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* Confirmed in the ''Revan'' novel.

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* Confirmed Semi-confirmed in the ''Revan'' novel.
novel. Revan is back to using his old name, but is actually trying a preemptive strike at the Sith Empire.
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* Confirmed in the ''Revan'' novel.




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* Chris Avellone's word on this one is "[[ShrugOfGod Can't comment, but good catch. Sorry.]]"

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It is never shown of how is he rescued by the Jedi Knights, including Bastila. For Male Revan, Carth represents of how he should have been a Jedi instead of leading the Sith, Juhani represents of how he should fall in love with someone, and Bastila represents his goodness. For Female Revan, Carth represents love, Juhani represents on how to be friends, and Bastila represents on how to be a Jedi. For both genders of Revan, Darth Bastila represents of going back to the Sith, while Darth Malak represents of furthering his/her agenda to lead the Sith.

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It is never shown of how is he rescued by The fight on Revan's flagship with Bastila and the Jedi Knights, including Bastila. striketeam is shown in Revan's visions, but we don't see any of the details of Revan being healed and revived.

For Male Revan, Carth represents of how he should have been a Jedi instead of leading the Sith, recovering from trauma, loyalty, and leadership without tyranny, Juhani represents of how he should fall in the wish for love with someone, and the possibility of redemption, and Bastila represents his goodness. goodness and compassion. For Female Revan, Carth represents love, love and its redemptive power, Juhani represents on how to be friends, adds acceptance of and overcoming one's past choices, and Bastila represents on how the struggle inherent in living up to be a Jedi. the Jedi ideal. For both genders of Revan, Jolee represents perspective and wisdom apart from the dictates of moral guardians, Canderous is the love of war as a challenge, creative outlet, and expression of mastery, Mission and Zaalbar represent friendship, loyalty, and resilience, Darth Bastila represents of going back to the Sith, while emptiness of good intentions in the face of evil and resentment toward the Jedi order, and Darth Malak represents of furthering his/her agenda to lead the Sith.
mastery, unconditional dominance, and betrayal by one's close associates

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* What are the odds of surviving the massacre on the Endar Spire, just ''happening'' to share the last escape pod with an amnesiac ex-Sith Lord, crash-landing in what passes for the "good" part of town, staying uninjured, rescuing the intermittently-conscious PlayerCharacter without getting caught by the Sith, and happening to find a dump of an apartment where the landlord is not asking questions? That's a hell of a set of longshots, and when we've got that many in the [=GFFA=], TheForce is ''definitely'' involved.

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* What are the odds of surviving the massacre on the Endar Spire, just ''happening'' to share the last escape pod with an amnesiac ex-Sith Lord, crash-landing in what passes for the "good" part of town, staying uninjured, rescuing the intermittently-conscious PlayerCharacter without getting caught by the Sith, and happening to find a dump of an apartment where the landlord is not asking questions? That's a hell of a set of longshots, and when we've got that many coincedences attached to one person, in the [=GFFA=], [[StarWars GFFA]], TheForce is ''definitely'' involved.


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* Also in KoTOR II, if you specify a female Revan, T3-M4 carries a holo from Carth- he's had a premonition that Revan is about to leave without warning. He was right.
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* What are the odds of surviving the massacare on the Endar Spire, just ''happening'' to share the last escape pod with the amnesiac ex-Sith Lord, crash-landing in what passes for the "good" part of town, staying uninjured, rescuing the PlayerCharacter without getting caught by the Sith, and happening to find a dump of an apartment where the landlord is not asking questions? That's a hell of a set of longshots, and when we've got that many in the [=GFFA=], TheForce is ''definitely'' involved.
* There's also that longshot landing he made on Lehon where the Ebon Hawk ended up mostly intact. There are also the random encounters of Sith patrols, the blocade of Taris, the escape from the Leviathan, and running the gauntlet to get to the Star Forge. Compare to Atton who is known to be Force-lit and and excellent pilot...yet still crashed the damn ship three times.

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* What are the odds of surviving the massacare massacre on the Endar Spire, just ''happening'' to share the last escape pod with the an amnesiac ex-Sith Lord, crash-landing in what passes for the "good" part of town, staying uninjured, rescuing the intermittently-conscious PlayerCharacter without getting caught by the Sith, and happening to find a dump of an apartment where the landlord is not asking questions? That's a hell of a set of longshots, and when we've got that many in the [=GFFA=], TheForce is ''definitely'' involved.
* There's also that longshot The improbable landing he made on Lehon Lehon, where the Ebon Hawk ended up mostly intact. There are also the random encounters of Sith patrols, the blocade of Taris, the escape from the Leviathan, and running the gauntlet to get to the Star Forge. Compare to Atton who is known to be Force-lit and and an excellent pilot...yet still crashed the damn ship three times.



