| 1 | %% |
| 2 | %%Image selected per Image Pickin' thread: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=16733767010.11428100 |
| 3 | %%Please don't change or remove without starting a new thread. |
| 4 | %% |
| 5 | [[quoteright:300:[[ComicBook/{{Superboy}} https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/78b85cb7cdb02ac23ba3c76724dde282.jpg]]]] |
| 6 | %% |
| 7 | ->''"If you will not be turned, you will be destroyed!"'' |
| 8 | -->-- '''Emperor Palpatine''', ''Film/ReturnOfTheJedi'' |
| 9 | %% One quote per main page, please. |
| 10 | |
| 11 | The BigBad makes you AnOfferYouCantRefuse, either join his organization of evil, or die right here and now. Sometimes this is accompanied by a WeCanRuleTogether, but not always. This offer is not always made to TheHero, it can just as easily be to a rival, or simply a promising recruit that the BigBad can't afford to have opposing him. Nor does it necessarily have to be a villain making the offer. Some heroes may use these words to [[RousingSpeech rally people to their cause]] in the face of attack, or TheMenInBlack may give this ultimatum to those who [[BrokenMasquerade break the masquerade.]] |
| 12 | |
| 13 | A subtrope of WithUsOrAgainstUs. Supertrope of MutantDraftBoard. Compare SadisticChoice, AnOfferYouCantRefuse and DefeatMeansFriendship for a more family-friendly version of this trope. Related to WhyDontYaJustShootHim |
| 14 | |
| 15 | [[JustForFun/IThoughtItMeant Not to be confused]] with [[Creator/BenjaminFranklin Ben Franklin's]] famous [[UsefulNotes/TheAmericanRevolution Revolutionary]]-era PoliticalCartoon, which was about DividedWeFall (i.e. "join together or our enemy will kill us"). |
| 16 | |
| 17 | Unmarked spoilers ahoy. |
| 18 | |
| 19 | ---- |
| 20 | !!Examples: |
| 21 | |
| 22 | [[foldercontrol]] |
| 23 | |
| 24 | [[folder:Anime and Manga]] |
| 25 | * ''Manga/{{Blattodea}}'': Implied when Hanakamakiri declares Alice the new "Boss" while backed up by a squad of armed soldiers and Alice has no choice but to follow. After Alice defeats Hanakamakiri in her escape attempt, Bekkobachi directly orders her to do what they say or die. Alice ends up accepting the deal, so long as nobody tries to erase her name and sense of self. |
| 26 | * In ''Anime/DarlingInTheFranxx'', [[spoiler:VIRM, the series' GreaterScopeVillain]] operates this way. [[spoiler:A HiveMind of ascended EnergyBeings, they regard other sapient races with CondescendingCompassion for their mortal, turbulent existence, and they seek to mend this by [[AssimilationPlot assimilating all other sentient life forms into their collective.]] A race that refuses, as the [[{{Ultraterrestrials}} Klaxo sapiens]] did, is summarily attacked with intent of [[FinalSolution extermination]].]] |
| 27 | * In ''Anime/DragonBallZ'', this is Frieza's main method of recruitment. According to dialogue amongst Frieza's henchmen (which was drastically changed in the Funimation dubbing), Frieza's modus operandi was to wipe out all but the most promising or useful individuals of a race and offer them a place in his empire. He promised those that joined that their race would eventually gain a more prestigious place in his New Order and those that refused were simply made extinct. Frieza even makes this offer to [[ProudWarriorRaceGuy Nail]], [[TheLancer Piccolo]] and [[TheHero Goku]] while fighting them during his arc, as they're each significantly stronger than most of his army, though he fully expects them to refuse and die. |
| 28 | * ''Manga/TheLoveAndCreedOfSaeMaki'': The offer made by Sae during Sae's Court, she declares Kokai guilty of crimes against her and demands he choose between submission or elimination. He instead chooses to Take a Third Option by pulling a gun on her. |
| 29 | * ''Manga/OnePiece'': This is Kaido's M.O, if there's a strong pirate that get his liking he'll offer them a position in his crew. If they refuse, he'll throw them into his prison and try to break their spirits until they eventually do so. If they still resist, he'll ultimately dispose of them. It's revealed a good portion of his crew are former pirate captains who took his deal. |
| 30 | [[/folder]] |
| 31 | |
| 32 | [[folder:Comic Books]] |
| 33 | * ''ComicBook/{{Alix}}'': DĂ©lia, Queen of the Amazons, gave women this ultimatum: join her in her revolution against the Romans or die. Anyone women who refuse are killed on the spot. |
| 34 | * ''ComicBook/{{Chariot}}'': There's a reason that tagline of the book is "Ride or Die." Gillian (the spirit trapped in the Chariot) tells Jim that she needs him to help her, otherwise she can make his life very difficult. |
| 35 | -->'''Gillian:''' ''"Here's the deal. You help me find a body. I help you drop your balls and actually make something of your life. But I will not wind up in some government lab. You will keep me a secret. Or I will destroy what little you have. We clear?"'' |
| 36 | * The credo of the Church of Universal Truth, occasional adversaries of the ComicBook/GuardiansOfTheGalaxy, is "convert or die". And with a very large, very strong army, they're very good at delivering on that second part. They're able to level some planets in a matter of hours, in fact. Also used by name when King Blastaar takes over the Negative Zone prison. A few of the surviving prisoners were given the choice. Blastaar actually bothers [[AskAStupidQuestion asking what happened to the ones that refused it]]. [[spoiler:They died.]] |
