This is discussion archived from a time before the current discussion method was installed.
Vulpy: Pat on the back for me!
*This troper is quite certain the developers made about 25-50% of the Riddler secrets mindlessly obscure on purpose just to make [the Riddler's taunt that you're looking things up on the internet] really resonate with most players.
Found most of them by myself (though those handy Riddler-made maps were a Godsend). Then, I received said message. I resolved that I would find the rest of them without help. And I did. :)
In other news... I pulled/moved/rewrote some of the following exchange (previously under Why Don't You Just Shoot Him?, now under Fridge Logic):
- Did it strike nobody as strange when, over halfway into the game Batman just suddenly produced the gadget that allowed him to override the forcefield walls? How long did you have that, Bats?? Or of course there's the end of the game, when He calls his remote-controlled plane, The Batwing, to come pick him up since the Batmobile got trashed. Did you just forget about that during your entire entrapment?
- About the forcefield override, Batman needed the Warden's card in order to get the gadget to work, and he was too busy (saving Gordon and Doctor Young) to immediately head for Sharp. As for the Batwing, Batman needed to stop the inmates; the Batwing would've been of limited utility inside the buildings.
- Not to mention he did use the batwing during the game. It delivered the zipline. Other than that, he presumably didn't think it would be useful.
- Another possibility is that the in-game Batwing isn't armed. Remember, you are not working out of the normal batcave here.
- And even worse is the batclaw and ultra batclaw upgrades. You get both of them in the Batcave. At different points in the game. Why not just take the ultra batclaw when he was first in the Batcave?
- Plenty of possible reasons: 1) Expediency: he didn't really have time to get some of the equipment. 2) Need: he didn't need the equipment until he needed it. 3) Weight: Presumably, although he can carry all the equipment, presumably it weighs a bit and he didn't think he'd need it. In addition, the beginning of the game has Batman successfully capturing the Joker and bringing him to the heavily fortified Asylum in question. Other than his Batarangs, which he always carries, he doesn't really need anything else just to deliver a prisoner.
- 1) That's why I asked why he didn't bring it in with him. You know, from all the crime fighting he was doing before he brought the Joker back to Arkham? Batman, after all, is Crazy-Prepared. Why would he EVER go ANYWHERE without all his stuff? If he can carry all of it at once there's no reason to leave any of it behind. 2) How does he know what he'll need before he needs it? Isn't the whole point of being Crazy-Prepared that you're always carrying around all sorts of stuff just in case you might need it? Again, if he can carry it all at once there's no reason to leave any of it behind. 3) Except at no point do we see Batman struggling under the weight of all his extra equipment. Yet again, if he can carry it all at once there's no reason to leave any of it behind.
- Did it strike nobody as strange when, over halfway into the game Batman just suddenly produced the gadget that allowed him to override the forcefield walls? How long did you have that, Bats?? Or of course there's the end of the game, when He calls his remote-controlled plane, The Batwing, to come pick him up since the Batmobile got trashed. Did you just forget about that during your entire entrapment?
While a good point, it doesn't have anything to do with shooting anyone, and the conversation on the main page was getting unwieldy.
Professionalism aside, let me take a moment and gush about how wonderful it is to have a Batman video game that delivers an authentic-feeling Batman experience.
gryffinp: I feel that the potlinking on the Joker quote is inappropriate. Not as in PC, but in fact. Let's face it, any of Joker's goons trying to rape Harley Quinn would very very rapidly regret their actions. Either that or she'd enjoy it.
- Or, ya know, she'd beat 'em up and kill them herself. Most of the times it isn't obvious (but then, it isn't obvious with the Joker either) but she's actually suppose to be a decent fighter and while not a killer like the Joker, isn't shy about inflicting harm. Sure, she isn't a match for most superheroes but she's also leagues ahead of even Elite Mooks.
- Let's face it, this Joker found what Zsasz did to Doctor Young hilarious and joked that beating up Harley was his job. He'd do it just because people wouldn't think he'd do it.
KJMackley: Most of the Continuity Nod examples would go under Mythology Gag, as we don't actually know if certain stories are meant in the exact same way as it happened in whatever past story it is referring to. While this game is practically the combination of all incarnations of Batman, it is still in its own continuity.
Paul A: Conversation In The Main Page. Yes, the Monster Clown conversation is awesome, but it's still natter.
