History DethroningMoment / StarTrek

* Tropers/Nebagram: ''Rascals''. Dear god, Rascals. We start with an utterly idiotic plot: the transporter accidentally turns some of the crew into children. Whilst not a bad idea for a show in itself, the away it's executed is utter laziness (transport accident? Again!?) and the show seems happy to gloss over the fact that what they've accidentally stumbled across is nothing less than the secret to immortality itself. At no point during the show was it stated that there were any negative aspects to the transformation other than having to go through adolescence again- after which they'd presumably be healthy twentysomethings. Sure, Picard may have lost his commanding presence, but he's gained a full sixty years extra life. Guinan- one of the other kids transformed- have gained over half a millennium of extra life. This in itself would be forgivable, but then the show goes straight over a cliff by having the Enterprise attacked... By Ferengi. In clapped-out birds of prey, which capture the Enterprise in seconds and force the entire adult crew- all 900+ of them- into slavery. Never mind the fact that we never see more than a dozen Ferengi at any point, never mind the fact that Riker should have obliterated the enemy ships the second they decloaked, never mind the fact that even with Worf incapacitated (again) the Enterprise has dozens of highly-trained security officers who you'd have thought would be able to tear the Ferengi a new one, apparently two Ferengi holding Riker and Data at gunpoint causes the entire ship to fall down in a second and have to be saved by the children... The same way everyone hated Wesley doing in season 1 and 2. This episode is every negative aspect of TNG in one 44-minute long 'example'.

* Tropers/OlfinBedwere: Data's death in ''Film/StarTrekNemesis'' somehow manages to make Kirk [[DroppedABridgeOnHim getting a bridge dropped on him]] seem like a masterpiece of good film-making. Even leaving aside the stupidity of how the situation came around to begin with, the way it's filmed makes it feel like it's just some random redshirt who's dying, not a character we've known and loved for fifteen years. Making things even worse, only twenty seconds after Data's demise the film-makers feel the need to put in a gag about Picard forgetting the bridge viewscreen had been destroyed, which is pretty much the equivalent to Spock's death scene in the second film having a grinning McCoy lean into the frame after Spock expires, saying "He's dead, Jim!" and then winking at the camera.

* 13thman: My pick for ST Voyager has to be "Flesh and Blood". This is actually a retroactive [[DethroningMomentOfSuck DMOS]], starting with "The Killing Game", but it culminates here. Plot summary: the Hirogen are being killed by holodeck technology that Janeway gave them at the end of "The Killing Game". Janeway decides to save the Hirogen from the homicidal holograms against the Hirogen's will. Now that that is out of the way, here's the DMOS: why? Just why? I don't need to go into any particular details about the morals, motivations, actions, or logic of anyone in particular in this episode. All you need to know, in order to understand why Janeway taking the Hirogen's side against ANYBODY (even arguably the ''Borg'') is just wrong, is this: the Hirogen are the serial killers of the galaxy, and possibly the only recurring race that can be considered [[CompleteMonster Complete Monsters]] due entirely to their actions onscreen. The Hirogen's [[PlanetOfHats hat]] is using superior strength and firepower to hunt down any sentient creature, whether or not it is armed, whether or not it is a physical match for them, whether or not said creatures are surrendering, fleeing, trying to make peace with them, whatever. They strip their kills down to the bone and display various body parts around their ships as trophies. These aren't the Cardassians, or the Klingons, or the Romulans, or the Kazon or Jem Hadar, who kill for country, or honor, or for their master or state. Unlike the races just mentioned, there's no such thing as a target being unworthy for any reason (sick, old, not involved in a conflict, etc). The Hirogen kill because it gives them wood. Nowhere is this made more evident than in "The Killing Game", where the Hirogen turn all of Voyager into a holodeck, so they can ''repeatedly kill and resuscitate'' the members of the crew in various fantasies. Their evil is so ridiculous it causes a ''DarthWiki/WallBanger'': the Hirogen get pissed at the doctor because the holodeck weapons are killing the crew members faster than the doctor can resuscitate then, however they refuse to turn on the holodeck safeties, because holodeck safeties make the killing less interesting. Wait - if Holodeck weapons and soldiers are good enough to kill the crew, why waste time with the crew? Why not just turn all the safeties off on the holodeck and shoot at 100 foot lava monsters that bleed fire all day? Well, because like I said before, the Hirogen are the serial killers of the galaxy - their goal isn't to satiate violent urges like a Klingon or Jem Hadar, their goal is to kill people. But, enough about TKG: when "Flesh and Blood" rolls around, the Hirogen have managed to program holograms smart enough to cruelly kill every Hirogen they come across. Given what was just described in TKG, the question we have to ask here is, once again, ''why?'' These serial killers made a weapon so powerful it kills them, and the first time Janeway offers to help, they threaten to turn her into prey, again? Why is there a plot about Janeway detailing the moral and philosophical reasons why Voyager has a duty to help the sadistic homicidal aliens that want nothing more than to kill them all and wear their bones for necklaces? ''[[Series/StarTrekTheNextGeneration Picard]]'' wouldn't have put up with that shit, and he is infamous for being slower on the phaser button than Kirk or Sisko. That Janeway did ANYTHING other than leave these animals to die the KarmicDeath they deserved turns this into a [[DethroningMomentOfSuck DMOS]] for this troper.