| 37 | * ''ComicBook/TheTransformersMegaseries'': The planet-destroying Reapers want the Decepticon PersonOfMassDestruction Sixshot to join their ranks, and while they give him time to think about it, they ''won’t'' take no for an answer. Their leader outright tells him to join their crusade or die the next time they meet. |
| 38 | * ''ComicBook/WonderWoman1987'': Widow Sazia approaches the men once under her husband's control in the mob who didn't immediately side with her in the MobWar following his murder in small groups and graphically kills the first to indignantly turn her down before repeating her offer to the remainder. |
| 39 | * In ''ComicBook/EndOfTheSpiderVerse'', this is the fate of many of the Spider-Totems who are confronted by their transformed Wasp-Totem brethren. [[spoiler:Those who don't turn are RetGone]]. |
| 40 | * ''ComicBook/{{Invincible}}'' has the Viltrum Empire, of which Nolan Grayson[=/=]Omni-Man is a part. Those who accept Viltrumite rule become vassals of the empire, with all the benefits thereof. Those who don't will either be made to submit, or exterminated. This is why Nolan came to Earth in the first place: to prepare it for Viltrumite rule. |
| 41 | [[/folder]] |
| 42 | |
| 43 | [[folder:Fan Works]] |
| 44 | * ''Fanfic/ChildOfTheStorm'': |
| 45 | ** Lucius Malfoy offers this to the Ministry in chapter 72 of the first book. Arthur Weasley is one of those who turns him down. |
| 46 | -->Go fuck yourself, Lucius. |
| 47 | ** This is functionally Surtur's method of recruitment, both in the past and the present. He welcomed defectors, granting them powers beyond their wildest dreams, but as the sequel demonstrates, he doesn't take very well to the word "no." |
| 48 | * In ''ComicBook/{{Supergirl}}'' fanfic ''Fanfic/HellsisterTrilogy'', evil sorcerer Mordru is putting together an army to destroy the Legion of Super-Heroes. He gives his prospect recruits one choice: follow him or die right away. |
| 49 | -->'''Mordru:''' I am gathering a strike force to confound or destroy my enemies. Though my power dwarfs that of any single being, I cannot function in many places at once... not with full coordination of purpose. I have brought you here to work as some of my agents. Accede, and great wealth and power shall be given you. That, and the lives of your old enemies, whom I will send you against. Refuse, and you die on the spot. Make your decision. |
| 50 | * ''Fanfic/CodePrime'': During his NewEraSpeech to the people of Earth in Chapter 35 of ''R1'', following his announcement of [[spoiler: [[EvilerThanThou the Decepticons' conquest of Britannia]]]], [[Characters/CodePrimeMegatron Megatron]] tells humanity to either surrender to him or be destroyed. |
| 51 | [[/folder]] |
| 52 | |
| 53 | [[folder:Film -- Animated]] |
| 54 | * In ''WesternAnimation/PeterPan'', Captain Hook gives Wendy and the boys the option of joining his crew or WalkingThePlank. |
| 55 | * ''WesternAnimation/IceAgeContinentalDrift'': |
| 56 | -->'''Manny:''' Look, as much as I'm tempted to join a monkey... the Easter Bunny and a giant bag of pudding... I'll pass. No one's going to stop me from getting back to my family!\ |
| 57 | '''Captain Gutt:''' That family is going to be the death of you! |
| 58 | * ''WesternAnimation/TheTransformersTheMovie'': Unicron summons the dying Megatron while he's adrift in space and orders him to destroy the Matrix of Leadership for him. In return, Unicron offered to provide Megatron with a new body and new troops to command. Megatron then demanded ''more'' and defiantly denied that he belonged to Unicron now. Unicron then made it clear that if Megatron wouldn't serve him he'd be Unicron's snack and prepared to devour him. Megatron quickly decided Unicron's terms were acceptable after all. |
| 59 | [[/folder]] |
| 60 | |
| 61 | [[folder:Film -- Live-Action]] |
| 62 | * ''Film/IronMan'': The Nine Rings attack villages and either kill or capture the men. Then, they take their women and children to an unknown location where they're used as collateral. The men are asked to join them, with their families' lives, as well as their own, on their line if they refuse. This is TruthInTelevision for many terrorist groups and militaristic regimes. |
| 63 | * ''Film/{{Flash Gordon|1980}}''. Emperor Ming offers to let Flash join him and rule the Earth under Ming's control. If he refuses, he will be killed. |
| 64 | * ''Franchise/StarWars'': In ''Film/TheEmpireStrikesBack'', Vader tells the Emperor that this will be the choice he will give Luke. Vader instead gives Luke a WeCanRuleTogether. When Luke hesitates, Vader finally implies this to Luke saying that he must come with him as it is the only way. In ''Film/ReturnOfTheJedi'', The Emperor makes the same offer to Luke, leading to the page quote. |
| 65 | * In ''Film/RobinHoodPrinceOfThieves'' the Sheriff of Nottingham gives Lord Locksley the choice to join up or die. Cue DyingMomentOfAwesome. |
| 66 | * ''Film/SpaceMutiny'': Variant. Kalgan offers a technician who discovers his evil plot to either join or be cyrogenically frozen. The Techinican made the third choice of dying. Kalgan obliged. |
| 67 | * In the movie ''Film/{{Nikita}}'', and [[Series/LaFemmeNikita the TV show based on the movie]], this is how the title character is recruited as an assassin. |