* In the second game, he flat-out tells the Exile that "he would know" if Revan died, despire Revan being half a galaxy away. If you say Revan was female, he also says that there's "an emptiness where she used to be."

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* In the second game, he flat-out tells the Exile that "he would know" if Revan died, despire despite Revan being half a galaxy away. If you say Revan was female, he also says that there's "an emptiness where she used to be."



* ExpandedUniverse also says this is not the first time he's encountered a Jedi coverup. He ran into Zayne Carrick and helped Zayne escape from both Saul Karath and the Jedi authorties because he "knew" the kid was innocent.
* Telos is where the Jedi dumped Force Sensitives that didn't make the cut for Padawan status. The Telosians are decended from those washouts. Now, we know that Force Sensitivity strongly runs InTheBlood. We know Carth is a native of Telos. And we saw what happened to Carth's son.


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* ExpandedUniverse also says this is not the first time he's encountered a Jedi coverup. He ran into Zayne Carrick and helped Zayne escape from both Saul Karath and the Jedi authorties authorities because he "knew" the kid was innocent.
innocent.
* Also in the KotOR comics, When Zayne recieves a vision that allows him to accurately predict the Mandalorians' bombardment of Serroco, Zayne tries in vain to give Karath and the Republic fleet advanced warning of the attack to allow them to defend the civilian alien population of the planet. When no one else takes him seriously (Zayne's friends blow him off. Karath, convinced that Zayne is a Mandalorian spy, has him thrown in the brig.) Carth calls a tornado warning in to as many weather stations on the planet as he can reach, causing many of the natives to evacuate to underground bunkers and escape the worst of the blitz.
* Telos is where the Jedi dumped Force Sensitives Force-Sensitives that didn't make the cut for Padawan status. The Telosians are decended from those washouts. Now, we know that Force Sensitivity strongly runs InTheBlood. We know Carth is a native of Telos. And we saw what happened to Carth's son.

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* ExpandedUniverse also says this is not the first time he's encountered a Jedi coverup. He ran into Zayne Carrick and helped Zayne escape from both Sul Karath and the Jedi authorties because he "knew" the kid was innocent.

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* At Ajunta Pal's tomb, the only two non-Jedi party members who comment on seeing the Sith ghost are Carth and HK-47. HK remarks that he detects something strange on his sensors. Carth can not only see the ghost, but ''understand what he's saying.''
* ExpandedUniverse also says this is not the first time he's encountered a Jedi coverup. He ran into Zayne Carrick and helped Zayne escape from both Sul Saul Karath and the Jedi authorties because he "knew" the kid was innocent.
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*** Except when he has his MoralityChip.
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!WMG for the video game ''VideoGame/KnightsOfTheOldRepublic'':
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[[WMG: Carth Onasi is Force-Sensitive, but not trained]]
* His rantings come off as paranoid, but they turn out to be ''absolutely true.'' He senses right off the bat there's something strange about the PlayerCharacter and that the details aren't adding up for him. He is pissed off because he can sense the Jedi are leading them on - and three for three, he's dead on. On some level, he might be able to sense something "off" about the PlayerCharacter, but hasn't the training or the knowledge to put the pieces together.
* What are the odds of surviving the massacare on the Endar Spire, just ''happening'' to share the last escape pod with the amnesiac ex-Sith Lord, crash-landing in what passes for the "good" part of town, staying uninjured, rescuing the PlayerCharacter without getting caught by the Sith, and happening to find a dump of an apartment where the landlord is not asking questions? That's a hell of a set of longshots, and when we've got that many in the [=GFFA=], TheForce is ''definitely'' involved.
* There's also that longshot landing he made on Lehon where the Ebon Hawk ended up mostly intact. There are also the random encounters of Sith patrols, the blocade of Taris, the escape from the Leviathan, and running the gauntlet to get to the Star Forge. Compare to Atton who is known to be Force-lit and and excellent pilot...yet still crashed the damn ship three times.
* He remarks that he "knows" on some level that he will be present when Saul Karath is killed or do it himself. Guess what? He's right here at the moment Saul dies and at least partly involved in his death.
* If you play female, his last conversation before the Leviathan has him telling the PlayerCharacter that he senses the Jedi have left them out to hang, and that she'll "have to make a choice very soon" as to her future, one she can't turn away from. If she chooses the Light Side, he blurts out "I sensed you would have to make a choice very soon, and that was ''it,'' I ''can feel it.''"
* In the second game, he flat-out tells the Exile that "he would know" if Revan died, despire Revan being half a galaxy away. If you say Revan was female, he also says that there's "an emptiness where she used to be."
* ExpandedUniverse also says this is not the first time he's encountered a Jedi coverup. He ran into Zayne Carrick and helped Zayne escape from both Sul Karath and the Jedi authorties because he "knew" the kid was innocent.
* Telos is where the Jedi dumped Force Sensitives that didn't make the cut for Padawan status. The Telosians are decended from those washouts. Now, we know that Force Sensitivity strongly runs InTheBlood. We know Carth is a native of Telos. And we saw what happened to Carth's son.