* 13thman: My pick for ST Voyager has to be "Flesh and Blood". This is actually a retroactive [[DethroningMomentOfSuck DMOS]], starting with "The Killing Game", but it culminates here. Plot summary: the Hirogen are being killed by holodeck technology that Janeway gave them at the end of "The Killing Game". Janeway decides to save the Hirogen from the homicidal holograms against the Hirogen's will. Now that that is out of the way, here's the DMOS: why? Just why? I don't need to go into any particular details about the morals, motivations, actions, or logic of anyone in particular in this episode. All you need to know, in order to understand why Janeway taking the Hirogen's side against ANYBODY (even arguably the ''Borg'') is just wrong, is this: the Hirogen are the serial killers of the galaxy, and possibly the only recurring race that can be considered [[CompleteMonster Complete Monsters]] due entirely to their actions onscreen. The Hirogen's [[PlanetOfHats hat]] is using superior strength and firepower to hunt down any sentient creature, whether or not it is armed, whether or not it is a physical match for them, whether or not said creatures are surrendering, fleeing, trying to make peace with them, whatever. They strip their kills down to the bone and display various body parts around their ships as trophies. These aren't the Cardassians, or the Klingons, or the Romulans, or the Kazon or Jem Hadar, who kill for country, or honor, or for their master or state. Unlike the races just mentioned, there's no such thing as a target being unworthy for any reason (sick, old, not involved in a conflict, etc). The Hirogen kill because it gives them wood. Nowhere is this made more evident than in "The Killing Game", where the Hirogen turn all of Voyager into a holodeck, so they can ''repeatedly kill and resuscitate'' the members of the crew in various fantasies. Their evil is so ridiculous it causes a ''DarthWiki/WallBanger'': the Hirogen get pissed at the doctor because the holodeck weapons are killing the crew members faster than the doctor can resuscitate then, however they refuse to turn on the holodeck safeties, because holodeck safeties make the killing less interesting. Wait - if Holodeck weapons and soldiers are good enough to kill the crew, why waste time with the crew? Why not just turn all the safeties off on the holodeck and shoot at 100 foot lava monsters that bleed fire all day? Well, because like I said before, the Hirogen are the serial killers of the galaxy - their goal isn't to satiate violent urges like a Klingon or Jem Hadar, their goal is to kill people. But, enough about TKG: when "Flesh and Blood" rolls around, the Hirogen have managed to program holograms smart enough to cruelly kill every Hirogen they come across. Given what was just described in TKG, the question we have to ask here is, once again, ''why?'' These serial killers made a weapon so powerful it kills them, and the first time Janeway offers to help, they threaten to turn her into prey, again? Why is there a plot about Janeway detailing the moral and philosophical reasons why Voyager has a duty to help the sadistic homicidal aliens that want nothing more than to kill them all and wear their bones for necklaces? ''[[StarTrekTheNextGeneration Picard]]'' wouldn't have put up with that shit, and he is infamous for being slower on the phaser button than Kirk or Sisko. That Janeway did ANYTHING other than leave these animals to die the KarmicDeath they deserved turns this into a [[DethroningMomentOfSuck DMOS]] for this troper.