| 68 | * What the people in the Tribulation period in the ''Film/{{Apocalypse}}'' film series are confronted with when they meet Franco [=Macalousso=]'s DigitalAvatar in the Day Of Wonders program...either take the MarkOfTheBeast and join his side, or die by whatever virtual means the program has in store for you (usually decapitation). |
| 69 | * In ''Film/TheChroniclesOfRiddick'', the Necromongers give this offer to the races they conquer. |
| 70 | -->'''Lord Marshal''': (''after killing a guy [[YourSoulIsMine by ripping his soul out]]'') Join him, or join me. |
| 71 | * In ''Film/Aquaman2018'', to expand his armies to invade the surface world, Orm threatens the Fishermen kingdom and then the Brine Kingdom. Ricou, the Fisherman King, refuses, gets murdered by Orm who then forces Ricuo's daughter to cooperate. The Brine King outright refuses and to Orm, ThisMeansWar. |
| 72 | [[/folder]] |
| 73 | |
| 74 | [[folder:Literature]] |
| 75 | * ''Literature/CiaphasCain'': After witnessing a fight with a faction she is [[TheMasquerade not even supposed to know exists]], Zemelda Cleat is WelcomedToTheMasquerade by the Inquisitor Amberley Vail as part of her entourage - something that surprises Cain, who assumed she would simply be KilledToUpholdTheMasquerade. It is ''strongly'' implied that Amberley would have executed her on the spot if she had refused, however. |
| 76 | * In ''Literature/{{Dragonlance}}'' one of the three [[EvilCounterpart Nerakan Knights]] orders' motto is "Submit or Die". |
| 77 | * Inverted in ''Literature/TheNightsDawnTrilogy'' where the Confederation armada is [[spoiler: intercepted by the much superior Organisation fleet at Tranquility, and is given the ultimatum "Surrender and join us, or [[InvertedTrope die and join us]]". The inversion is justified as the Organisation are basically made up of souls come back from the "beyond" to possess still living people.]] |
| 78 | * ''Literature/HarryPotter'': Standard operating procedure for Lord Voldemort. This is how he got [[spoiler:Peter Pettigrew]] to defect to his Death Eaters. And it's said in ''Literature/HarryPotterAndThePhilosophersStone'' that he killed James and Lily Potter because they refused to join him. |
| 79 | * In ''Literature/GrooshamGrange'', [[spoiler:every student at the Grange, sooner or later,]] is given this choice. |
| 80 | * In ''Literature/TheDresdenFiles'': |
| 81 | ** Nicodemus gives Harry an offer: take up one of the [[ThirtyPiecesOfSilver 30 silver coins]] and join the [[NamesToRunAwayFromReallyFast Order of the Blackened Denarius]], or Nicodemus will slit his throat once he's done eating breakfast. Nicodemus believes very strongly in PragmaticVillainy. |
| 82 | ** ''Literature/DeadBeat'', however, references but averts this trope: after fighting and defeating Dresden, Kumori says she'll make him an offer. Dresden guesses it's this, but Kumori says he's too inexperienced. (He gets it right on the second try, though: ''leave'' or die.) |
| 83 | ** And in ''Literature/ColdDays'', the Outsiders gave him first this offer, and then the other, in quick succession. He wasn't lying when he said, in ''Dead Beat'', that these were the two offers he seems to get all the time. |
| 84 | ** In ''Literature/PeaceTalks'', [[spoiler: Ethniu the Last Titan]] announces to the supernatural nations assembled at the titular PeaceConference that she's about to wage war on humanity, and tells them that they can either stand with her or burn with the humans. |
| 85 | * ''Literature/TheReynardCycle'': |
| 86 | ** Count Bricemer makes this offer to the crew of the Quicksilver. [[spoiler: Later, he reneges on the deal.]] |
| 87 | ** [[spoiler: Reynard himself offers this choice to his defeated enemies quite often. By ''Defender of the Crown' he's assembled a PraetorianGuard made up of Calvarians.]] |
| 88 | * In ''Literature/ASongOfIceAndFire,'' the wildlings give this offer to Jon Snow when he and his partner Qhorin Halfhand are captured. However, to make sure he's truly switched sides, [[IfYoureSoEvilEatThisKitten they also force him to kill Qhorin]]. |
| 89 | * In Creator/ChristopherPike's ''The Last Vampire'' series, this is how Sita became the eponymous vampire: the other vampires gave her a choice between either being turned or dying; she would have chosen death except that they also threatened to kill her husband and child. |
| 90 | * ''Literature/LegacyOfTheAldenata'': In ''When The Devil Dances'', Mike O'Neal Sr is approached by an old acquaintance from his mercenary days, and offered a position in a shadowy KnightTemplar organization with access to Galactic technology. The acquaintance was about to kill O'Neal if he declined the offer for [[HeKnowsTooMuch knowing too much]] about the organization, until Mike was rescued [[spoiler:by his grand daughter]], the acquaintance's brains being [[BoomHeadshot ballistically scattered]] around the room. |
| 91 | * In one ''Literature/ChooseYourOwnAdventure'' book, the protagonist can discover the owner of an amusement park bribing a safety inspector to overlook some serious safety hazards. When the owner and his clown henchman notice you the owner offers you a thousand dollars to keep quiet or else. If the protagonist refuses they try to kill him. If the protagonist accepts the bribe and rats them out anyway, the clown arranges an [[MakeItLookLikeAnAccident "accident"]]. If the protagonist accepts the bribe and keeps quiet the clown will sweeten the deal with an extra hundred dollars as a present. The protagonist has mixed feelings about this since it means the villains believe that he is on their side and can be counted on for future favors. |
