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** This makes the ArmorPiercingQuestion from Juror #6 all the more poignant and somber though. The angel is ''very troubled'' at the possibility of the boy going onto committing (another) murder someday in the future. Just because he's innocent today, doesn't mean he'll [[EasyRoadToHell always be innocent tomorrow]]. Supernatural or not, he cannot protect him from the world, and the cruelty the lad's father has shown him, may [[HistoryRepeats come out in him]] one day.
to:
** This makes the ArmorPiercingQuestion from Juror #6 all the more poignant and somber though. The angel is ''very troubled'' at the possibility of the boy going onto committing (another) murder someday in the future. Just because he's innocent today, doesn't mean he'll [[EasyRoadToHell always be innocent tomorrow]]. Supernatural or not, he cannot protect him from the world, and the cruelty the lad's father has shown him, may [[HistoryRepeats come out in him]] one day.day.
** Or he's {{God}} himself. Calm, collect, and pointing out [[BeingHumanSucks humans make mistakes]] all the time. Meaning the father-of-all [[DeathFromAbove smited]] the boy's cruel father, because child beaters is a massive BerserkButton for him.
** Or he's {{God}} himself. Calm, collect, and pointing out [[BeingHumanSucks humans make mistakes]] all the time. Meaning the father-of-all [[DeathFromAbove smited]] the boy's cruel father, because child beaters is a massive BerserkButton for him.
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** This makes the ArmorPiercingQuestion from Juror #6 all the more poignant and somber though. The angel is ''very troubled'' at the possibility of the boy going onto committing (another) murder someday in the future. Just because he's innocent today, doesn't mean he'll [[EasyRoadToHell always be innocent tomorrow]].
to:
** This makes the ArmorPiercingQuestion from Juror #6 all the more poignant and somber though. The angel is ''very troubled'' at the possibility of the boy going onto committing (another) murder someday in the future. Just because he's innocent today, doesn't mean he'll [[EasyRoadToHell always be innocent tomorrow]]. Supernatural or not, he cannot protect him from the world, and the cruelty the lad's father has shown him, may [[HistoryRepeats come out in him]] one day.
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** If he was a GuardianAngel he may [[DivinePunishment have stabbed]] the boy's father, because the abusive cruel man ''was about to kill him''. Hence why he was so sure of the young man's innocence.
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...if or when the nature of the trial is discussed afterwards.
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...if or when the nature of the trial is discussed afterwards.afterwards.
[[WMG: Juror #8 was an AngelUnaware]]
* He's the boy's GuardianAngel that refuses to let the court convict him of a crime he didn't commit. But as part of this DivineIntervention onto the Jury of this trial, he would be ''severely limited'' by human form and constraints, and [[GodsHandsAreTied could not use miracles or revelations]]. All the angel was permitted to know was the boy's innocence - it was up to his own ingenuity now to dismantle the prosecution's case and faulty testimonies to win a "Not Guilty" verdict.
** This makes the ArmorPiercingQuestion from Juror #6 all the more poignant and somber though. The angel is ''very troubled'' at the possibility of the boy going onto committing (another) murder someday in the future. Just because he's innocent today, doesn't mean he'll [[EasyRoadToHell always be innocent tomorrow]].
[[WMG: Juror #8 was an AngelUnaware]]
* He's the boy's GuardianAngel that refuses to let the court convict him of a crime he didn't commit. But as part of this DivineIntervention onto the Jury of this trial, he would be ''severely limited'' by human form and constraints, and [[GodsHandsAreTied could not use miracles or revelations]]. All the angel was permitted to know was the boy's innocence - it was up to his own ingenuity now to dismantle the prosecution's case and faulty testimonies to win a "Not Guilty" verdict.
** This makes the ArmorPiercingQuestion from Juror #6 all the more poignant and somber though. The angel is ''very troubled'' at the possibility of the boy going onto committing (another) murder someday in the future. Just because he's innocent today, doesn't mean he'll [[EasyRoadToHell always be innocent tomorrow]].