- Absurdly Spacious Sewer: Though considering it serves as Killer Croc's cell/lair, this can be considered a Justified Trope.
- Why did the asylum give him such a huge cell? How do they get him into therapy sessons? How do they ensure he doesn't dig a tunnel out underwater?
- This troper took the impression that he had already broken out of the original bounds of his confinement to the main sewer system of the island, but couldn't get any further than that. He no longer gets therapy sessions, or any other kind of human interaction, besides meat thrown in at regular intervals, if officer Cash is to be believed.
- That can't be the case, they show him being moved during the introsequence of the game. The much more likely scenario is that whenever they want croc to come up they just shock him till he gets the message then they send a platoon of armed guards to direct him where he is suppose to go.
- They also say that his shock collar barely tickles him. Besides, the room before you enter Croc's Lair has a meat locker and a schedule board on the wall, lending credence to the "they just feed him periodically" theory.
- Wasn't he the one to say that it barely tickled? And there is a whole portion of the game dedicated to exploiting the collar to immobilize him.
- In the Medical Ward, there is a cell that seems to have been for holding Croc... and that same cell has been busted open with dead bodies and claw marks on the wall. At any rate, the staff seems happy enough to simply keep Croc under control and in a limited area since on a physical level, he's one of the most physically dangerous inmates.
- Anti-Climax Boss: Titan-powered Joker. Wait, all you do is run around avoiding his attacks for a moment, beat more generic thugs, then use the grapple gun on him? Three times?
- Considering that Joker knows Bats has spent the night beating up Bane and Titan powered henchmen, and the news helicopter showing up as a distraction, it makes sense that Joker would want to back off.
- After replaying this boss, I think Titan Joker didn't do much, in addition to the reasons above, was because he didn't have enough room to flaunt his strength. You fight in a small ring with electrified walls, and Joker more than likely didn't realize he could withstand the shock from the walls.
- It's worth mentioning as well that this wasn't the fight Titan Joker planned. What he wanted was for Bats to go Titan along with him and have a huge fight in the ring. When he didn't get it, he must've just improvised.
- It would seem Your Mileage May Vary for Killer Croc. It was either a tense slog through a Nightmare Fuel refinery, or a tedious exercise in walking slowly and occassionally slapping Croc down, which given how hyped he was, could definitely be an anticlimax.
- And finally, Harley Quinn. The anti-climatic part being you never actually fight her. After all the buildup to the confrontation, she gets beaten in a cutscene.
- Awesome, yet Impractical: Likewise, the inverted takedown (perch above a mook, drop down on a grappling line, grab him, pull him up 20 feet or so and then drop him again) is badass, but also the noisiest possible way to knock out an enemy, and guaranteed to get you shot if any of his friends have guns.
- The Inverted Takedown won't get you shot as long as you immediately move to another gargoyle afterwards. I got a good third of my stealth takedowns with it and never got shot for it.
- Ax-Crazy: Zsasz.
- This troper had never heard of Zsasz before. She now knows why he doesn't show up in the animated shows.
- Or any of the villains really. Special mention to Amadeus Arkham, where you can even see his slow decent into Ax-Crazy in the "Spirit of Arkham" bios.
- Wait until you get the final Spirit of Arkham recording and find out just who is behind all those markings.
- It's quite possible that the real Amadeus was crazier than his Spirit, but not by much. The Spirit only beat on helpless inmates, and didn't eat his family. The first few Spirit of Arkham markings you find are just what the Spirit knows of Amadeus Arkham's history.
- Along with the "any of the villains" theme - who knew the Riddler could be so scary?! His Patient Interview tapes were incredibly well-done. It felt like he could just snap at any moment.
- Badass Normal: Take a wild guess.
- ...Gordon?
- Breaking the Fourth Wall: Done twice quite well. First, when your console seems to spaz out and your game suddenly start all over, before revealing itself to be another Scarecrow trick. Second, if you find enough Riddler secrets, the Riddler calls you and asks if you're cheating and are using the internet. If you're using a walkthrough (which isn't out anywhere at the time of this writing) then face it: the Riddler got your number.
- There's a good chance the developers made about 25-50% of the Riddler secrets mindlessly obscure on purpose just to make that message really resonate with most players.
