38:52 PM by MrMallard

This.

Problem is, all you're doing is watching critters do things, with little to no input from the player whatsoever. I could just go to a zoo and do the same thing (and then get depressed from seeing the animals deprived of their natural habitats...okay, I could just walk around my campus staring at squirrels and get the same enjoyment out of it!).

Try drowning or throwing a squirrel in real life and see what happens.

Then obviously, not much time must have gone towards it in development. And really, if people enjoy that, how does that encroach on your pure SA experience? Does it really matter? You don't have to watch it or anything.

So... low on development time, not mandatory, a lot of people seem to like it... HOW is the Chao garden so bad? If you dislike it, then you don't have to use it.