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[[WMG:The first game is Darth Revan's DyingDream.]]
It is never shown of how is he rescued by the Jedi Knights, including Bastila. For Male Revan, Carth represents of how he should have been a Jedi instead of leading the Sith, Juhani represents of how he should fall in love with someone, and Bastila represents his goodness. For Female Revan, Carth represents love, Juhani represents on how to be friends, and Bastila represents on how to be a Jedi. For both genders of Revan, Darth Bastila represents of going back to the Sith, while Darth Malak represents of furthering his/her agenda to lead the Sith.
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[[WMG:Kreia is not Arren Kae]]
She is Arren Kae's mother, and thus the Handmaiden's grandmother. (INSERT REASONINGS HERE)
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* I think you mean Nihilus

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* I think you mean Nihilus
Nihilus. Unless KOTOR is in the same universe as TF2 *and* Mass Effect.
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* I think you mean Nihilus
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Old woman, poor eyesight, sharp-tongued, TricksterMentor, fond of the HannibalLecture, puzzles, riddles, and has a definitive 'bond' with the main character. Not to mention that both are created by ChrisAvellone, who has claimed that incarnations of Ravel follow these general tendencies.

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Old woman, poor eyesight, eyesight who's a BlindSeer, sharp-tongued, TricksterMentor, fond of the HannibalLecture, puzzles, riddles, and has a definitive 'bond' with the main character. Not to mention that both are created by ChrisAvellone, who has claimed that incarnations of Ravel follow these general tendencies.
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[[WMG:Kreia is an incarnation of [[PlanescapeTorment Ravel Puzzlewell]].]]
Old woman, poor eyesight, sharp-tongued, TricksterMentor, fond of the HannibalLecture, puzzles, riddles, and has a definitive 'bond' with the main character. Not to mention that both are created by ChrisAvellone, who has claimed that incarnations of Ravel follow these general tendencies.
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[[WMG: Darth Sion is the [[spoiler: crazy captain of the Icarus I]] from ''{{Sunshine}}''.]]

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[[WMG: Darth Sion is the [[spoiler: crazy captain of the Icarus I]] from ''{{Sunshine}}''.''{{Film/Sunshine}}''.]]
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* Doubtful in my eye. If Kreia is to be believed (a dangerous assumption, but I believe she was earnest in this case) Revan was in an inherently good person and did not "fall" to the dark side but made a conscious choice, seeing it as being the lesser of two evils. By the end of KotOR1 Revan recalled very little of his previous life, including his original motives for becoming a Sith Lord. Without this knowledge, the amnesiac Revan simply presumed that he had "fallen" and was leading the Sith for no reason beyond being an evil bastard.

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* Doubtful in my eye. If Kreia is to be believed (a dangerous assumption, but I believe she was earnest in this case) Revan was in an inherently good person and did not "fall" to the dark side but made a conscious choice, seeing it as being the lesser of two evils. By the end of KotOR1 [=KotOR1=] Revan recalled very little of his previous life, including his original motives for becoming a Sith Lord. Without this knowledge, the amnesiac Revan simply presumed that he had "fallen" and was leading the Sith for no reason beyond being an evil bastard.
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*** Counter-counterpoint: "Gone to war over the objection of their masters" doesn’t explicitly mean their direct teachers. The Jedi order has a hierarchy, and the members Jedi Council are regarded in status of authority as masters over the other Jedi. Also, there may be some group lessons, like we saw in Episode II with Yoda teaching the younglings, that may account for numerous Jedi having a former “master” or “teacher” that trained them before their Padawan years (this is what Obi-Wan meant in the OT when he referred to Yoda as having taught him, despite us seeing Obi-Wan as Qui-Gon’s apprentice in Episode I).

