General Sonic The Hedgehog thread

Oh IGN and their completely unbiased reviews, amiright?

Warrior to the very end! My tumblr, dood!

7.8/10 Too much water

I'll admit that in the past that I had no idea what I was talking about in regards to the Sonic community or at least how they were perceived. Over the years, I began to learn more about the fandom and I even believed some of the memes but I changed after seeing some reasoned analysis by Roger van der wiede, Nickonaquamagna and other Sonic fans. I am not sure if I am a wiser person now but I do know that the Sonic games are much better than what most people say.

"Eratoeir is a Gangsta."

It's just weird to see Sonic get a disproportionate amount of hate because of a few legit bad games (namely '06 and Rise of Lyric) and some mediocre games (4 and Lost World); yet other media that also have gone through rough periods (ie: Star Wars with the prequels, Sponge Bob with Season 4 and beyond), aside from the shows I learned that also got this, tend to not get this amount of hatred.

You know, I have to wonder why Pit is obsessed with this site. It’s gonna ruin his life!

I honestly believe a lot of the bashing is from generation x Mario/Nintendo fans who never liked Sonic just jumping on the opportunity once Sega was out of the hardware business.

I don't think we're going to see Sonic get more love for a while until all the Sega and Sonic fans start filling creative and critical positions, which I think is slowly happening, but we're still dealing mostly with those who grew up with a NES. It's old 80s kids putting down 90s kid. Kind of. Meh.

edited 23rd Aug '16 2:01:42 PM by StarOutlaw

You know, not for nothing, but people jump down their throats for their Omega Ruby/ Alpha Sapphire review, but they certainly rated that game higher than I would've since it was kinda bad in a lot of aspects.

You know, not for nothing, if you're that upset at them, you could just, y'know, not give them pageviews or traffic.

@GAP: Roger's videos are the best.

edited 23rd Aug '16 2:08:37 PM by Odd1

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For a while now I've been tempted to make parody reviews of other beloved classic games proving how terrible they and to extent their whole franchise are, using the same kind of logic actual reviewers use to discredit classic and current Sonic.

So kind of like the AVGN's earliest videos?

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I wouldn't know since I never watched much AVGN outside of cinemassacre, but I'll check those out.

I'd review old games I had played briefly as a kid but didn't get into, like Super Mario on SNES. I can remember never getting very far and the things that frustrated me though, and the main joke would rely around me stubbornly refusing to actually learn how the game is supposed to work.

That, and my legit criticism that classic platformers are really strict with how you're supposed to finish a level, as opposed to Sonic allowing more freedom of progression.

I haven't watched IGN's stuff in years honestly. I was just curious if the video was as bad as people saying it was and it was...certainly as bad as they were saying it was by a country mile.

That's what I always disliked about Mario now I think about it. No alternate paths of progression. I mean you can find levels like that in Mario Maker nowadays but good luck wading through the crap levels to find that.

edited 23rd Aug '16 2:41:51 PM by Ecrivan

Formerly known as Bleddyn And I am feeling like a ghost Resident Perky Goth

The best example would be Donkey Kong Country; it's critically acclaimed, but there's only ever one way you can finish a stage, any deviation gets you killed. It does have secrets to find, and even Mario games have secret exits and underground areas, but getting past certain obstacles usually feels the same.

edited 23rd Aug '16 3:13:44 PM by StarOutlaw

It's about the obstacles, not the exploration skill...

YO. Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie.

Which is kind of the whole point of the parody review; criticizing the game for all the wrong reasons. I can say DKC is a bad game because there's no freedom of exploration and extremely limited in options, but that's completely missing the point of the game. I'd be criticizing it on how one would judge a Sonic game instead of a DK game. I'm not right, and my opinion is flawed because I don't understand what makes a DK game fun.

A lot of reviewers seem to criticize Sonic games based on how they would judge a Mario game, or some such. You can say a Sonic game is too easy, but that's ignoring that the fun comes from exploration and finding ways to go fast through seemingly slow segments. You could say that it's poor level design because it makes you slow down, without understanding the challenge is finding ways to go fast and overcome slowness without being reckless and dying.

edited 23rd Aug '16 4:14:11 PM by StarOutlaw

but he was talking about Super Mario on the SNES (which I assume was referring to Super Mario World), which has TONS of alternate pathways and exploration, hell, alternate pathways was one of its main gimmicks.