| 92 | * ''Literature/CheatMagicianLifeThatStartedFromBeingJudgedUseless'': Immediately after the summoning ritual is over, Camilla Resenberg makes it abundantly clear that the people she summoned are to join her army, at sword-point, or be killed, and to prove she's not bluffing, sends Kento into a dangerous forest, and after finding bloody remains of his clothing, reports to the rest that he died, eaten by monsters. |
| 93 | * In ''Literature/CityOfHeavenlyFire'', [[spoiler:Jonathan/Sebastian does this while turning the Endarkened Ones using the Infernal Cup]]. If they're too young or old to be turned he just kills them. |
| 94 | * In ''Literature/TheDinosaurLords'', Raguel's ultimatum to all of Providence is to either join the horde or be killed by the horde. |
| 95 | * In ''Literature/TheVampireChronicles'' Akasha annihilates most of her vampire progeny and then gives an ultimatum of this nature to the survivors: they can either help her create new world order, or die. None of them agrees. |
| 96 | * In the ''Literature/WarriorCats'' series, this is how Tigerstar operates. One particularly notable moment is when his son defied him: |
| 97 | -->'''Bramblepaw:''' Join ''you''? After everything you've done? I'd rather die! \ |
| 98 | '''Tigerstar:''' Are you sure? I won't make the offer twice. Join me now, or you ''will'' die.\ |
| 99 | '''Bramblepaw:''' Then at least I'll go to [[{{Heaven}} StarClan]] as a loyal [=ThunderClan=] cat.\ |
| 100 | '''Tigerstar:''' [[YouFool Fool!]] Stay, then, and die with these other fools. |
| 101 | [[/folder]] |
| 102 | |
| 103 | [[folder:Live Action TV]] |
| 104 | * In ''Series/BurnNotice'', Michael has this conversation with Sam: |
| 105 | -->'''Michael:''' I've been given a new job.\ |
| 106 | '''Sam:''' What's it pay?\ |
| 107 | '''Michael:''' it's more like you do this for us or you die.\ |
| 108 | '''Sam:''' Oh, never liked those. |
| 109 | * ''Series/DoctorWho'': The Cybermen operate by this creed. Exemplified by the Cybus Cybermen in their [[Recap/DoctorWhoS28E5RiseOfTheCybermen introduction]]. |
| 110 | -->'''Cyberman:''' '''Upgrading is compulsory.'''\ |
| 111 | '''President of Britain:''' What if I refuse?\ |
| 112 | '''The Doctor:''' Don't.\ |
| 113 | '''President:''' What if I refuse?\ |
| 114 | '''The Doctor:''' I'm telling you, ''don't''.\ |
| 115 | '''President:''' ''What happens if I refuse?''\ |
| 116 | '''Cyberman:''' '''Then you are not compatible.'''\ |
| 117 | '''President:''' [[TemptingFate What happens then?]]\ |
| 118 | '''Cyberman:''' '''You will be deleted.'''''[kills him]'' |
| 119 | * In ''Series/LaFemmeNikita'', not to be confused with ''{{Series/Nikita}}'', this is part of the NecessarilyEvil [=MIB=] organization's MO. By the time they've tried to recruit you, [[HeKnowsTooMuch you know too much]] to be allowed to walk away. ''Even the leader'' wasn't always the leader, and was brought in by basically being kidnapped, and can't ever show himself to the people who know him as plain old "Paul Wolfe" instead of "Operations" again. Which means ''even someone who lived it eventually came to believe it necessary.'' |
| 120 | * ''Series/GameOfThrones'': |
| 121 | ** One of the recruitment methods of the Night's Watch is offering an alternative to prisoners facing a death sentence. |
| 122 | ** Qhorin Halfhand hints to Jon that they will both die unless Jon invokes this with the wildlings. |
| 123 | * ''Series/HouseOfTheDragon'': |
| 124 | ** During TheCoup of the Green faction to crown Aegon, several lords who are present in King's Landing are coerced into swearing fealty to Aegon. Two of them who refuse are taken away to an UncertainDoom and one of them, Lord Caswell, who swore fealty but was about to leave King's Landing to warn Rhaenyra, gets hanged at the Red Keep. |
| 125 | ** Daemon Targaryen coerces two Kingsguards into joining the Black faction rallying behind Rhaenyra by threatening them to be incinerated by his dragon Caraxes shall they refuse, with Caraxes by his side. |
| 126 | * ''Series/GoodTimes'': This is why Micheal joins a gang. Quote paraphrased. |
| 127 | -->''"They asked Johnny to join and he didn't, so they broke his arm. They asked Willy to join and he didn't, so they broke his leg. Then they asked me to join, and they were looking at my neck."'' |
| 128 | * ''Franchise/MarvelCinematicUniverse'': |
| 129 | ** In the ''Series/AgentsOfSHIELD'' episode [[Recap/AgentsOfSHIELDS2E3MakingFriendsAndInfluencingPeople "Making Friends and Influencing People"]], Ward explains that this is HYDRA's policy, particularly towards [[DifferentlyPoweredIndividual Gifted]] people. If they don't serve HYDRA, they're seen as a threat, and exterminated. |
| 130 | ** ''Series/Daredevil2015'': James Wesley tries to threaten Karen Page into backing off on her investigation into Wilson Fisk with the offer of a "job", then threatens her life when she makes clear she will not budge. [[TheDogBitesBack Karen grabs his gun and shoots him to death with it]]. |
