History Main / ConstructiveCriticism

8th Jan '16 2:18:34 PM Scorpion451
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* [[OhGreatASnarkIndex Snark]], {{Cluster F Bomb}}s, {{Caustic Critic}}ism, and [[ItSucks any use of the work "sucks" outside of the context of describing particle movement]] automatically transform even the most well intentioned critique into a ReasonWhyYouSuckSpeech. And perhaps the most important thing: ''Don't mock the work OR the author''. A critique is not a [[TheRoast comedy roast]]. When you start doing any of these things, most people will think you are {{troll}}ing them- ''[[TomatoInTheMirror because you are trolling them]]''.

to:

* [[OhGreatASnarkIndex Snark]], {{Cluster F Bomb}}s, {{Caustic Critic}}ism, and [[ItSucks any use of the work word "sucks" outside of the context of describing particle movement]] automatically transform even the most well intentioned critique into a ReasonWhyYouSuckSpeech. And perhaps the most important thing: ''Don't mock the work OR the author''. A critique is not a [[TheRoast comedy roast]]. When you start doing any of these things, most people will think you are {{troll}}ing them- ''[[TomatoInTheMirror because you are trolling them]]''.
2nd Jun '15 8:23:44 AM Morgenthaler
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->"Okay, I've read your script, and it's retarded. You should just use it for toilet paper. [[OpinionMyopia Nobody likes car chases anymore]], and your crappy jokes make [[Creator/ArnoldSchwarzenegger Arnold]] look like [[Creator/WilliamShakespeare Shakespeare]]. You thought that shit was funny? Oh, the love scenes were good. I always knew you were gay."

to:

->"Okay, I've read your script, and it's retarded. You should just use it for toilet paper. [[OpinionMyopia Nobody likes car chases anymore]], and your crappy jokes make [[Creator/ArnoldSchwarzenegger Arnold]] look like [[Creator/WilliamShakespeare Shakespeare]]. You thought that shit was funny? Oh, the love scenes were good. [[RealMenHateAffection I always knew you were gay.gay]]."
18th Nov '14 7:42:52 AM Scorpion451
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This kind of criticism is about being honest, clear, and considerate in your comments. In particular, a respectful tone is crucial in proper constructive criticism. [[GoodIsNotSoft There is no handholding]], and this does not mean making only positive comments: it is not constructive to say a bad work is good. Proper critique, however, also avoids unmitigated BrutalHonesty. A good Constructive Critic is a master of VerbalJudo: honestly and directly pointing out flaws while simultaneously highlighting strengths and unexplored avenues of a work, all while maintaining a neutral to positive tone. In short, you are trying to help the artist improve both ''positively'' and ''honestly''.

to:

This kind of criticism is about being honest, clear, and considerate in your comments. In particular, a respectful tone is crucial in proper constructive criticism. [[GoodIsNotSoft There is no handholding]], and this does not mean making only positive comments: it is not constructive to say a bad work is good. Proper critique, however, also avoids unmitigated BrutalHonesty. A good The ideal Constructive Critic is a master of VerbalJudo: honestly and directly pointing out flaws while simultaneously highlighting strengths and unexplored avenues of a work, all while maintaining a neutral to positive tone. In short, you are trying to help the artist improve both ''positively'' and ''honestly''.
''honestly'', not shame them into improving.



Now you might be wondering if Constructive Criticism is appropriate for this site. Of course it's better than Administrivia/ComplainingAboutShowsYouDontLike, but describing tropes and listing examples doesn't actually call for criticism. There are some places where it can fit, particularly in {{YKTTW}}. You can help a new trope a lot more with this kind of criticism than insulting the new trope, the troper that posted it, or [[YourMom that troper's mother]].

to:

Now you might be wondering if Constructive Criticism is appropriate for this site. Of course it's better than Administrivia/ComplainingAboutShowsYouDontLike, but describing tropes and listing examples doesn't actually call for criticism. There are some places where it can fit, particularly in {{YKTTW}}. You can help a new trope a lot more with this kind of criticism than insulting the new trope, the troper that posted it, or [[YourMom that troper's mother]].