- When you visit the visitor's centre for the first time, the Joker asks Batman what his identity is and why he fights. However, it seems like the question was more directed toward the player, rather than Batman himself. The fact that this sequence forces the camera into first person lends credence to that idea.
Joker: Come in! Sit down! Take off your mask! So Bats, I was thinking: you could really use a friend in here. Someone to talk to, share secrets with. Shall we start with the big one? Who is that behind the mask? Why do you feel the need to go out into the world and fight people like me? Do you really think you can win? We'll see...
- Brother Chuck: No love for Man-Bat? The Ratcatcher gets a Shout-Out, but Man-Bat, who has been around since the seventies, gets nothing.
- Man-Bat not getting a mention (while Tweedles Dee and Dumb do) is bad enough, but what about Robin (any of them)?
- Joker did vaguely mention Robin. Go talk to him in the visitor center after capturing Harley. Paraphrased: "Harley failed me and now she's dead to me, do you punish your hired help when they fail you or is that saucy outfit you make him wear punishment enough?"
- Man-Bat not getting a mention (while Tweedles Dee and Dumb do) is bad enough, but what about Robin (any of them)?
- High Octane Nightmare Fuel: Batman trapped in a decaying hospital of horrors, surrounded by his entire Rogues Gallery, and slugging it out with the Joker??
- In an in-universe example, you are the Nightmare Fuel for the Asylum mooks, swinging down from the rafters... cause you're the goddamn Batman. From the nervous chatter that the enemies give out, even when outnumbering and outgunning Batman by six to one, it's clear who's the prey. If not, keep dwindling their numbers and watch them look over their shoulders in jittering fear... and shooting at any small noise (whether provoked by you or not). Hell, just watch as a group of enemies comes towards you. Don't attack them right away. They'll hesitate, until one of them gathers the courage to attack.
- In addition to this, it doesn't help the mooks that Joker's saying things like, "Don't worry boys, I'm reasonably sure there's no truth to the rumor that Batman drinks human blood! At least I don't think so..."
- In Detective Mode, you can see the heart rates of others. When knocked unconscious it's 30 beats per minute. Normal rate is 80 BPM. When encountering Batman it immediately jumps to 120 BPM. If you string up five members of a six-man group of enemies, then the heart rate of the last remaining mook shoots all the way up to 160 BPM— the same heart rate given to the people clinging to a ledge, about to fall to their to certain death. And if you drop down in front of the last one, he'll freak out for a few seconds before he remembers to start shooting.
- Even when crawling around Killer Croc's lair Batman hardly plays like a prey.
- Conversely, in the Downloadable Content the Joker is the Nightmare Fuel for the Asylum guards, who are arguably in an even worse situation then the mooks with Batman. For all his scariness, Batman doesn't kill while the Joker has no such reservations.
- The morgue area, where Batman falls prey to Scarecrow's literal nightmare fuel and sees Gordon die followed by his dead parents. Scarecrow's redesign is ridiculously creepy in of itself, but when you wear a freaking syringe glove, that's kind of expected.
- It's been done. Especially in the third movie ("Let's get high!")
- And the third and final time Batman succumbs to the same gas, admit it: you freaked out over the faux console freezing. Somewhat creepier when played on a Xbox 360, considering its infamous history with RRODs.
- I didn't freak out because I didn't forget that I was playing an Xbox that used C Ds, not NES cartridges.
- Although you can hit the dashboard button on the controller to reveal that the console is not broken.
- There's also Batman coughing as he did preceding every other scarecrow moment, plus the "*DING DONG* (Female PA voice): Did anyone catch the game last night?" immediately preceding the "crash" that helps to indicate this is a scarecrow moment. It's still masterfully done.
- I played that segment on the PC while drunk, a month ago. Till I came here, I actually had no idea whether the glitch breakdown I saw was real. I'm very happy that I didn't have an insane alcohol-induced hallucination. Rocksteady, you have my money for all future releases.
- Most of the audio tapes, particularly Zsasz's and the Riddler's. The fact that Arkham Asylum took advantage of the Riddler's canonical craziness and made him a legitimately scary villain is practically a CMOA for the game.
- Oh God, the Zsasz tapes! Especially the final one, where he kills Dr. Cassidy.