| 131 | ** ''Series/LukeCage2016'': Diamondback crashes a secret meeting of gangsters in Colon's Gym and kills all of the bosses, with the exception of Mariah, Shades and Domingo. He tells Domingo that he's being spared to send a message to the other gangs in Harlem: either they buy from Diamondback, or he'll kill them. |
| 132 | * ''Series/TheLordOfTheRingsTheRingsOfPower'': Adar releases Arondir from imprisonment so he could deliver his terms to the Southlanders who took refugee in the Ostirith watchtower: Adar will allow the Southlanders to live if they forsake their claim to the lands and swear fealty to him, otherwise, he will kill all of them. |
| 133 | * The [[AscendedToAHigherPlaneOfExistence Ori]] in ''Series/StargateSG1'' convert followers this way. Anyone who refuses the teachings of Origin is assumed to be evil and must be purged. Of course, the real reason is that the Ori are empowered by prayer and simply want more power. |
| 134 | ** Though it turns out that HumansAreBastards: The Ori are made stronger by being worshiped, but they get absolutely ''nothing'' from the corpses of those who wouldn't worship them. They never ordered the atrocities that their human enforcers have carried out. |
| 135 | * This is the choice the British Men of Letters give the American hunters in season 12 of ''Series/{{Supernatural}}''. When the American hunters refuse, the Men of Letters begins to brutally murder any hunter they can find. |
| 136 | * In ''Series/DaVincisDemons'' Season 3, the Ottomans have the citizens of Otranto lined up and being forced to chose between beheading or converting to Islam. This event [[TruthInTelevision did historically happen]], but the Ottomans were not armed with super-advanced inventions made by Da Vinci like in the show. |
| 137 | * This is how [[TheAssimilator the Borg]] operate in ''Franchise/StarTrek'' -- either they assimilate you or they destroy you. And as far as they're concerned, ResistanceIsFutile. |
| 138 | [[/folder]] |
| 139 | |
| 140 | [[folder:Professional Wrestling]] |
| 141 | * At ''CHIKARA Battle of Who Could Care Less'', Wrestling/{{UltraMantis Black}} cut a promo before his match with [=MIYAWAKI=] where he offered him a chance to join the Order of the Neo-Solar Temple as its representative to the Orient. He said that if [=MIYAWAKI=] didn't take him up on his offer, [=UMB=] would follow him back to Japan, kill him and destroy the nation's whaling industry. He ended by invoking the trope word for word.[[note]]For the record, [=MIYAWAKI=] won.[[/note]] |
| 142 | [[/folder]] |
| 143 | |
| 144 | [[folder:Tabletop Games]] |
| 145 | * Creator/GamesWorkshop games: |
| 146 | ** ''TabletopGame/WarhammerFantasy'': |
| 147 | *** Vlad Von Carstein's catchphrase was "Surrender and serve me in life, or die and slave for me in death". Those who chose not to surrender to him discovered he was as good as his word. |
| 148 | *** Thanks to the BanOnMagic, when the Imperial [[WizardingSchool Colleges of Magic]] find a promising hedge wizard or other illicit spellcaster, they generally give them the choice of an apprenticeship or the [[BurnTheWitch pyre]]. |
| 149 | ** ''TabletopGame/Warhammer40000'': |
| 150 | *** A common joke about the Imperial Guard (though not all worlds actually use conscription). |
| 151 | ---> Join the Imperial Guard or die. ''Then'' die. |
| 152 | *** The Tau Empire are sometimes considered to be the "[[BlackAndGrayMorality nicest]]" faction in the setting, because they offer this choice. If anyone else attacks your world, chances are they just offer "[[AbsoluteXenophobe die]]" or in the case of Chaos and Dark Eldar, "die horribly, get captured and tortured and/or raped until you die, or get your soul devoured, and don't answer because we'll decide for you". |
| 153 | *** The more evangelical forces of Chaos, such as warbands of the Word Bearers Traitor Legion, will occasionally offer their victims the chance to join the ways of the Dark Gods. However even the nicest way it might develop tend to be FateWorseThanDeath. |
| 154 | ** In ''TabletopGame/{{Necromunda}}'', all enemies captured by the [[TheFundamentalist Redemptionists]] (except [[PsychicPowers wyrds]] and other mutants) are given a choice, to join the Crusade or be burned at the stake as a heretic. The 1st and 2nd Edition rules represented this with the Redemptor Priest's Redeemer special rule where any captive not rescued by their comrades had to roll off against the Priest and became a fanatical Redemptionist if they lost. Any other result saw the captive killed as a heretic. |
| 155 | ** In ''TabletopGame/WarhammerAgeOfSigmar'', the Bloodreaver tribes of Khorne’s Bloodbound partake in a ritual known as [[ImAHumanitarian the Dark Feast]]. Any enemy who were captured alive during the battle are given the choice to either join the Feast as a comrade or become the main course. |
| 156 | * In medieval fantasy game ''TabletopGame/ArsMagica'', Join or Die is policy of the Order of Hermes, if you're a magician the Order considers potent enough to bother with, mostly those who have a sufficient magical defense or offence. They are not, however, the BigBad, usually. |
| 157 | * In ''TabletopGame/WerewolfTheApocalypse'': |
| 158 | ** When the Black Spiral Dancers capture Gaia Garou, they give their captives the choice of [[MindRape traversing the Black Spiral Labyrinth]] or facing execution. |