Added DiffLines:

Now you might be wondering if Constructive Criticism is appropriate for this site. Of course it's better than Administrivia/ComplainingAboutShowsYouDontLike, but describing tropes and listing examples doesn't actually call for criticism. There are some places where it can fit, particularly in {{YKTTW}}. You can help a new trope a lot more with this kind of criticism than insulting the new trope, the troper that posted it, or [[YourMom that troper's mother]].
23rd Oct '14 8:31:42 AM Scorpion451
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You'll notice that most people don't actually ''understand'' the concept of Constructive Criticism. As you'll probably learn if you take a college-level creative writing course, one of the most ''important things'' about Constructive Criticism is ''don't rewrite the work'' to suit your desires. The point is to make it into something that ''[[TargetAudience the intended audience]]'' will like. This is actually one of the ''biggest'' things that people need to learn about being constructive, because it is not very constructive to try to suggest the author to write a work into something that ''you'' want to enjoy. You will notice this as a trend in people who are members of the PeripheryHatedom, especially if they have a BiasSteamroller.


to:

You'll notice that most people don't actually ''understand'' the concept of Constructive Criticism. As you'll probably learn if you take a college-level creative writing course, one of the most ''important things'' ''important'' things about Constructive Criticism is ''don't don't rewrite the work'' work to [[OpinionMyopia suit your desires.own desires]]. The point is to make it into something that ''[[TargetAudience the intended audience]]'' will like. This is actually one of the ''biggest'' things that people need to learn about being constructive, because it is not very constructive to try to suggest the author to write a work into something that ''you'' want to enjoy. You will notice this as a trend in people who are members of the PeripheryHatedom, especially if they have a BiasSteamroller.

BiasSteamroller, and those with extreme FanMyopia.

8th Oct '14 9:18:32 AM Scorpion451
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This kind of criticism is about being honest, clear, and considerate in your comments. In particular, a respectful tone is crucial in proper constructive criticism. [[GoodIsNotSoft There is no handholding]], and this does not mean making only positive comments. It is not constructive to say a bad work is good. It does, however mean you're , but neither is there unmitigated BrutalHonesty- a good Constructive Critic is a master of VerbalJudo: honestly and directly pointing out flaws while simultaneously highlighting strengths and unexplored avenues of a work, all while maintaining a neutral to positive tone. In short, you are trying to help the artist improve positively.

to:

This kind of criticism is about being honest, clear, and considerate in your comments. In particular, a respectful tone is crucial in proper constructive criticism. [[GoodIsNotSoft There is no handholding]], and this does not mean making only positive comments. It comments: it is not constructive to say a bad work is good. It does, however mean you're , but neither is there Proper critique, however, also avoids unmitigated BrutalHonesty- a BrutalHonesty. A good Constructive Critic is a master of VerbalJudo: honestly and directly pointing out flaws while simultaneously highlighting strengths and unexplored avenues of a work, all while maintaining a neutral to positive tone. In short, you are trying to help the artist improve positively.
both ''positively'' and ''honestly''.
8th Oct '14 9:15:04 AM Scorpion451
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While flames are designed to [[KickTheDog put people down]], constructive criticism is meant to help an artist improve his/her work. It's rarely shown in fiction, but it's important to it, since it's meant to help people improve their writing or artwork.

to:

While flames are designed to [[KickTheDog put people down]], constructive criticism is meant to help an artist improve his/her work. It's rarely shown in fiction, but it's important it is vital to it, since it's meant to help people improve their writing the growth of an artist or artwork.
writer.
8th Oct '14 9:14:11 AM Scorpion451
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While flames are designed to [[KickTheDog put people down]], constructive criticism is meant to help an artist improve his/her work. It's rarely shown in fiction, but it's important to it, since it's meant to help people improve their writing.

This kind of criticism is about being honest, clear, and considerate in your comments. It doesn't mean making only positive comments (it's not constructive to say a bad work is good), but it does mean you're trying to help the artist improve positively. It should also be noted that politeness, while appreciated, isn't necessary to make the criticism constructive. So long as the problems are highlighted and suggestions are made to make things better, [[ClusterFBomb Cluster F Bombs]] can be dropped without the criticism becoming trolling.

It's not perfect. For one thing, you have to be aware of your biases, and admit them. There are times when you are asked for criticism, but are probably not the best person to be asked about something. For another, you could make claims that turn out to be wrong, even if you thought otherwise at the time. Finally, the artist could misunderstand your criticism, and take it as bashing, even when you mean otherwise. Some simply CantTakeCriticism anyway.

Yet it's still the form of criticism most likely to actually get results. In fact, some artists can even give this to themselves, hence the phrase "I'm my own worst critic."