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*** ** Counter-counterpoint: "Gone to war over the objection of their masters" doesn’t explicitly mean their direct teachers. The Jedi order has a hierarchy, and the members Jedi Council are regarded in status of authority as masters over the other Jedi. Also, there may be some group lessons, like we saw in Episode II with Yoda teaching the younglings, that may account for numerous Jedi having a former “master” or “teacher” that trained them before their Padawan years (this is what Obi-Wan meant in the OT when he referred to Yoda as having taught him, despite us seeing Obi-Wan as Qui-Gon’s apprentice in Episode I).

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** Counter-counterpoint: "Gone to war over the objection of their masters" doesn’t explicitly mean their direct teachers. The Jedi order has a hierarchy, and the members Jedi Council are regarded in status of authority as masters over the other Jedi. Also, there may be some group lessons, like we saw in Episode II with Yoda teaching the younglings, that may account for numerous Jedi having a former “master” or “teacher” that trained them before their Padawan years (this is what Obi-Wan meant in the OT when he referred to Yoda as having taught him, despite us seeing Obi-Wan as Qui-Gon’s apprentice in Episode I).

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** *** Counter-counterpoint: "Gone to war over the objection of their masters" doesn’t explicitly mean their direct teachers. The Jedi order has a hierarchy, and the members Jedi Council are regarded in status of authority as masters over the other Jedi. Also, there may be some group lessons, like we saw in Episode II with Yoda teaching the younglings, that may account for numerous Jedi having a former “master” or “teacher” that trained them before their Padawan years (this is what Obi-Wan meant in the OT when he referred to Yoda as having taught him, despite us seeing Obi-Wan as Qui-Gon’s apprentice in Episode I).I).
** Also, it's funny you should mention Arren Kae is dead. What was the [[IThoughtYouWereDead first thing the Jedi masters said when seeing Kreia]]?
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** Counter-counterpoint: "Gone to war over the objection of their masters" doesn’t explicitly mean their direct teachers. The Jedi order has a hierarchy, and the members Jedi Council are regarded in status of authority as masters over the other Jedi. Also, there may be some group lessons, like we saw in Episode II with Yoda teaching the younglings, that may account for numerous Jedi having a former “master” or “teacher” that trained them before their Padawan years (this is what Obi-Wan meant in the OT when he referred to Yoda as having taught him, despite us seeing Obi-Wan as Qui-Gon’s apprentice in Episode I).

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*** The Force may not die at any time in the story universe, but think about the opening line to all the movies: "[[FridgeHorror A LONG TIME AGO, in a galaxy far, far away...]]"
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** I'd buy it, except for the part about HK being anything like Threepio. Seriously, the only things they have in common are 'droid' and 'bipedal'.
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* Counterpoint: Arren Kae is explicitly stated to have gone to the Mandalorian Wars and died (okay, "died") there. However, Revan and Malak are equally explicitly said to have gone to said war ''over the objections of their masters''. Also, they are the most prominent Jedi to do so, which is unlikely to be the case if their teacher runs off with them.
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Eventually, after years of battle The Pyro figured out how to set things on fire with his mind, using The Force. Pyrokinesis requires a lot of force energy to use, so she takes to consuming entire planet's worth of life in order to try and sustain his ability. He doesn't use it in-game because she doesn't have enough force energy at that point.

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Eventually, after years of battle The Pyro figured out how to set things on fire with his mind, using The Force. Pyrokinesis requires a lot of force energy to use, so she takes to consuming entire planet's worth of life in order to try and sustain his ability. He doesn't use it in-game because she doesn't have enough force energy at that point.
point.
* [[MassEffect Nihlus]]?
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** I call your Galen Marek. He was a child of two Jedi, so he had ''way'' more power than a normal Jedi. Even then, it took his full focus to pull that Star Destroyer down from low altitude. And the rest of his foes? We see Revan overpowering rancors on the Rakata world and smashing big battle droids even easier than Galen. Malak could wipe the floor of his observation deck with Vader. They, while strong by their time's standards, weren't ''that'' exceptional, and had no Jedi heritage.

