Main Fallen Hero Discussion

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03:10:10 PM Jun 15th 2015
"Subverted with Bret Hart in 1997, who only turned against the American wrestling fans, but was still considered a hero in the other territories."

Hometown Heroes often get cheered in-spite of being Heels. I'm quite uncomfortable with the notion that he was in fact considered a good guy to non Americans. He was cheating to win and he said some blatantly Homophobic things about Shawn and HHH.

I find it kind of funny actually. Canada is normally thought of as a much more Liberal country then America. But because of Bret Hart's legacy and the nature of his feud with Shawn Michaels. IN the context of Wresting Canada is thought of as more Conservative.
12:23:58 AM Feb 26th 2012
What distinguishes this from vanilla Face–Heel Turn?
10:42:45 AM Mar 4th 2012
I think this is more like a subtrope of Face–Heel Turn.
08:47:56 PM Oct 30th 2011
I may not know the full story, but when was Lucifer ever a hero? I know he was the light bearer and an angel until he turned from God but when did he do heroic stuff? He always just seemed more like a fallen angel to me...this is more related to the Page's Image than the actual example, if it is listed as one.
05:06:28 AM Mar 11th 2011
edited by ccoa
This example is so full of Thread Mode Natter and Justifying Edits that it's impossible to tell if it's actually an example of the trope. If someone would like to clarify it and return it to the page if it's actually applicable, please do so.

  • Warhammer 40,000 has an entire race of these, the Chaos Space Marines. Dark Eldar would qualify, if they'd been remotely heroic before their fall.
    • A clarification: The Dark Eldar survived the fall by being so virtuous and pure that they were immune to being eaten by daemons, but anybody who was raised in a pleasure-seeking cult that sacrifices sentient beings just for the thrill is pretty much automatically disqualified from heroism.
      • Correction, the Dark Eldar survived the fall by bribing the daemons with other souls.
    • The Dark Eldar actually have an army unit composed entirely of newly-minted Fallen Heroes, if the implications in 3rd edition are to be believed. This unit would be the Incubi: supposedly, they were once Eldar Striking Scorpions that have left their shrine for one reason or another. The first Phoenix lord of the Striking Scorpions, Arrha, was known to have abandoned his shrine in order to follow some being through a Webway portal while in Dark Eldar territory, potentially making him the first Incubi.
      • Not anymore they're not, they've always been an order of Blood Kights.
      • The Eldar book describes him as "burn[ing] with the dark light of Chaos", so if he isn't an Incubus, he's something worse.

This is X, Just...X and potholes an author without mentioning the work:

This is a duplicate example:

Not an example of the trope, since he was never a hero and the game makes that clear from cutscene one:

  • Master Xehanort from the Kingdom Hearts prequel, Birth By Sleep. At the beginning, he's still a respected Keyblade master, but the fact that he shares a name with the future Big Bad is a pretty big warning sign....

Also X, Just...X:

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