- Actually Dr. Cassidy isn't killed. There's a comic that comes packaged with the game (not sure if every copy has this) that shows Batman saved her just in the nick of time. In the game itself, we don't actually hear anything that confirms she was murdered anyway, we just know that Zsasz was at her door and she was about to answer it. Still doesn't make it any less creepy though, considering Zsasz knew where she lived and the first thing he does after breaking out is pay her a house visit.
- Also I may be mistaken, but don't you run into Cassidy during the course of the game? I think she's in the Medical building.
- Yes, you do. She's the redhead doctor who Batman encounters in the Medical Facility. AND she even survives the events of the game as well.
- Although Your Mileage May Vary (a lot of people found this segment boring), the slow sequence in Croc's lair terrified this troper, who had to take breaks from playing it because Croc kept startling her and causing her to accidentally run into the water.
- In an in-universe example, you are the Nightmare Fuel for the Asylum mooks, swinging down from the rafters... cause you're the goddamn Batman. From the nervous chatter that the enemies give out, even when outnumbering and outgunning Batman by six to one, it's clear who's the prey. If not, keep dwindling their numbers and watch them look over their shoulders in jittering fear... and shooting at any small noise (whether provoked by you or not). Hell, just watch as a group of enemies comes towards you. Don't attack them right away. They'll hesitate, until one of them gathers the courage to attack.
- Missed Moment of Awesome: Sort of. The game provides bios for a good number of Batman's Rogues Gallery that don't appear in the game as rewards.
- You also never get to fight Killer Croc proper, despite the trailers teasing such a battle.
- Harley either, for that matter. After all the acrobatics she showed off, she gets batted aside pretty easily.
- Well, in Harley's defense, the game makes it quite clear that any villain that isn't super strong or packing exotic weapons is basically fodder for Batman. Even the ones that have powers or tools become fodder once he gets past their gimmick. Hell, Zsasz is a high-security henchman with a name and Scarecrow can't do anything except run away once Batman overpowers his fear toxin.
- But Comics! Harley, who is presumably the one used in this game, does have mild super strength and agility, and this is hinted at in her Character Profile (which says she has "unusually high strength and agility") She would at least give a better fight than the did.
- You're comparing someone that above average skill to Batman, who is the apix of the human. It's like putting Hawkman against Darkseid.
- Monster Clown: You have one guess. ONE. GUESS.
- Two-Face?
- I think he meant the Mad Hatter.
- It's obviously Harley Quinn.
- Jesus, he said monster, man. It's Croc.
- Seriously guys, monster and clown. It can only be the Titan-infected henchmen with clown make-up.
- Clearly it's Batman, I mean, how angry can a clown get?
- Come on guys, with an outfit and sense of humor like that, it can only be the Riddler.
- This is simultaneously saddening and hilarious.
- I think I've got it... Dresses garishly... Has a twisted sense of humour... Always smiling and laughing... it's BATMAN!!!
- All of you are wrong. It's Old Man Jenkins!
- And I would have gotten away with it too, if it weren't for you meddling Tropers!
- And that goddamn Batman!
- It's the Joker.
- I don't see it.
- Now you're just making shit up.
- Bullshit, we know the Joker is insane, but he has his soft side too. He is not a Complete Monster.
- Hey there, original "ONE. GUESS." Guy here, and I must say, I'm very disappointed in all of you. I obviously meant Tweedledee and Tweedledum.
- You're sure it's not The Penguin?
- I still think it's Alfred.
- Or Sudowoodo.
- But wait! 'Clown' starts with 'C'! 'C'? 'C' for Catwoman!
Insanity Prelude: Come on, guys, let them have their fun. It's really not hurting anything.
KJMackley: I took out the Five Bad Band because they aren't portrayed as being a villain team-up. It seems more that the Joker released them and allowed them to do their own thing / sick them on Batman. The Joker did it purely for chaos and they weren't working together towards a common cause.
- Five Bad Band
- The Big Bad: Joker.
- The Dragon: Bane. Harley would qualify, if she actually did any fighting.
- The Evil Genius: Scarecrow
- The Brute: Croc
- The Dark Chick: Poison Ivy
- Would Bane really count as the Dragon, though? He's actually the first supervillain you take down, not the final major challenge before facing the villain.
32_Footsteps: Can't figure out where to put it in the article... but The Joker on Titan doubles in height, increases in volume so much more, and I've never, in my whole life, been so thankful for a pair of stretched-out purple pants.
Paul A: "Magic Pants"?