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** I call your Galen Marek. He was a child of two Jedi, so he had ''way'' more power than a normal Jedi. Even then, it took his full focus to pull that Star Destroyer down from low altitude. And the rest of his foes? We see Revan overpowering rancors on the Rakata world and smashing big battle droids even easier than Galen. Malak could wipe the floor of his observation deck with Vader. They, And they, while strong by their time's standards, weren't ''that'' exceptional, and had no Jedi heritage.
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** I call your Galen Marek. He was a child of two Jedi, so he had ''way'' more power than a normal Jedi. Even then, it took his full focus to pull that Star Destroyer down from low altitude. And the rest of his foes? We see Revan overpowering rancors on the Rakata world and smashing big battle droids even easier than Galen. Malak could wipe the floor of his observation deck with Vader. They, while strong by his time's standards, weren't ''that'' exceptional, and had no Jedi heritage.

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** I call your Galen Marek. He was a child of two Jedi, so he had ''way'' more power than a normal Jedi. Even then, it took his full focus to pull that Star Destroyer down from low altitude. And the rest of his foes? We see Revan overpowering rancors on the Rakata world and smashing big battle droids even easier than Galen. Malak could wipe the floor of his observation deck with Vader. They, while strong by his their time's standards, weren't ''that'' exceptional, and had no Jedi heritage.
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** I call your Galen Marek. He was a child of two Jedi, so he had ''way'' more power than a normal Jedi. Even then, it took his full focus to pull that Star Destroyer down from low altitude. And the rest of his foes? We see Revan overpowering rancors on the Rakata world and smashing big battle droids even easier than Galen. Malak could wipe the floor of his observation deck with Vader. And Revan, while strong by his time's standards, wasn't ''that'' exceptional, and had no Jedi heritage.

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** I call your Galen Marek. He was a child of two Jedi, so he had ''way'' more power than a normal Jedi. Even then, it took his full focus to pull that Star Destroyer down from low altitude. And the rest of his foes? We see Revan overpowering rancors on the Rakata world and smashing big battle droids even easier than Galen. Malak could wipe the floor of his observation deck with Vader. And Revan, They, while strong by his time's standards, wasn't weren't ''that'' exceptional, and had no Jedi heritage.
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** I call your Galen Marek. He was a child of two Jedi, so he had ''way'' more power than a normal Jedi. Even then, it took his full focus to pull that Star Destroyer down from low altitude. And the rest of his foes? We see Revan overpowering rancors on the Rakata world and smashing big battle droids even easier than Galen. Malak could wipe the floor of his observation deck with Vader. And Revan, while strong by his time's standards, wasn't ''that'' exceptional, and had no Jedi heritage.
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An old theory, but should be here for posterity's sake. Kreia is also indirectly mentioned to be Revan's first and last teacher; she looks very similar to the Handmaiden, Arren Kae's daughter; Arren Kae was thought to have died at Malachor V with no body found (but surely NoOneCouldHaveSurvivedThat,) and the Jedi masters say they thought Kreia died at Malachor V, etc. More at [[http://lparchive.org/LetsPlay/KOTOR%202/Update%2058/index.html]].

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An old theory, but should be here for posterity's sake. Kreia is also indirectly mentioned to be Revan's first and last teacher; she looks very similar to the Handmaiden, Arren Kae's daughter; Arren Kae was thought to have died at Malachor V with no body found (but surely NoOneCouldHaveSurvivedThat,) and the Jedi masters say they thought Kreia died at Malachor V, etc. More at An [[http://lparchive.org/LetsPlay/KOTOR%202/Update%2058/index.html]].
org/Knights-of-the-Old-Republic-II/Update%2058/ entire chapter]] of a Let's Play for this game is dedicated to pointing out a whole sequence of events practically done in the style of the offhand comments in the first game that turned out to be the hints for Revan's true nature; given Obsidian's usual style, it's pretty likely these are intentional.

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[[WMG: Darth Sion is the [[spoiler: crazy captain of the Icarus I]] from ''[[Sunshine]]''.]]

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[[WMG: Darth Sion is the [[spoiler: crazy captain of the Icarus I]] from ''[[Sunshine]]''.''{{Sunshine}}''.]]


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[[WMG: Kreia is Arren Kae, the Jedi Master who was Revan's first and last teacher]]
An old theory, but should be here for posterity's sake. Kreia is also indirectly mentioned to be Revan's first and last teacher; she looks very similar to the Handmaiden, Arren Kae's daughter; Arren Kae was thought to have died at Malachor V with no body found (but surely NoOneCouldHaveSurvivedThat,) and the Jedi masters say they thought Kreia died at Malachor V, etc. More at [[http://lparchive.org/LetsPlay/KOTOR%202/Update%2058/index.html]].

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