Now you might be wondering if this is appropriate for this site. Of course it's better than Administrivia/ComplainingAboutShowsYouDontLike, but describing tropes and listing examples doesn't actually call for criticism. There are some places where it can fit, particularly in {{YKTTW}}. You can help a new trope a lot more with this kind of criticism than insulting the new trope, the troper that posted it, or [[YourMom that troper's mother]].

However; you'll notice that most people don't actually ''understand'' the concept of Constructive Criticism. As you'll probably learn if you take a college-level creative writing course, one of the most ''important things'' about Constructive Criticism is ''don't rewrite the work'' to suit your desires. This is actually one of the ''biggest'' things that people need to learn about being constructive, because it is not very constructive to try to suggest the author to write a work into something that ''you'' want to enjoy. The point is to make it into something that ''the intended audience'' will like. You will notice this as a trend in people who are members of the PeripheryHatedom, especially if they have a BiasSteamroller.

And perhaps the most important thing? ''Don't mock the work or the author''. When you start doing this, then it stops sounding like a Constructive Criticism and sounds more like FlameBait or HateDumb. Doing this will make people think you're flat out ''bashing'' them.

to:

While flames are designed to [[KickTheDog put people down]], constructive criticism is meant to help an artist improve his/her work. It's rarely shown in fiction, but it's important to it, since it's meant to help people improve their writing.

writing or artwork.

This kind of criticism is about being honest, clear, and considerate in your comments. It doesn't In particular, a respectful tone is crucial in proper constructive criticism. [[GoodIsNotSoft There is no handholding]], and this does not mean making only positive comments (it's comments. It is not constructive to say a bad work is good), but it does good. It does, however mean you're you're , but neither is there unmitigated BrutalHonesty- a good Constructive Critic is a master of VerbalJudo: honestly and directly pointing out flaws while simultaneously highlighting strengths and unexplored avenues of a work, all while maintaining a neutral to positive tone. In short, you are trying to help the artist improve positively. It should also be noted that politeness, while appreciated, isn't necessary positively.

This is very, very hard
to make the criticism constructive. So long as the problems are highlighted and suggestions are made to make things better, [[ClusterFBomb Cluster F Bombs]] can be dropped without the criticism becoming trolling.

It's not perfect.
do. For one thing, you have to be aware of your biases, and admit them. There are times when you are asked for criticism, but are probably not the best person to be asked about something. For another, you could make claims that turn out to be wrong, even if you thought otherwise at the time. Finally, the artist could misunderstand your criticism, and take it as bashing, even when you mean otherwise. Some some simply CantTakeCriticism anyway.

anyway- beware those showing signs of being [[SunnySunflowerDisposition Sunny Sunflowers]] or {{Wide Eyed Idealist}}s in particular.

Yet it's still the form of criticism most likely to actually get results. In fact, some most good artists can even give this to themselves, hence the phrase "I'm my own worst critic."

Things an aspiring Constructive Critic should avoid:

*[[OhGreatASnarkIndex Snark]], {{Cluster F Bomb}}s, {{Caustic Critic}}ism, and [[ItSucks any use of the work "sucks" outside of the context of describing particle movement]] automatically transform even the most well intentioned critique into a ReasonWhyYouSuckSpeech. And perhaps the most important thing: ''Don't mock the work OR the author''. A critique is not a [[TheRoast comedy roast]]. When you start doing any of these things, most people will think you are {{troll}}ing them- ''[[TomatoInTheMirror because you are trolling them]]''.

*On the opposing spectrum, [[DamnedByFaintPraise framing criticism as compliment]], [[PassiveAggressiveKombat feigned politeness]], and CondescendingCompassion are the hallmarks of the equally bad CompassionateCritic. The envelope is different, but the [[NotSoDifferent message is the same]].


Now you might be wondering if this Constructive Criticism is appropriate for this site. Of course it's better than Administrivia/ComplainingAboutShowsYouDontLike, but describing tropes and listing examples doesn't actually call for criticism. There are some places where it can fit, particularly in {{YKTTW}}. You can help a new trope a lot more with this kind of criticism than insulting the new trope, the troper that posted it, or [[YourMom that troper's mother]].

However; you'll You'll notice that most people don't actually ''understand'' the concept of Constructive Criticism. As you'll probably learn if you take a college-level creative writing course, one of the most ''important things'' about Constructive Criticism is ''don't rewrite the work'' to suit your desires. The point is to make it into something that ''[[TargetAudience the intended audience]]'' will like. This is actually one of the ''biggest'' things that people need to learn about being constructive, because it is not very constructive to try to suggest the author to write a work into something that ''you'' want to enjoy. The point is to make it into something that ''the intended audience'' will like.enjoy. You will notice this as a trend in people who are members of the PeripheryHatedom, especially if they have a BiasSteamroller.