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...if or when the nature of the trial is discussed afterwards, RealityEnsues.
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...if or when the nature of the trial is discussed afterwards, RealityEnsues.afterwards.
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* Juror #3 represents Ethos, with a subconscious PsychologicalProjection between his estranged son and the accused.
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* Juror #3 represents Ethos, with a subconscious PsychologicalProjection between his estranged son and the accused.accused.
[[WMG: The trial is later declared a mistrial due to Juror 8's juror misconduct]]
* Almost all of Juror 8's actions would have resulted in a mistrial in real life, namely his actions of:
** Conducting an outside investigation (visiting the crime scene, buying a matching knife)
** Introducing evidence ''not'' presented/reviewed at the trial (one witness's eyeglass marks, another witness's limp, the angle of the switchblade stabs)
...if or when the nature of the trial is discussed afterwards, RealityEnsues.
[[WMG: The trial is later declared a mistrial due to Juror 8's juror misconduct]]
* Almost all of Juror 8's actions would have resulted in a mistrial in real life, namely his actions of:
** Conducting an outside investigation (visiting the crime scene, buying a matching knife)
** Introducing evidence ''not'' presented/reviewed at the trial (one witness's eyeglass marks, another witness's limp, the angle of the switchblade stabs)
...if or when the nature of the trial is discussed afterwards, RealityEnsues.
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*I don't recall the movie involving witness testimony from a parrot or spirit channeling, but I suppose anything's possible.
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* Juror #4 represents Logos, being the only one of the last three to continue voting 'Guilty' for purely logical reasons.
* Juror #10 represents Pathos, voting 'Guilty' only because of his feelings towards "them".
* Juror #10 represents Pathos, voting 'Guilty' only because of his feelings towards "them".
to:
* Juror #4 represents Logos, [[TheSpock Logos]], being the only one of the last three to continue voting 'Guilty' for purely logical reasons.
* Juror #10 representsPathos, [[TheMcCoy Pathos]], voting 'Guilty' only because of his feelings towards "them".
* Juror #10 represents
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Just a theory brought up when my class was studying this film.
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* Just a theory brought up when my class was studying this film.film.
[[WMG: The three remaining jurors represent the three Aristotelian divisions.]]
* Juror #4 represents Logos, being the only one of the last three to continue voting 'Guilty' for purely logical reasons.
* Juror #10 represents Pathos, voting 'Guilty' only because of his feelings towards "them".
* Juror #3 represents Ethos, with a subconscious PsychologicalProjection between his estranged son and the accused.
[[WMG: The three remaining jurors represent the three Aristotelian divisions.]]
* Juror #4 represents Logos, being the only one of the last three to continue voting 'Guilty' for purely logical reasons.
* Juror #10 represents Pathos, voting 'Guilty' only because of his feelings towards "them".
* Juror #3 represents Ethos, with a subconscious PsychologicalProjection between his estranged son and the accused.
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*** ''However'', if the blade ''is'' rare, Juror 8 could have potentially made up where he got the blade to help his argument.
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* This happens before ''Theatre/DaethOfASalesman''. Willy is still broken up over Biff punching him out and leaving.
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* This happens before ''Theatre/DaethOfASalesman''.''Theatre/DeathOfASalesman''. Willy is still broken up over Biff punching him out and leaving.
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* This happens before ''Theatre/ARaisinInTheSun''. Willy is still broken up over Biff punching him out and leaving.
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* This happens before ''Theatre/ARaisinInTheSun''.''Theatre/DaethOfASalesman''. Willy is still broken up over Biff punching him out and leaving.
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Added link.
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* This happens before Death if A Salesman. Willy is still broken up over Biff punching him out and leaving.
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* This happens before Death if A Salesman.''Theatre/ARaisinInTheSun''. Willy is still broken up over Biff punching him out and leaving.