| 159 | ** In the Time of Judgment scenario in which the Shadow Lords fall to the Wyrm, Grandfather Thunder kills Whippoorwill, leaving the Black Spiral Dancers bereft of a tribal totem. The Shadow Lords demand that the Black Spirals either join their tribe or face execution. |
| 160 | * ''TabletopGame/MageTheAwakening'': The [[SoulEating soul-eating]] Tremere liches sometimes recruit an unwilling member by [[YourSoulIsMine severing their soul]], then letting them choose either to [[DeaderThanDead fade into oblivion]] or to eat a soul and live on through lichdom. |
| 161 | [[/folder]] |
| 162 | |
| 163 | [[folder:Video Games]] |
| 164 | * At the end of ''Videogame/AssassinsCreedRogue'', [[spoiler:Juhani Otso Berg offers you a choice between a Templar Ring or a bullet.]] |
| 165 | * Also used in ''VideoGame/BlazBlue'' for [[spoiler:Litchi. The message is pretty subtle, but Hazama is pretty much saying to her "Join us, or you die by your own corruption while we just toss the cure away."]] |
| 166 | * ''Franchise/DragonAge'': Warden recruits who learn what the Joining involves [[spoiler:intentionally ingesting the darkspawn blood, which is lethal to most and is technically illegal blood magic]], are given two choices: either [[spoiler:take the drink and risk death]], or be killed on the spot because they've seen the Wardens' big secret. |
| 167 | * ''VideoGame/DungeonsAndDragonsOnline'': In the finale of the Sharn Syndicate quest chain, Talon Darsin, the overlord of the Sharn Syndicate in Stormreach, makes this offer to you. And since your goal in the final quest is to kill him, well, no guesses on what your response to him is. |
| 168 | * In ''VideoGame/TheElderScrollsIIIMorrowind'', Mages Guild Stewardess Ranis Athrys has this attitude toward [[WithUsOrAgainstUs any mages who don't join the Guild]]. Several of her quests involve convincing outsider mages to join, and most can be accomplished by simply killing the mage in question. |
| 169 | * The Master makes the Vault Dweller such an offer in the original ''VideoGame/{{Fallout}}'' game. Accepting results in a non-standard game over. |
| 170 | -->'''The Master:''' So what shall it be? Do you join the Unity, or do you die here? Join! Die! Join! Die! |
| 171 | * [[DiscussedTrope Mercedes voices this trope]] in ''VideoGame/FireEmblemWarriorsThreeHopes'' as a {{Deconstruction}} of the DefeatMeansFriendship mechanic in-game. While your army has the ability to recruit certain characters after defeating them instead of killing them, and Mercedes is happy to not have to kill her former friends and classmates, she also notes that it's not much of a choice; you're forcing people to choose between betraying their friends and family or dying. |
| 172 | * In the trailer for ''Videogame/GhostReconWildlands'', the BigBad offers the people a choice. They can either join his drug cartel and receive food, medicine, protection, power, wealth, and the chance to rule like kings...or be ForcedToWatch as he destroys everything and everyone they love. |
| 173 | * ''VideoGame/GrimFandango'' has this exchange between DeadpanSnarker Manny and SassySecretary turned [[LaResistance resistance fighter]] Eva. |
| 174 | --> '''Manny:''' Any messages for me? |
| 175 | --> '''Eva:''' One, join, or die! |
| 176 | --> '''Manny:''' [[DeadToBeginWith But I'm already...]] |
| 177 | --> '''Eva:''' ''Again!'' |
| 178 | * In ''Franchise/{{Halo}}'', this is how the Covenant has traditionally expanded its multi-species empire; any species who don't agree to become at least subservient allies will have their worlds bombarded from orbit until they surrender. In fact, a growing number of the Covenant begin to develop doubts about their genocidal war against humanity precisely because humans were only given the "Die" option. |
| 179 | %%* "[[VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaCDiGames Join me, Link, and I will make your face the greatest in Koridai!]] Or else you will '''[[MemeticMutation DIE!!]]'''" %% ZCE, Quotes and Weblinks by themselves are not examples. %% |
| 180 | * In ''VideoGame/MassEffect1'', Saren's response to Shepard's resistance is this. Join the Reapers - 'cause if you don't, you're guaranteed to die. |
| 181 | -->'''Saren''': Is submission not preferable to extinction? [...] Everyone you know and love, you will all die. |
| 182 | * In ''VideoGame/OverkillsTheWalkingDead'', "Join or Die" is the motto of the main antagonist faction of the game's second half, [[ArmiesAreEvil the Brigade]]. Ambient dialogue suggests they'll often skip straight to the "die!" part for survivors they consider "weak" or "degenerate". |
| 183 | * In ''VideoGame/StarWarsTheOldRepublic'': |
| 184 | ** The backstory of the Sith Inquisitor is that they were a [[MadeASlave former slave]] of the Sith Empire who, after being discovered to be force-sensitive, was naturally given the option to either go to Korriban for [[TrainingFromHell training]] or die where they stand. |
| 185 | ** The law in the Empire is that all Force-sensitives must go to Korriban for Sith training, even if they're too weak to make it as Sith and would inevitably die. The penalty for refusal is death. And in the tie-in novel ''[[Literature/StarWarsFatalAlliance Fatal Alliance]]'', we learn that the penalty for refusing to give your Force-sensitive child to the Sith is also death. |
