Magic: The Gathering

No time right now, sorry.

'Kay then.

Would love to, but I am now at work, The Land That Cockatrice Forgot.

Did you guys seriously forget affinity decks? Just drop some Memnites and Ornithopters besides the mana artifacts and you'd at least be able to play.

Affinity really wants artifact lands to work. You could probably do it without, but it wouldn't be very good.

I dunno how well it would work, but it's not like affinity needs to be as powerful as it is right now for casual.

There's also Elvish Spirit Guide (or Simian Spirit Guide if you're into that sort of thing).

I know a guy who runs a somewhat dangerous Charbelcher deck with only two lands in it.

Why even the two? Does he have tutors or deck manipulation?

edited 11th Jul '11 6:25:21 PM by Gelzo

It's not like I memorized his decklist, dude.

Well, I guess we know you're not a Johnny or a Timmy now...

Some people consider 1 or 2 land belcher variants more robust, or just think Land Grant is fun to use.

Hmm... there's a Standard PTQ on the 30th here in Seattle. I wonder if it's worth trying out with my Pyromancer / Exarch Twin cards.

Oh hey! Mindslaver is a budget card now! When did that happen, or am I just slow?

edited 11th Jul '11 8:47:38 PM by Gelzo

Might be fun. You'll have to build an Extended deck if you qualify, but I suppose that would be a reasonable sacrifice for, you know, being on the Pro Tour and stuff.

Edit: Was Mindslaver ever really all that expensive? I remember it being in the $6 or so range before it was reprinted.

edited 11th Jul '11 8:48:56 PM by Nyktos

Gelzo, pure Twin's very much worth a shot. I wouldn't go Pyro Twin because it dilutes the potency of both strategies, but only playtesting will determine that for sure.

If you need a playtest partner, I can help run your deck through gauntlets if you wish. Best time for me to playtest would be late night weekends.

I don't expect to be anywhere near winning, but yeah, an invite would be pretty boss. It'd be a bit more of a sacrifice to take time off from classes than making a new deck.

...so it would be a good thing that my classes start late September and the PT is early September.

Hmm... I think I was just making assumptions on Mindslaver based on its mythic rarity and the fact that the moneybags players mentioned it a lot.

Anyway, I have a hard time getting motivated to do chores, so I'll post my 75 for 7/15 Standard Pyromancer.

• 4x Scalding Tarn
• 4x Halimar Depths
• 5x Island
• 8x Mountain

• 4x Pyromancer Ascension
• 4x Lightning Bolt
• 4x Burst Lightning
• 4x Preordain
• 4x Ponder
• 4x Gitaxian Probe
• 4x Mana Leak
• 3x Into the Roil
• 4x Spell Pierce
• 2x Call to Mind
• 1x Red Sun's Zenith
• 1x Blue Sun's Zenith

Sideboard

• 4x Splinter Twin
• 4x Deceiver Exarch
• 2x Dismember
• 2x Pyroclasm
• 3x Negate

It's still in the works, I guess. For instance, I'm considering Dispel over Negate in the sideboard, but I don't think I want to be any weaker to discard effects than I already am. Not sure about the mana, but it's never been a huge obstacle for me, or at least not one I can measure well myself. And I know the Zeniths are a little wacky, but I like the idea of a copiable semi-recurrable X burn spell to use in case the game goes on long and instant card draw in case I don't want to use my answers on what my opponent played that turn. I just think they might have a good synergy with the deck and I want to try it out.

The only cards I don't have are three more copies of the Exarch, but considering Twin is a rare and you need both for the combo, it shouldn't be that hard to find. Though I'm wondering how much the lack of Spellskite hurts the Splinter Twin sideboard. I also see Tectonic Edges used in some lists. Maybe I should try trading for some? I guess it'd be nice to be able to kill Valakuts and manlands with it.

Also, I'm not sure I know when it's appropriate to side in the alternate combo. I guess it's pretty obvious I should if for some reason they have obvious graveyard and enchantment hate, but past that, I'm not sure. Should I just try to use the sideboard to trip them up on whatever I think their sideboard strategy for hate is?

Thanks, but I think I'll be able to do that in person with a lot more people now that I'm in Seattle. I might still take you up on that, though.

And yes, I'm aware of how silly it is to have both combos in the deck at once. I guess that wasn't clear from my earlier post.