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WMG about Juror #3's identity.
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[[WMG: In the original film and the 1997 remake Juror #3 is Willy Loman.]]
* This happens before Death if A Salesman. Willy is still broken up over Biff punching him out and leaving.
* This happens before Death if A Salesman. Willy is still broken up over Biff punching him out and leaving.
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[[WMG: John Fiedler's character in TwelveAngryMen is the same as his character in ''Theatre/ARaisinInTheSun'']]
* I hope not! I really liked his character in ''TwelveAngryMen'' and he was unlikable in ''Theatre/ARaisinInTheSun''
* I hope not! I really liked his character in ''TwelveAngryMen'' and he was unlikable in ''Theatre/ARaisinInTheSun''
to:
[[WMG: John Fiedler's character in TwelveAngryMen 12 Angry Men is the same as his character in ''Theatre/ARaisinInTheSun'']]
* I hope not! I really liked his character in''TwelveAngryMen'' ''12 Angry Men'' and he was unlikable in ''Theatre/ARaisinInTheSun''
* I hope not! I really liked his character in
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Just a theory brought up when my class was studying this film.
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Just a theory brought up when my class was studying this film.
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----
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[[WMG: Juror #3's son is gay, which is part of what led to their falling out.]]
Just a theory brought up when my class was studying this film.
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----
to:
[[WMG: This movie could have helped create the Ace Attorney Series]]
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[[WMG: In the original film, Juror #3 is drunk.]]
* He slurs some of his speech and his speech pattern is definitely off. He is easily the most emotional of the all the jurors, and his anger has him almost on the verge of tears from the beginning. He threatens to start fights, never thinks before he speaks, and even walks in a staggered way.
* He slurs some of his speech and his speech pattern is definitely off. He is easily the most emotional of the all the jurors, and his anger has him almost on the verge of tears from the beginning. He threatens to start fights, never thinks before he speaks, and even walks in a staggered way.
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** Supposedly super-rare knife. The store owner who sold the kid the knife swore on his life that it was the only one of it's kind... And another one appears in a pawn shop, according to Juror 8. This in of itself proves the knife was reproduced, and can't be nailed down to one or two men. This in turns leaves the only evidence brought forth to be 8's strong notion of the kid's treatment.
to:
** Supposedly super-rare knife. The store owner who sold the kid the knife swore on his life that it was the only one of it's kind... And another one appears in a pawn shop, according to Juror 8. This in of itself proves the knife was reproduced, and can't be nailed down to one or two men. This in turns leaves the only evidence brought forth to be 8's strong notion of the kid's treatment.treatment.
----
----
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[[WMG:''JohnFiedler'''s character in TwelveAngryMen is the same as his character in ''Theatre/ARaisinInTheSun'']]
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He didn't want an innocent boy to die for his actions but didn't feel strongly enough to confess himself. And he ''did'' find a copy of that super-rare knife.
** He ''was'' the one who stressed how horrible the kid had it at home. Maybe the guys treatment of the kid motivated him?
** He ''was'' the one who stressed how horrible the kid had it at home. Maybe the guys treatment of the kid motivated him?
to:
* He didn't want an innocent boy to die for his actions but didn't feel strongly enough to confess himself. And he ''did'' find a copy of that super-rare knife.
** He ''was'' the one who stressed how horrible the kid had it at home. Maybe theguys guy's treatment of the kid motivated him?
** He ''was'' the one who stressed how horrible the kid had it at home. Maybe the
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** He ''was'' the one who stressed how horrible the kid had it at home. Maybe the guys treatment of the kid motivated him?
to:
** He ''was'' the one who stressed how horrible the kid had it at home. Maybe the guys treatment of the kid motivated him?him?
** Supposedly super-rare knife. The store owner who sold the kid the knife swore on his life that it was the only one of it's kind... And another one appears in a pawn shop, according to Juror 8. This in of itself proves the knife was reproduced, and can't be nailed down to one or two men. This in turns leaves the only evidence brought forth to be 8's strong notion of the kid's treatment.