| 186 | * This is how the Scarlet Chorus recruits in ''VideoGame/{{Tyranny}}''. If the conquer a town or defeat an army, they bring all the survivors together and offers them 'redemption' in the Chorus. Those who refuse are killed on the spot. Those who accept are thrown into a circle with all the other accepters and handed a weapon, with the understanding that [[DeadlyGraduation nobody leaves the circle alive until they've killed at least one other person inside it]]. The surviving half of ''those'' are then offered a place in the Chorus as frontline troopers, with the unfortunate 'candidates' at that point being either so well and truly traumatised or already so psychopathic that they're a perfect fit for the Chorus. |
| 187 | * ''VideoGame/{{Vanquish}}'': In the prologue, Zaitsev threatens the U.S. to join their Russian forces, or else they will fire the microwave energy array like they did with San Francisco. |
| 188 | * The standard recruitment technique for the Ganglion in ''VideoGame/XenobladeChroniclesX'' when it comes to the races that make up their ranks. The Prone and the Marnucks in particular were fighting planetwide civil wars on their homeworlds, and the factions that joined the Ganglion were the ones they treated leniently. The Wrothians were even subjected to a planetary blockade until they agreed to join them. |
| 189 | [[/folder]] |
| 190 | |
| 191 | [[folder:Visual Novels]] |
| 192 | * The first Bad End of ''VisualNovel/FateStayNight'' happens if you have Shirou refuse to participate in the Holy Grail War. As a result, he gives up his Command Spells, breaks his contract with Saber and forcing her to find another Master, and Rin has no further reason to associate with him, leaving him vulnerable to Illya and Berserker's attack on him when he attempts to return home, [[FateWorseThanDeath becoming Illya's immortal torture plaything for as long as she wants]]. When Shirou tells her that he's not in the Holy Grail War anymore, she bluntly tells him that she doesn't care. As we find out later, Illya really wants Shirou to suffer [[spoiler:as revenge for their father supposedly [[ReplacementGoldfish replacing her with him]]]], which we don't find out until Illya's DefeatMeansFriendship HeelFaceTurn later in the route, so Shirou would have been unsafe for the entire Holy Grail War regardless of his participation or not as long as Illya was still alive and evil. |
| 193 | [[/folder]] |
| 194 | |
| 195 | [[folder:Webcomics]] |
| 196 | * ''Webcomic/{{Homestuck}}'' has this in the form of Her Imperious Condescension, fish-alien queen of Alternia. [[spoiler: When her entire race is destroyed by Gl'bgolyb, she rushes back to Alternia in a desperate attempt to find some way to revive her new extinct race, and instead encounters Lord English's servant The Handmaid. After Condy kills The Handmaid, Lord English himself comes and recruits Condy with the promise of reviving her dead race, which she must obey or will be killed violently for refusing.]] |
| 197 | * ''Webcomic/TheOrderOfTheStick'': Samantha the bandit soceress tries to recuit Miko as a minion using this method. Miko declines and kills Samantha instead. |
| 198 | * ''Webcomic/TrueVillains'' has the NominalHero Sebastian try to vanquish the DiabolicalMastermind Xaneth Antares, only to be subdued and offered a job instead. He flips to VillainProtagonist on the spot. Xaneth also has insurance of Sebastian's loyalty in the form of [[spoiler:a StableTimeLoop from his patron God of Knowledge.]] |
| 199 | -->'''Sebastian:''' And what's in it for me?\ |
| 200 | '''Xaneth:''' Oh, this is the fun part. You learn how to fight better, you learn all the tricks of the villainy trade, including how to be an insufferable prick. You learn how the dungeon works, [[BetterLivingThroughEvil you get a small cut of whatever loot we get]]... And... I don't rip your spine out through your skull and tie it as a ribbon on the package containing [[BeatStillMyHeart your still beating heart]] that I will send to your mother along with the message that [[AndYourLittleDogToo she's next]].\ |
| 201 | '''Sebastian:''' ''[Beat]'' So where do I sign up? |
| 202 | [[/folder]] |
| 203 | |
| 204 | [[folder:Web Original]] |
| 205 | * On the ''WebVideo/DreamSMP'', [[Characters/DreamSMPDream Dream]] has this ultimatum for L'Manburg -- either cease fighting for independence or he'll utterly thrash them. They refuse, and as expected, Dream does [[NukeEm exactly what he promised to]]. |
| 206 | -->'''Dream:''' I want to see ''white flags!'' White flags outside your base, by tomorrow, at dawn, or you are ''dead!'' |
| 207 | [[/folder]] |
| 208 | |
| 209 | [[folder:Western Animation]] |
| 210 | * ''WesternAnimation/AvatarTheLastAirbender'': |
| 211 | ** "[[Recap/AvatarTheLastAirbenderReturnToOmashu Return to Omashu]]": [[Characters/AvatarTheLastAirbenderPrincessAzula Azula]] invites Ty Lee to join her on her quest, and at first pretends to accept Ty Lee's refusal but says that she'll stick around the acrobatic performance. During the show, Azula demands the ringleader make the performance as dangerous and intimidating for Ty Lee as possible (first by setting the safety net on fire, and then releasing dangerous animals into the ring). Afterward, Azula tells Ty Lee that [[ImpliedDeathThreat she can't wait to see how she'll top herself the next night]]. Ty Lee then tells Azula she got the message "the universe" was sending her and joins Azula's team. |