I kinda thought about just going for maindeck Twin and maybe not even playing the Ascension at all, but that means I need more ten dollar cards like Spellskite and babby Jace.

edited 11th Jul '11 10:32:52 PM by Gelzo

I wouldn't worry about your Valakut matchup too much. Twin goes infinite much faster than Valakut does, so if you just keep them off their ramp you should be fine.

Not having Spellskite will be a bit of a problem, as it's there to eat Dismembers, Doom Blades, and Into the Roils on turn 4. That said, other removal spells include Go For the Throat, Celestial Purge, and Combust, so it's not as bad as you might think.

Also, just use Tezzeret's Gambit instead of Blue Sun's Zenith - draw 2, then proliferate the ascension for three mana. Good deal. Edit: If you want to play Twin, just use Jace's Ingenuity or Foresee instead. Foresee digs you 6 cards, Jace's Ingenuity is instant speed draw. Your choice.

As for sideboarding, we see Twin so much that we just board for Twin if we see UR in game 1 no matter what. If we also consider that all of the stuff that's good against Pyromancer is also good against Twin (Duress, Inquisition, Flashfreeze, Celestial Purge, Nature's Claim, Memoricide, Extraction, etc.), we can come to the conclusion that having a transformational sideboard doesn't really improve your odds. My advice? Stick to one or the other and gear your sideboard to better fight the matchups you expect.

edited 11th Jul '11 11:38:14 PM by Fifthman

Creature removal is one thing that becomes useless against Ascension. What if I keep the Ascension in the sideboard instead of the Twin combo in case I hit something with too much removal to deal with?

And I think I realized that I'd really want to have Spellskite in a mirror match so I can potentially steal a Splinter Twin or two. (Heh, that would be a nice position. Once they get removal for the Spellskite, I can just tap it for a token and redirect it there.)

Hmm... On second thought, it might not be great to have Ascension as a transformation, because the way I see it, Twin doesn't appreciate 4-ofs quite as much since doing all that digging means it's going to be nice to be able to pick out different answers. I guess I might try it out just for fun.

edited 12th Jul '11 12:32:29 AM by Gelzo

Yeah, that's basically the reason that people like to play Twin as a transformational sideboard for Ascension: if they don't see it coming, you probably get a free win against non-blue decks game 2 when they take out removal, and if they do expect it, you get to play mind games as to which deck you're going to be playing.

Most players don't take out removal for Ascension anymore. That used to be the case when Twin wasn't in the format. Now that it is, most players are more scared of Twin than Ascension, and the cards that we board in are useful against both decks anyway. Black pulls out Black Sun's Zenith for Memoricide or Surgical Extraction, White pulls out Day of Judgment and hard counters for Celestial Purge, and Green just boards in more Nature's Claims. The opponent's chances improve no matter what form you transform to.

Looks like my best bet for a good deck is to either work on Pyro or spend money to get Twin working...

Ugh.

Maybe I should see about trading Chandra for some Spellskites...

Speaking of Chandra, I just realized what she's good for: Ponza! Just think about it: she kills weenies and she copies your Stone Rains. What's not to like?

Too bad the likelihood of Wizards ever printing enough LD for Ponza to be a good deck again is approximately 0.000001%, but hey, there's always Modern, right?

Here's a list that I think is a little more likely.

• 4x Scalding Tarn
• 4x Halimar Depths
• 8x Island
• 8x Mountain

• 4x Splinter Twin
• 2x Foresee
• 4x Deciever Exarch
• 4x Ponder
• 4x Gitaxian Probe
• 4x Mana Leak
• 4x Into the Roil
• 2x Spell Pierce
• 2x Dispell
• 4x Spellskite
• 2x Preordain

Sideboard

• 2x Dispel
• 4x Flashfreeze
• 2x Dismember
• 3x Pyroclasm
• 2x Negate
• 2x Spell Pierce

I didn't put a lot of thought into this one quite yet, but my laptop's battery is running low.

I think since a lot of the spells available to me are generally the same, I can just put down numbers of the sorts of cards I want and then decide from there.

Roughly speaking, I guess I could do 24 land, 8 combo, 4 spellskite, 7 counterspells, 4 removal/bounce, 10 digging spells, 3 other?

I see some lists using Augury Owl and Calcite Snapper, so those are options.