Type-Moon: Fate/stay night, Tsukihime, and Kara no Kyoukai discussion

Bottom line: it's lame.

This Archer is not Shirou Emiya. He only has his looks, abilities, personality and memories but of course no traces of Shirou Emiya are left.

Yeah, the basic gist of it is that EXTRA!Archer is an alternate Shirou who went down a slightly different path, and ended up embodying nameless heroes in the Moon Cell as the No Named Heroic Spirit instead of becoming the Counter Guardian EMIYA.

In other words, both are similar existences, but not just "the same guy summoned into a different war".

From the ways he acts and the things he recollects about, he's clearly still Shirou. The lost of the identity of "Shirou Emiya" happened before he became a Heroic Spirit, and the Counter Guardian probably went through something similar.

edited 19th May '15 10:47:37 AM by Otherarrow

Still sounds like giving an obtuse answer so you can technically say The Archers in Extra is a 'different' character

since they went through the trouble to make a new Saber and Caster... they just happen to have Archer and Gil be different takes on the character instead of making two new Male playable servants

Illya ready to serve!◊

This is Nasu, he loves his obtuse answers.

Sorry for the double post, but a thought just occurred to me.

So, part of the reason Sion ends up in Misaki Town is because she is seeking out Arcueid in order to get a cure for vampirism, as she was bitten by Night of TATARI in the backstory and is basically on borrowed time before she turns (likely prolonged by her own knowledge of stuff, but I wouldn't know). So...is Sion ever cured, or is she still going to turn into a vampire eventually?

If I recall, the Sion TATARI scenerio is basically an alternate timeline where she succumbs to her vampirism during the events of Melty Blood itself and the scenerio continues into Actress Again, so I'd presume that the threat of Sion turning is still present in AA, right?

edited 19th May '15 7:36:09 PM by Otherarrow

Well seeing that would require being past Melty Blood

which would require gising focus to the Tsuk side of things...

It is currently unresolved

Until we get that Metroid Vania game of Arc and Alrouge finally throwing down

Take to long on Arcs route and Sion succumbs and becomes Dust of Osiris!

Digging into it, Arc basically tells her that there is no cure. So yeah, Sion becoming a vampire is apparently inevitable, and it seems no one really cares.

Hooray! Melty Blood ends on a bittersweet note!

...and we will likely never get any elaboration on this, since Melty Blood is more or less over and Tsukihime is never getting any sort of follow up (not to mention, it seems the popular perception of the Melty Blood originals seems to be shifting to view them as gag characters anyway. Maybe that's just me)

It's more of a willpower thing. So long as she doesn't give up she won't turn, but it's pretty painful, apparently.

Stupid site gave an error message but posted anyway.

edited 20th May '15 10:42:20 PM by Arha

She could get a Blade Outfit

Willpower, huh? Seems like bit of a cop out.

Remember kids, if you are ever bitten by a vampire (whether sentient phenomenon curse thingy or otherwise), you won't turn as long as you have a strong will! Don't give up! Unless you like being a unholy blood sucking abomination!

Don't. Give. Up~

Isn't Sion suppose to be an Alchemist... she could make drugs and supress it...

Then she would be Blade!

The implication I got was that she did prior to Melty Blood (which is, what, a few years after she was bitten?).

Also, if Sion is an Egyptian alchemist who apparently has some sort of renown despite her family's fallen status (if I recall, Dust of Osiris was able to gather resources and influence by basically posing as her...yes, as her own past self, shush)...why does she end up living in a back ally in Japan?

You'd think she'd just go home after the Night of TATARI and Dust of TATARI things ended. Is there any reason for her to stay?

Shiki

Harem Magnet

Man, that's a boring answer. Shiki is boring.

Seriously, I get that he's the protag of a Visual Novel and all, but...geez, Shirou only gets to that level of harem having in gag stuff; in canon, he has at most Sakura, maybe Rin (and even then, Rin wears the pants). You know, since Saber ain't around.

And Shirou is actually interesting! Shiki is basically a teenager. Why is everything with boobs falling for him?

...Sorry. Anywho, if the Tsukihime 2 prequel stuff is still canon, Shiki is going to go off vampire hunting with Arcueid eventually, so that removes Sion's sole reason to live as basically a sewer rat.

UBW Good End a.k.a. the Threesome End.

It's been mentioned before, I think, that that's not Shirou's harem, it's Rin's.

Oh, that's definitely Rin's harem but Shirou is still a part of it.

Yeah, plus it's maybe not canon probably?

I still dunno how that works.

The way I think it, the Second Magic means they're all canon. Sure, there's Nasu's comment about the one Zelretch observing would become canon (the fact that he appears in HF doesn't count) but that's probably the only time I'd ever ignore Word of God because that makes absolutely no sense.

HA may or may not have introduced the fact that magic bullshit merged all the routes together.

Or maybe that's just what everyone thinks happened, to hide what is really happening to cause everyone except Kotomine to reappear alive.

Or maybe it did happen, and HA's actual plot just happened to do something similar temporarily.

I honestly don't know. I'm just going to throw up my hands and assume none of the routes happened and the canon route was Ilya route. Like how the canon route of Tsukihime is apparently Satsuki route.

I think it's safe to assume that the events of HA didn't actually happen simply because, if it did, then the future events of any given route that we know about (like Shirou reaching Avalon or Rin dismantling the Greater Grail with Waver) absolutely couldn't happen. Or, if those event's did happen, then they meddles with timelines that were similar to the routes of FSN but not necessarily the same ones.

A theoretically unlimited number of alternate universes lets you do shit like that.

I just assume that HA happened, but all the timeline merging stuff is a red herring and when the dust settles, it's a Servant-less world where the details are vague enough that no one will ever know which route is canon.

And then Shirou goes to England and it all becomes irrelevant anyway.

I really didn't get the vibe that UBW good was a harem. Saber has no attraction to Rin.

I also wouldn't say Rin wears the pants when she's so smitten by Shirou and gets easily embarrassed by him.