Also, StarOutlaw you weren't able to get very far in Super Mario World? I mean, no offense, but that's probably one of the easiest Mario games there is, and I'd also say it's the least strict in terms of how you progress or how much time it gives you. Like, I was able to complete it with all 96 exits when I was a kid (whereas it took me years to be able to beat Sonic 2 without much issue). I'm curious what gave you so much trouble in it.

edited 23rd Aug '16 4:19:27 PM by Odd1

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To clarify, I never owned a SNES. I only played it a few times at an after school program, and I was like 6 or 7. I remember not being very excited, I just liked riding Yoshi.

Which just proves my point that people should learn the game before judging. I'm not going to pretend I wouldn't have a flawed opinion.

edited 23rd Aug '16 4:26:07 PM by StarOutlaw

Or they were referring to Super Mario All-Stars, in which some of the games aren't all that exploration heavy. The first three Super Mario games are a lot more linear than later ones.

Regardless, there is issues when comparing it to a very different type of gameplay. Of course, in some cases, (take Big's Fishing stages) it makes a bit of sense, since that one needed notes from far better fishing simulators. The other gameplay styles needed polish, obviously, but could easily take notes within the Sonic series to improve 'em(using just Sonic Adventure and Sonic Adventure 2 examples at the moment for what playstyles need improvement).

It's why reviewing a game on its own merits often gives a far healthier and useful review than doing one that is hated cause it's not like this other game at all. It's understandable why the reviewer dislikes the game they're reviewing and all, but they're also not telling us what the real issues are specifically, just making comparisons at best. It's more important to do more than just comparisons, but directly explain the problems with a game. Like if it's lacking in, say, good item management for an rpg.

I mean he just confirmed that that indeed was what he was talking about but whatever.

Well, that's fair enough. (I should note, I never had a SNES either and played it on my GBA when that remake came out.)

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I played Super Mario World all the way through. Out of all of the Mario games out there I liked that game the most other then Mario Galaxy and Yoshis Island

Formerly known as Bleddyn And I am feeling like a ghost Resident Perky Goth

Dude, Yoshis Island is legitimately my favorite video game period, high five.

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Yoshi's island reminds of some more about my childhood with video games. It was another one of those games I played at a friend's house briefly, but just didn't gravitate towards. These days I know which classic games were good, but back when I was a kid, if I couldn't put much play time in I really couldn't. And to be honest, I didn't want to play Mario or Yoshi even after sampling them.

I owned a Genesis, and Sonic 2, and it was one of the only games I had before I got a Playstation, so I played it a lot, and I had drive to beat it. It made me want to play and beat all over Sonic games. It was the game that introduced me to video games and taught me the basics. My guess is that it's the opposite for a lot of other gamers; Mario was their first, and they didn't see the appeal of Sonic, or lashed out at the hype around Sonic during the console wars. Maybe that's what it boils down to.

But I don't hate Nintendo games. Even if I never played them much, enough gamers have lauded Mario and DK and Yoshi that I can reasonably believe they're good. It's different with Sonic though; his reputation got so bad it's made people believe the games that were critically acclaimed were not that great, even though they're the same as ever.

Honestly I've only played SMW up to Vanilla Dome, but I'll be the first one to tell you I've always been terrible at Mario games.

I played games from all of the mascots of that day. Crash Bandicoot (I had Crash 2 and 3 I think, and some games after that), Jak And Daxter, Sly Cooper, Sonic, Mario, Pokemon and many others.

I never really was that much into Kirby or Zelda though. Kirby always looked meh to me and Zelda's hype is so large that I honestly think if I were to play a game today from that franchise that I would end up disappointed. The only Zelda games I recall playing was the original one and I think a bit of Twilight Princess

Formerly known as Bleddyn And I am feeling like a ghost Resident Perky Goth

Super Mario World is an amazing game and definitely superior to the first Sonic game. But really, it's unfair to compare Sonic to Mario nowadays anyway. You're talking about a series that basically sparked the platformer genre and has influenced too many games to count. Mario has aged better, but the original Sonic games are still plenty fun and haven't lost their charm.

It's funny that dude said CD was the only good Sonic game when it's one of the most divisive titles in the series.

While I do enjoy Sonic CD, it's variation on the Spindash isn't very good overall and harder to work with, and it doesn't have extremely good level design. The time travel aspect is hard to work with a bit.

It's a fun game, but easily flawed. Not sure why it's the most divisive, but...

Sonic CD is best played via the remaster, where it's actually enjoyable.

I'll be honest, as a kid, I'm pretty sure I didn't know or think any Sonic games beyond Sonic 2 existed until I first played Sonic Advance 2. Don't ask how that logic made any sense. I only first ever played Sonic 1 years later, despite (I'm pretty sure) my sister actually owning that game. Maybe I only remember Sonic 2 because it was two-player.

Also, somebody talking smack about Kirby? You best not disrespect. He's more than you think—he's got maximum pink.

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