* 13thman: My pick for ST Voyager has to be "Flesh and Blood". This is actually a retroactive [[DethroningMomentOfSuck DMOS]], starting with "The Killing Game", but it culminates here. Plot summary: the Hirogen are being killed by holodeck technology that Janeway gave them at the end of "The Killing Game". Janeway decides to save the Hirogen from the homicidal holograms against the Hirogen's will. Now that that is out of the way, here's the DMOS: why? Just why? I don't need to go into any particular details about the morals, motivations, actions, or logic of anyone in particular in this episode. All you need to know, in order to understand why Janeway taking the Hirogen's side against ANYBODY (even arguably the ''Borg'') is just wrong, is this: the Hirogen are the serial killers of the galaxy, and possibly the only race that can be considered [[CompleteMonster Complete Monsters]] due entirely to their actions onscreen. The Hirogen's [[PlanetOfHats hat]] is using superior strength and firepower to hunt down any sentient creature, whether or not it is armed, whether or not it is a physical match for them, whether or not said creatures are surrendering, fleeing, trying to make peace with them, whatever. They strip their kills down to the bone and display various body parts around their ships as trophies. These aren't the Cardassians, or the Klingons, or the Romulans, or the Kazon or Jem Hadar, who kill for country, or honor, or for their master or state. Unlike the races just mentioned, there's no such thing as a target being unworthy for any reason (sick, old, not involved in a conflict, etc). The Hirogen kill because it gives them wood. Nowhere is this made more evident than in "The Killing Game", where the Hirogen turn all of Voyager into a holodeck, so they can ''repeatedly kill and resuscitate'' the members of the crew in various fantasies. Their evil is so ridiculous it causes a ''DarthWiki/WallBanger'': the Hirogen get pissed at the doctor because the holodeck weapons are killing the crew members faster than the doctor can resuscitate then, however they refuse to turn on the holodeck safeties, because holodeck safeties make the killing less interesting. Wait - if Holodeck weapons and soldiers are good enough to kill the crew, why waste time with the crew? Why not just turn all the safeties off on the holodeck and shoot at 100 foot lava monsters that bleed fire all day? Well, because like I said before, the Hirogen are the serial killers of the galaxy - their goal isn't to satiate violent urges like a Klingon or Jem Hadar, their goal is to kill people. But, enough about TKG: when "Flesh and Blood" rolls around, the Hirogen have managed to program holograms smart enough to cruelly kill every Hirogen they come across. Given what was just described in TKG, the question we have to ask here is, once again, ''why?'' These serial killers made a weapon so powerful it kills them, and the first time Janeway offers to help, they threaten to turn her into prey, again? That Janeway did ANYTHING other than leave these animals to die the KarmicDeath they deserved turns this into a [[DethroningMomentOfSuck DMOS]] for this troper.

* 13thman: My pick for ST Voyager has to be "Flesh and Blood". This is actually a retroactive [[DethroningMomentOfSuck DMOS]], starting with "The Killing Game", but it culminates here. Plot summary: the Hirogen are being killed by holodeck technology that Janeway gave them at the end of "The Killing Game". Janeway decides to save the Hirogen from the homicidal holograms against the Hirogen's will. Now that that is out of the way, here's the DMOS: why? Just why? I don't need to go into any particular details about the morals, motivations, actions, or logic of anyone in particular in this episode. All you need to know, in order to understand why Janeway taking the Hirogen's side against ANYBODY (even arguably the ''Borg'') is just wrong, is this: the Hirogen are the serial killers of the galaxy, and possibly the only race that can be considered [[CompleteMonster Complete Monsters]] due entirely to their actions onscreen. The Hirogen's [[PlanetOfHats hat]] is using superior strength and firepower to hunt down any sentient creature, whether or not it is armed, whether or not it is a physical match for them, whether or not said creatures are surrendering, fleeing, trying to make peace with them, whatever. They strip their kills down to the bone and display various body parts around their ships as trophies. These aren't the Cardassians, or the Klingons, or the Romulans, or the Kazon or Jem Hadar, who kill for country, or honor, or for their master or state. Unlike the races just mentioned, there's no such thing as a target being unworthy for any reason (sick, old, not involved in a conflict, etc). The Hirogen kill because it gives them wood. Nowhere is this made more evident than in "The Killing Game", where the Hirogen turn all of Voyager into a holodeck, so they can ''repeatedly kill and resuscitate'' the members of the crew in various fantasies. Their evil is so ridiculous it causes a ''DarthWiki/WallBanger'': the Hirogen get pissed at the doctor because the holodeck weapons are killing the crew members faster than the doctor can resuscitate then, however they refuse to turn on the holodeck safeties, because holodeck safeties make the killing less interesting. Wait - if Holodeck weapons and soldiers are good enough to kill the crew, why waste time with the crew? Why not just turn all the safeties off on the holodeck and shoot at 100 foot lava monsters that bleed fire all day? Well, because like I said before, the Hirogen are the serial killers of the galaxy - there goal isn't to satiate violent urges like a Klingon or Jem Hadar, their goal is to kill people. But, enough about TKG: when "Flesh and Blood" rolls around, the Hirogen have managed to program holograms smart enough to cruelly kill every Hirogen they come across. Given what was just described in TKG, the question we have to ask here is, once again, ''why?'' These serial killers made a weapon so powerful it kills them, and the first time Janeway offers to help, they threaten to turn her into prey, again? That Janeway did ANYTHING other than leave these animals to die the KarmicDeath they deserved turns this into a [[DethroningMomentOfSuck DMOS]] for this troper.