| 212 | --->'''Mai:''' I thought you ran off and joined the circus. You said it was your calling.\ |
| 213 | '''Ty Lee:''' Well, Azula called a little louder. |
| 214 | ** ''WesternAnimation/TheLegendOfKorra'': In Book Four, this is [[Characters/TheLegendOfKorraKuvira Kuvira's]] method of restoring the Earth Kingdom to order, though she doesn't threaten -- technically -- to do the actual killing. With bandits rampaging across the countryside and her military the only cohesive force large enough to provide much-needed protection and aid, governors are left with the choice of accepting her authority or watching their state utterly collapse. She also [[ChainedToARailway cuffs a group of captured bandits to a maglev railway]] and provides them with a "choice": either they pledge their allegiance to her, or she'll leave them for the next train. |
| 215 | * ''WesternAnimation/KimPossible'': Gemini tries to force Ron Stoppable to join his terrorist organization of WEE by threatening him with a laser. |
| 216 | * ''WesternAnimation/KipoAndTheAgeOfWonderbeasts'': Near the end of Season 2, Scarlemagne gives the Mutes from all corners of Las Vistas one of two choices: either join him in complete and utter fealty or be made into gold statues. |
| 217 | * "WesternAnimation/LuckyLukeBalladOfTheDaltons": The Dalton Brothers learned their Uncle Henry willed them his whole money [[OnOneCondition if they]] kill the jurors and the judge who sentenced him to death by hanging and ComicBook/LuckyLuke provides testimony confirming they did it. When they approached Lucky about it, Joe Dalton offered the following deal: if he agrees, they'll give him a share of the money; if he refuses, they'll kill him. (Actually, they intended to kill him once the YouHaveOutlivedYourUsefulness kicked in). |
| 218 | * ''WesternAnimation/TheSimpsons'': Parodied. The Japanese commercial for "Mr. Sparkle" dishwashing powder has the eponymous mascot declare to a bunch of attractive models "Join me or die! Can you do any less?" [[MakesJustAsMuchSenseInContext He then uses his magic to turn them into sumo wrestlers, followed by making a two-headed cow crumble like shattered glass.]] |
| 219 | * ''WesternAnimation/TheOwlHouse'': This is [[Characters/TheOwlHouseEmperorBelos Emperor Belos]] attitude towards the inhabitants of the Boiling Isles in relation to his Coven System. Either you join a Coven and get branded with a Coven Sigil, or you will spend the rest of your life on the run from the law as a Wild Witch, with death by [[TakenForGranite petrification]] being a very real and in fact likely consequence of your choice. As it turns out, this attitude is because he is a human {{Witch Hunter}} and wants to use the sigils to [[FinalSolution kill all life on the Boiling Isles]] and thus not getting branded means you escape his attempted genocide. This attitude also extends to his fellow humans, as any human who sides with the Witches and Demons against Belos, or especially if they fraternize with them will be immediately dismissed by the Emperor as having been "corrupted" by the Boiling Isles, at which point he promptly attempts to murder them as both Luz and Belos' older brother Caleb learned the hard way. |
| 220 | * ''WesternAnimation/XMenEvolution'': When the X-Men offered Rogue a chance to join, she was afraid they'd kill her if she refused (Mystique made them look like the bad guys to drive her to her side). Once she learned they wouldn't, she was more willing to hear them out, and finally joined once Mystique [[KickTheDog kicked one dog too many]]. |
| 221 | [[/folder]] |
| 222 | |
| 223 | [[folder:Real Life]] |
| 224 | * A saying among drug lords or gangs in Latin America was "Plata o Plomo" (Silver or Lead). It meant you could either take a bribe, or take a bullet. |
| 225 | * UsefulNotes/GenghisKhan and his Mongol Empire made this ultimatum to the inhabitants of the conquered areas. Some people wouldn't surrender - and the Mongols' harsh retribution [[MakeAnExampleOfThem is probably the reason why most people did]]. |
| 226 | * [[BoxedCrook Conscription]] is in essence this trope. Whether or not death is involved depends on the conscripting government. Even if one objects to military service, the bosses usually find something else for one to do. Summed up, in relation to the Soviet Union, by historian Robert [=O'Connell=]. |
| 227 | -->''The people knew that if they didn't work they would die. And they would die in a particularly horrible way. They might die of German occupation. Or partisan retribution. Or Soviet coercion. Or starvation. It was "work or die".'' |
| 228 | * If a missionary (of any religion) comes with a militia, you can expect this to happen. |
| 229 | * When Spain was conquering parts of the globe like the Inca and Aztec empires, they got a lot of the natives to convert to Christianity this way. Under Spanish law at the time, slavery was legal, but only if the slaves weren't Christian. So people were given a choice, abandon their customs and religious beliefs or be MadeASlave. |
| 230 | [[/folder]] |
| 231 |
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/context.php
FollowingContext Main / JoinOrDie
Go To
- Show Spoilers
- Night Vision
- Sticky Header
- Wide Load