And perhaps the most important thing? ''Don't mock the work or the author''. When you start doing this, then it stops sounding like a Constructive Criticism and sounds more like FlameBait or HateDumb. Doing this will make people think you're flat out ''bashing'' them.
26th Oct '13 8:44:14 AM SeptimusHeap
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Now you might be wondering if this is appropriate for this site. Of course it's better than ComplainingAboutShowsYouDontLike, but describing tropes and listing examples doesn't actually call for criticism. There are some places where it can fit, particularly in {{YKTTW}}. You can help a new trope a lot more with this kind of criticism than insulting the new trope, the troper that posted it, or [[YourMom that troper's mother]].

to:

Now you might be wondering if this is appropriate for this site. Of course it's better than ComplainingAboutShowsYouDontLike, Administrivia/ComplainingAboutShowsYouDontLike, but describing tropes and listing examples doesn't actually call for criticism. There are some places where it can fit, particularly in {{YKTTW}}. You can help a new trope a lot more with this kind of criticism than insulting the new trope, the troper that posted it, or [[YourMom that troper's mother]].
22nd Oct '13 6:56:22 AM SeptimusHeap
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'''No examples, please. We're just defining the term. But any wicks must be [[InUniverseExamplesOnly In-Universe Only]].'''

to:

'''No examples, please. We're just defining the term. But any wicks must be [[InUniverseExamplesOnly [[Administrivia/InUniverseExamplesOnly In-Universe Only]].'''
5th Jul '13 12:56:10 PM DragonQuestZ
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It's not perfect. For one thing, you have to be aware of your biases, and admit them. There are times when you are asked for criticism, but are probably not the best person to be asked about something. For another, you could make claims that turn out to be wrong, even if you thought otherwise at the time. Finally, the artist could misunderstand your criticism, and take it as bashing, even when you mean otherwise.

to:

It's not perfect. For one thing, you have to be aware of your biases, and admit them. There are times when you are asked for criticism, but are probably not the best person to be asked about something. For another, you could make claims that turn out to be wrong, even if you thought otherwise at the time. Finally, the artist could misunderstand your criticism, and take it as bashing, even when you mean otherwise.
otherwise. Some simply CantTakeCriticism anyway.



However; you'll notice that most people don't actually ''understand'' the concept of Constructive Criticism. As you'll probably learn if you take a college-level creative writing course, one of the most ''important things'' about Constructive Criticism is ''don't rewrite the work'' to suit your desires. This is actually one of the ''biggest'' things that people need to learn about being constructive, because it is not very constructive to try to suggest the author to write a work into something that ''you'' want to enjoy. The point is to make it into something that ''they'' want to create. You will notice this as a trend in people who are members of the PeripheryHatedom, especially if they have a BiasSteamroller.

to:

However; you'll notice that most people don't actually ''understand'' the concept of Constructive Criticism. As you'll probably learn if you take a college-level creative writing course, one of the most ''important things'' about Constructive Criticism is ''don't rewrite the work'' to suit your desires. This is actually one of the ''biggest'' things that people need to learn about being constructive, because it is not very constructive to try to suggest the author to write a work into something that ''you'' want to enjoy. The point is to make it into something that ''they'' want to create.''the intended audience'' will like. You will notice this as a trend in people who are members of the PeripheryHatedom, especially if they have a BiasSteamroller.



Unfortunately; finding criticism is rather hard in the internet age. It's easy to ''get'' criticism on the internet, but when it's mixed with the {{GIFT}}, people will often take that as an opportunity to act like a complete dick and call it criticism. If someone walked up to you and asked you for critique and you gave a very rude-sounding critique, then they won't ask you again and you won't get to critique anything. On the internet, there's loads ''loads'' more random people and works to critique, especially since you can find it anytime you want

to:

Unfortunately; finding criticism is rather hard in the internet age. It's easy to ''get'' criticism on the internet, but when it's mixed with the {{GIFT}}, people will often take that as an opportunity to act like a complete dick and call it criticism. If someone walked up to you and asked you for critique and you gave a very rude-sounding critique, then they won't ask you again and you won't get to critique anything. On the internet, there's loads ''loads'' more random people and works to critique, especially since you can find it anytime you want
want.
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