* 13thman: My pick for ST Voyager has to be "Flesh and Blood". This is actually a retroactive [[DethroningMomentOfSuck DMOS]], starting with "The Killing Game", but it culminates here. Plot summary: the Hirogen are being killed by holodeck technology that Janeway gave them at the end of "The Killing Game". Janeway decides to save the Hirogen from the homicidal holograms against the Hirogen's will. Now that that is out of the way, here's the DMOS: why? Just why? I don't need to go into any particular details about the morals, motivations, actions, or logic of anyone in particular in this episode. All you need to know, in order to understand why Janeway taking the Hirogen's side against ANYBODY (even arguably the ''Borg'') is just wrong, is this: the Hirogen are the serial killers of the galaxy, and possibly the only race that can be considered [[CompleteMonster Complete Monsters]] due entirely to their actions onscreen. The Hirogen's [[PlanetOfHats hat]] is using superior strength and firepower to hunt down any sentient creature, whether or not it is armed, whether or not it is a physical match for them, whether or not said creatures are surrendering, fleeing, trying to make peace with them, whatever. They strip their kills down to the bone and display various body parts around their ships as trophies. These aren't the Cardassians, or the Klingons, or the Romulans, or the Kazon or Jem Hadar, who kill for country, or honor, or for their master or state. Unlike the races just mentioned, there's no such thing as a target being unworthy for any reason (sick, old, not involved in a conflict, etc). The Hirogen kill because it gives them wood. Nowhere is this made more evident than in "The Killing Game", where the Hirogen turn all of Voyager into a holodeck, so they can ''repeatedly kill and resuscitate'' the members of the crew in various fantasies. Their evil is so ridiculous it causes a ''DarthWiki/WallBanger'': the Hirogen get pissed at the doctor because the holodeck weapons are killing the crew members faster than the doctor can resuscitate then, however they refuse to turn on the holodeck safeties, because holodeck safeties make the killing less interesting. Wait - if Holodeck weapons and soldiers are good enough to kill the crew, why waste time with the crew? Why not just turn all the safeties off on the holodeck and shoot at 100 foot lava monsters that bleed fire all day? Well, because like I said before, the Hirogen are the serial killers of the galaxy - there goal isn't to satiate violent urges like a Klingon or Jem Hadar, their goal is to kill people. But, enough about TKG: when "Flesh and Blood" rolls around, the Hirogen have managed to program holograms smart enough to cruelly kill every Hirogen they come across. Given what was just described in TKG, the question we have to ask here is, once again, ''why?'' These serial killers made a weapon so powerful it kills them, and the first time Janeway offers to help, they threaten to turn her into prey, again? That Janeway did ANYTHING other than leave these animals to die the KarmicDeath they deserved turns this into a ''[[DethroningMomentOfSuck DMOS]] for this troper.