** Supposedly super-rare knife. The store owner who sold the kid the knife swore on his life that it was the only one of it's kind... And another one appears in a pawn shop, according to Juror 8. This in of itself proves the knife was reproduced, and can't be nailed down to one or two men. This in turns leaves the only evidence brought forth to be 8's strong notion of the kid's treatment.
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Changed line(s) 1,3 (click to see context) from:
[[WMG:''JohnFiedler'''s character in TwelveAngryMen is the same as his character in ''ARaisinInTheSun'']]
* I hope not! I really liked his character in ''TwelveAngryMen'' and he was unlikeable in ''ARaisinInTheSun''
* I hope not! I really liked his character in ''TwelveAngryMen'' and he was unlikeable in ''ARaisinInTheSun''
to:
[[WMG:''JohnFiedler'''s character in TwelveAngryMen is the same as his character in ''ARaisinInTheSun'']]
''Theatre/ARaisinInTheSun'']]
* I hope not! I really liked his character in ''TwelveAngryMen'' and he wasunlikeable unlikable in ''ARaisinInTheSun''
''Theatre/ARaisinInTheSun''
* I hope not! I really liked his character in ''TwelveAngryMen'' and he was
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He didn't want an innocent boy to die for his actions but didn't feel strongly enough to confess himself. And he ''did'' find a copy of that super-rare knife.
to:
He didn't want an innocent boy to die for his actions but didn't feel strongly enough to confess himself. And he ''did'' find a copy of that super-rare knife.knife.
** He ''was'' the one who stressed how horrible the kid had it at home. Maybe the guys treatment of the kid motivated him?
** He ''was'' the one who stressed how horrible the kid had it at home. Maybe the guys treatment of the kid motivated him?
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* Juror 8 was the killer
to:
He didn't want an innocent boy to die for his actions but didn't feel strongly enough to confess himself. And he ''did'' find a copy of that super-rare knife.
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I hope not! I really liked his character in ''TwelveAngryMen'' and he was unlikeable in ''ARaisinInTheSun''
to:
* I hope not! I really liked his character in ''TwelveAngryMen'' and he was unlikeable in ''ARaisinInTheSun''
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[[WMG: "JohnFiedler"'s character in TwelveAngryMen is the same as his character in ''ARaisinInTheSun'']]
** I hope not! I really liked his character in ''TwelveAngryMen'' and he was unlikeable in ''ARaisinInTheSun''
** I hope not! I really liked his character in ''TwelveAngryMen'' and he was unlikeable in ''ARaisinInTheSun''
to:
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Changed line(s) 1 (click to see context) from:
* "JohnFiedler"'s character in TwelveAngryMen is the same as his character in "ARaisinInTheSun"
to:
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Changed line(s) 1 (click to see context) from:
* "JohnFiedler"'s character in TwelveAngryMen is the same as his character in "ARasinInTheSun"
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* "JohnFiedler"'s character in TwelveAngryMen is the same as his character in "ARasinInTheSun""ARaisinInTheSun"
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"JohnFiedler"'s character in TwelveAngryMen is the same as his character in "ARasinInTheSun"
to:
* "JohnFiedler"'s character in TwelveAngryMen is the same as his character in "ARasinInTheSun"
** I hope not! I really liked his character in ''TwelveAngryMen'' and he was unlikeable in ''ARaisinInTheSun''
** I hope not! I really liked his character in ''TwelveAngryMen'' and he was unlikeable in ''ARaisinInTheSun''
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Changed line(s) 1 (click to see context) from:
"JohnFiedler"'s character in TwelveAngryMen is the same as his character in "ARasinInTheSun"
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"JohnFiedler"'s character in TwelveAngryMen is the same as his character in "ARasinInTheSun""ARasinInTheSun"
*Juror 8 was the killer
*Juror 8 was the killer