** Tropers/{{Tuomas}}: After all the bogus science and general stupidity in ''Threshold'', the final straw, the thing that made this the worst Trek episode I've ever seen, was the last plot twist: the Voyager crew discovers Janeway and Paris, who have devolved into this weird salamander creatures (because that's what traveling at warp 10 does to you)... And they also discover the two have mated and have produced offspring! So in the three days they were missing, they've turned into lizards, mated with each other, and conceived children, and the kids clearly aren't newborn either, so that's one helluva fast reproduction process. Chakotay then inexplicably leaves the baby salamanders on the alien planet, and they are never ever mentioned again. So the whole twist of Janeway and Paris having kids was absolutely pointless: it doesn't have anything to do with the themes of this episode, and it's completely forgotten by the next one. They just added an utterly silly and unscientific plot twist on top of all the other ridiculous things in ''Threshold'' for no reason at all.

* Tropers/{{Tuomas}}: After all the bogus science and general stupidity in ''Threshold'', the final straw, the thing that made this the worst Trek episode I've ever seen, was the last plot twist: the Voyager crew discovers Janeway and Paris, who have devolved into this weird salamander creatures (because that's what traveling at warp 10 does to you)... And they also discover the two have mated and have produced offspring! So in the three days they were missing, they've turned into lizards, mated with each other, and conceived children, and the kids clearly aren't newborn either, so that's one helluva fast reproduction process. Chakotay then inexplicably leaves the baby salamanders on the alien planet, and they are never ever mentioned again. So the whole twist of Janeway and Paris having kids was absolutely pointless: it doesn't have anything to do with the themes of this episode, and it's completely forgotten by the next one. They just added an utterly silly and unscientific plot twist on top of all the other ridiculous things in ''Threshold'' for no reason at all.

* Troper/Hyrin: ''Dark Frontier''. The episode where Janeway gets assimilated ''on purpose'' and the Borg Queen completely loses her shit and starts self-destructing her fleet on a whim. SFDebris's synopsis about this episode is the stuff of legends.

* Tropers/GrumpyOldMan: ''Course: Oblivion'': The episode combines ShootTheShaggyDog with plot holes and contradictions. Not only were a bunch of innocent being killed off for no purpose other than to satisfy the writers' sick desires, but there was ''no reason'' that the silver blood aliens should have come to believe they were the original voyager crew to begin with. Silver blood Tom and Kim, at the least, would have had memories, recent memories at that, to contradict this. And why would silver blood Janeway give order to keep heading for the Alpha Quadrant, even in the face of overwhelming evidence that it meant certain death? Granted, real Janeway didn't always make the most rational of decisions, but it was never on this level of blatant and fagrant stupidity. And since the silver blood being are clearly at least as sentient as the Voyager crew they copied themselves from, it can't be explained by biology. While WordOfGod says that this was an attempt at DarkerAndEdgier, that's really no excuse, as [[TropesAreTools darker and edgier isn't always better]]. If it were, all non-horror genres would be passe by now.

* Troper/Doodler: ''Tattoo''. Chakotay's status as the resident MagicalNativeAmerican varied in levels of offensiveness, but this episode was what proved that the writers had no idea what they were doing. To quote, the reason that the Native Americans are magical? They were [[TouchedByVorlons touched by aliens]], who were played by white actors. [[MightyWhitey White]] [[WhiteMansBurden actors]]. Oh, and until they were touched by these white aliens, they were backwards, language-less cavemen. First time I felt the need to take a shower after watching Star Trek.

* [=InTheGallbladder=]: ''Up the Long Ladder.'' I've seen some pretty bad episodes, but none of them have gotten under my skin as seriously as this one. It starts with a plot that could have seen Pulaski actually demonstrating those positive traits they keep saying she has, then promptly ignores it, but that's not my biggest issue. The A-plot revolves around Star Fleet interacting with the Bringoldis, whose characters amount to "blatant Irish stereotype + blatant 17th-century first world sterotype" and nothing more, but that's not my biggest issue. My biggest issue is ...Riker. The writers turned him into human garbage, then pretty much wrote the script around either justifying or validating his godawful behavior. I could point to many examples, but the biggest one is this: When the Mariposans, who reproduce entirely by cloning, ask Riker for a DNA sample so they can save their colony from the impact of nearly 300 years of replicative fading, he turns them down because he feels that cloning him would make him less special. He is considered to be in the right for this, to the point where he faces no retribution for destroying a clone the Mariposans make of him, using a stolen DNA sample.

* [=InTheGallbladder=]: ''Up the Long Ladder.'' I've seen some pretty bad episodes, but none of them have gotten under my skin as seriously as this one. It starts with a plot that could have seen Pulaski actually demonstrating those positive traits they keep saying she has, then promptly ignores it, but that's not my biggest issue. The A-plot revolves around Star Fleet interacting with the Bringoldis, whose characters amount to "blatant Irish stereotype + blatant 17th-century first world sterotype" and nothing more, but that's not my biggest issue. My biggest issue is ...Riker. The writers turned him into human garbage, then pretty much wrote the script around either justifying or validating his godawful behavior. I could point to many examples, but the biggest one is this: When the Mariposans, who reproduce entirely by cloning, ask Riker for a DNA sample so they can save their colony from the impact of nearly 300 years of replicative fading, he turns them down because he feels that cloning him would make him less special. He is considered to be in the right for this, to the point where he isn't even reprimanded for destroying a clone the Mariposans make of him, using a stolen DNA sample.

* [=InTheGallbladder=]: ''Up the Long Ladder.'' I've seen some pretty bad episodes, but none of them have gotten under my skin as seriously as this one. It starts with a plot that could have seen Pulaski actually demonstrating those positive traits they keep saying she has, then promptly ignores it, but that's not my biggest issue. The A-plot revolves around Star Fleet interacting with the Bringoldis, whose characters amount to "blatant Irish stereotype + blatant 17th-century first world sterotype" and nothing more, but that's not my biggest issue. My biggest issue is ...Riker. The writers turned him into human garbage, then pretty much wrote the plot around either justifying or validating his godawful behavior. I could point to many examples, but the biggest one is this: When the Mariposans, who reproduce entirely by cloning, ask Riker for a DNA sample so they can save their colony from the impact of nearly 300 years of replicative fading, he turns them down because he feels that cloning him would make him less special. He is considered to be in the right for this, to the point where he isn't even reprimanded for destroying a clone the Mariposans make of him, using a stolen DNA sample.

* [=InTheGallbladder=]: ''Up the Long Ladder.'' I've seen some pretty bad episodes, but none of them have gotten under my skin as seriously as this one. It starts with a plot that could have seen Pulaski actually demonstrating those positive traits they keep saying she has, then promptly ignores it, but that's not my biggest issue. The A-plot revolves around Star Fleet interacting with the Bringoldis, whose characters amount to "blatant Irish stereotype + blatant 17th-century first world sterotype" and nothing more, but that's not my biggest issue. My biggest issue is ...Riker. The writers turned him into human garbage, then pretty much wrote the plot around either justifying or validating his godawful behavior. I could point to many examples, but the biggest one is this: When the Mariposans, who reproduce entirely by cloning, ask Riker for a DNA sample so they can save their colony from the impact of nearly 300 years of replicative fading, he turn them down because he feels that cloning him would make him less special. He is portrayed as being in the right.

## Janeway meets the Trabe, the species that the Kazon stole their technology from. When the Trabe fleet runs into Voyager, they even talk with her, instead of immediately shooting, even though their fleet has more than enough ships to destroy Voyager (Just 2 or 3 Kazon ships have been shown to be enough to seriously cripple Voyager, the Trabe have dozens in their fleet). The Trabe are thankful, polite, and eager to make an alliance with Voyager. So when the Trabe want to execute every single Kazon maj, Janeway has a problem with this because? At worst the Trabe are about as crooked as the Kazon, but they don't have a problem with Voyager. They also didn't seem to have a problem with the rest of the quadrant, as according to Neelix, the Trabe seemed to have a very good reputation. The Kazon are at war with everyone, attack and enslave random races, and won't even deal with Voyager, even though Janeway has bent over backwards to try and deal with them. How is dealing with the Trabe a worse deal than dealing with the Kazon again?

## As part of the alliance, Culluh makes the demand that they do a crew swap. Voyager is leaving the quadrant forever, why would Janeway agree to that, and why would Culluh, mysoginist or no, even think that Janeway would agree to that?

* Tropers/IraStevenBehrSucks: The part in ''What You Leave Behind'' where cured the changelings. Sure, it's prefaced as a peace brokering deal, but the changelings had a history of violence and genocide, to trust that this would never happen again is, at best, extremely naive.